110 replies to this topic

[Ngamok]

MeiSooHaityu, on 15 August 2013 - 07:58 AM, said:

LRMs aren't useful? I have been using them on my Cat C1 now and I think they are doing more work for me then my SRMs did.

I used to avoid LRMs as a PUG due to the lack of reliable fire support per drop, but now with the 12 V 12 drops, I think they are pretty descent (even as a lone PUG). Seems like there is always a mech in the open to rain death on.

Heck, with this 12 v 12 drop system, I think LRMs are finnaly more useful.

They weren't so useful in 8v8 because of any team with more than 1 ECM almost makes you wish you had a spotter with TAG. They are super useful in 12v12 because not all 12 people are under the ECM umbrella. But if you get teams with more than 2 ECM then you are sitting waiting for targets again. They are super useful, just the OP didn't get on any good teams with spotters or too much ECM on the other team. It happens.

[Tezcatli]

LRMs themselves are fine. It's the way they implemented ECM in my opinion that is the problem.

If you team up with someone that has tag. It can be nightmare for enemies. I know because it has happened to me. But that requires someone become your tag monkey. Not everyone wants to do that.

I run an LRM15 with an SRM6 and medium lasers on my trebuchet. In the event there's a traffic jam on a narrow area. I can still fire over the shoulders of my allies or soften up an enemy as I get near. It is a little eh in terms of actual damage done. Especially with all the AMS. But it's probably the most diverse build I run on my mechs.

[Modo44]

In my experience, LRMs are pretty effective when you do not rely on team mates to do all your spotting/targeting, and if you close the distance to make your support weapons do some work. In other words, grow some balls.

[Lightfoot]

I am, on 15 August 2013 - 09:08 AM, said:

Well said Lightfoot.

That's what he said. But we've all heard that before too.

I say, "Cry, havoc! And let slip the Dogs of War." ..... or LRMs as the case may be.

[Suko]

I think LRMs are in a fair spot right now. I do think they're underwhelming when used moderately. You really do need to be boating 40+ to make it work. And I do think the flight times could use an increase in speed. On some maps I don't even bother to fire them, because I know that a locked enemy is quickly going to get dropped, causing my missiles to be a complete waste.

Contrary to some of the QQ on this forum; LRMs are NOT "easy mode". They do require some intelligence to use, or else you're just wasting ammo by throwing it into rocks and buildings.

[Tskeet]

General Taskeen, on 15 August 2013 - 09:12 AM, said:

I used to have fun using LRM5's or an LRM10 on Light Mechs, but no more, fun is not allowed. LRMs and ECM were way better in previous Mech Warrior games and thems is just the facts.

This is very correct. In MW4/Mercs, LRM 5/10 made sense. like they did in TT. They acted as harassing weapons and effective measures to make snipers think twice about not running when a lowly Bushwacker closed in.

Now, LRMs are literally only effective when boated in a specialised 'mech.

It's not that easy folks.

[Lightfoot]

General Taskeen, on 15 August 2013 - 09:12 AM, said:

I haven't used LRMs since December 2012 with the introduction of Fantasy Missile Shield On/Off switch ECM. I use all direct fire weapons until a new equipment is introduced called DCM - Direct-Fire Counter Measures. When that happens, I'm done.

I used to have fun using LRM5's or an LRM10 on Light Mechs, but no more, fun is not allowed. LRMs and ECM were way better in previous Mech Warrior games and thems is just the facts.

So true. Where LRMs are concerned, fun is not allowed. We wouldn't want any player mechs hurt by LRMs.

Again though, some mechs are bugged now and do 150% of the rated damage. Your actual test for LRMs would be LRM15's on an Awesome, those are not bugged.

[Ransack]

I guess I am hiding behind rocks and keeping a look out for lights with tag for no reason.

Granted, I havent used anything beyond a single LRM10 lately, but all of the LRM's that I have been dodging and dying to from LRM boats paints a very different picture than what you describe.

[Deathlike]

LRMs are fine.

The thing is that people have not learned to use the UAV and have a dedicated premade-teammate spotter to make it viable.

When people learn to play as a team, missiles are effective when people do their jobs to make it successful.

[Suko]

Kibble, on 15 August 2013 - 09:03 AM, said:

Regularly getting 500-800 dmg a game in my c1 lrm cat. LRMs are wonderful. Don't EXPECT to get a high dmg or kill count. Use them as support/suppression. Switch targets let them see the incomming missles message and they will back up most of the time. Do that swapping back and forth between their team memebers and watch as your team has time to move up.

What's your load out?

I've only gotten 600+ dmg with my LRM Stalker once or twice in the last few weeks, and I'm no slouch of a pilot. If you're "regularly" doing this kind of damage with a mech that's 20 tons lighter, then something is OP as frick with your build and I want to use it too.

Edited by ShadowVFX, 15 August 2013 - 09:28 AM.

[Marmon Rzohr]

I'm kinda in the middle on LRMs. On one hand they're useless in competitive play. On the other hand they can dominate PUG matches.

I guess that if they made the missiles bulldogs (track on their own after lock on) or made their flight speed too fast, they would be simply too powerful. And very frustrating in low-mid lvl PUGs.

I agree that they're marginal, but then again, I can't think of a way to improve them without making them broken.

...perhaps they could up the max range (e.i. 1500) and the min range (240) and up the flight speed. That might make them weapons for "initial bombardment". (no mechs would like to boat em but lots would take some to soften the enemy a bit before engaging)

Just a thought. (that would kind go against BT lore)

[Taemien]

mrbounce, on 15 August 2013 - 09:02 AM, said:

I impulsively bought a Stalker-3F and outfitted it with 4x15 Artemis-LRM and I get good results most matches. I drop PUG, so if my team is hopeless then I get surrounded and crushed. If my team has scouts who can find targets, mid-range guys who can hold locks, then I can wreak huge damage.

I would say I have many hundreds of games experience with brawling, mid range and sniping, and perhaps 10-20 with LRMs and I can say that it's not that hard. It takes situational awareness, positioning, communication, and most importantly that balance between line-of-sight and not getting alpha'd in the face.

I would say that you make a ton of sense. But you are speaking to the MWO community. So it is going in one ear and out the butt in a gross display of flatulence.

Situational Awareness
Positioning
Communication

All great skills. All are things the community refuses to learn and refuses to admit it. Instead they want PGI to fix it so they are less important.

This is why we see people claiming LRMs are pointless. They are using them solo.
This is also why we see people claiming LRMs are OP. They are on the receiving end of 2-4 players working together.

Our lemming community secretly or subconsciously wishes the only viable builds were a bunch of lasers stacked up. And the only viable way to play is a giant circle jerk (get your mind out of the gutter, I mean the circle of death) of 8 to 12 simultaneous 1v1's. Seriously, take every 'balance' change suggested by these people and put it together.. thats what you get. Oh and to put the cherry on top, there's a few "honorable warriors", most clan oriented (not all clanners are like this, but a good portion) that want legs to be invulnerable. They've been clamoring for that for 15 years. Aka, some of our vets are pretty terrible too.

Edited by Taemien, 15 August 2013 - 09:35 AM.

[Tskeet]

Taemien, on 15 August 2013 - 09:33 AM, said:

Word

I just love the game man. I was never a TT guy (I was way too young), I just came in to MW4/Mercs and MC2 and fell in love. Having played shooters, RPGs and strategy games for well more than a decade, you get an affinity for what works in video games.

I'd almost join a unit but I'm not sure if I can continue to play this game so much when it seems like the progress is haltingly slow.

[Kludger]

LRMs finally have a good balance now with 12v12, been enjoying my C1 and even A1 at times depending on what my PUG teammates do and how I position my LRM mech.

It takes some good commitment and strategy to play LRMs, it really pays off if you can standoff the enemy and perform a support role, if you have a team that allows you to do that, and it really goes miserable if you are on your own and trying to fight enemies directly with just LRMs.

This is as it should be IMHO per Battletech.

[Yelland]

2+ LRM boats coordinating are terror, add a good spotter/tagger and you have Evil Dead danger.

1 or 2 boats asking for folks to hold targets is indirect fire support. Not a one man death machine.

Don't fire LRM at 700+ range or uncertain LOS. Just because someone has them locked, in 3-4 seconds they may not. Players cross the open enough that it is worth it to hold onto a volley or 2 for a better result.

From my experience as a solo (PUG) LRM pilot the best range is 180+ to about 550 or so. Beyond that gives target too much time to avoid incoming volley.

Learned a bit about piloting a LRM, I was terrible in the beginning. I have fun with LRM but do not expect to be highly competitive with it in a PUG. I have a few 600+ damage and 3+ kill matches on my STK-3H. Most are probably 300-500, 1 maybe 2 kills. Lots of XL related deaths due to my load out choices.

[Tskeet]

Good advice Yelland ^^

It should be obvious but it's important to note that just because someone _currently_ has a lock, doesn't mean ****

Even if you call to hold locks, a sniper can only hold locks as long as he is out of cover, which is not often. A harasser can only hold locks as long as he is looking at the target which may not be for long, etc

[Prophet0027]

Don't listen to the haters in this thread!! LRMS are right where they need to be, so is tag, and so is ecm. I have been using my 733p 2lrm10's, 1 lrm15 and 2 erppc's. I usually get between 400 and 600 damage every match. They way the game is balanced now, in my opinion, forces people to have more balanced builds, which is a good thing. LRMS are fine, and anyone that says that only people who never use LRMS say they are fine is lying, I use lrms everyday, and I love them. Would everyone like it to go back to LRMwarrior online when there was no ecm? I think not, so stop complaining about LRMS and start complaining about the lack of CW, or hit detection, or Therma Terra's terrible terrian.

[Tskeet]

^^ LRMs are fine but you should change your loadout brah. Just sayin'

[Neverther]

I liked running Hunchback 4SP as mini LRM boat.
XL255, LRM 10 and 15 with artemis, 720 ammo, TAG in head and 4ML in arms.
Fast enough to run around, can do the Brave Sir Robin and shoot backwards at chasers at the same time (except TAG).
Fires missiles in groups of 6 which flies in small formation.

Light mechs feel the 4ML and they hit pretty good as the hunchbacks can shoot 360 and turn fast with bigger engines.

This was before LRMApocalypse.
And before PPCWarrior so side torso exposions werent that bad.

And then this happened: (first match on that mech on the patchday for me)


Ahh the times of confused DDCs at Alpine having no idea who was shooting them...

[Dreamslave]

Your first problem is wasting an Assault platform on LRM-ing. You are an Atlas, You are a the epitome of frontline fighter, damage sponge and huge alpha. You are much too slow to be an effective LRM mech. And btw, if you are ever going to run an LRM mech, one rule of thumb is to always have your own TAG equipped, unless you are in a four or twelve man with people you know and are dedicated to getting you locks.