110 replies to this topic

[Angel of Annihilation]

I do absolutely fire with LRMs on the mechs I use them on and find them quite effective. I also have been on the recieving end of LRMs and also found them quite effective.....at killing me.

Not sure your problem, but I would have to say improper tactics might be the casue. For example I found LRMS work like magic whenever I actually can see the enemy I am trying to fire at. Devestating is the word I like to use in these circumstances to be honest. Also the work really well at around 250-300m where the short flight time means the enemy can't evade them.

Also don't rely solely on LRMs. Mix in some close range usable support weapons so your not useless if someone happens to get inside your minimum range.

To be honest, I think the only people who have issues with LRMs are those that insist on standing back 600-800m behind the fighting where the flight times are so long that the enemy can evade those missiles and/or AMS has a huge amount of time to engage and destroy them.

[Weaselball]

LRM boating is hugely ineffective if you're just going to sit back at the edge of your LRM's max range and hope that a teammate keeps a lock for you during your weapon's 6-7~ second flight time.

Stop being lazy.

Get up to within 400~ meters of your target, get your own lock, and watch as your 60+ LRM's per-volley rip that target to shreds. Stop being a tool that deals no damage because you're too lazy to walk ahead with the rest of the team.

[Master Q]

Weaselball, on 15 August 2013 - 01:09 PM, said:

LRM boating is hugely ineffective if you're just going to sit back at the edge of your LRM's max range and hope that a teammate keeps a lock for you during your weapon's 6-7~ second flight time.

Stop being lazy.

Get up to within 400~ meters of your target, get your own lock, and watch as your 60+ LRM's per-volley rip that target to shreds. Stop being a tool that deals no damage because you're too lazy to walk ahead with the rest of the team.

At 400M, you do realize that ECM is still effective and blocking the shot from locking, right? Might as well stock SRMs at that point, they're more likely to be usable and eat less weight.

"[color=#FFFFFF]When a Mech is hidden by a friendly ECM:[/color]

• Enemy Mechs will have to come within 1/4 the normal distance (200 m instead of 800 m, by default) for hidden Mechs to show up on their battlegrid and HUD."

"Too lazy to walk ahead with the rest of the team"? I'm moving as fast as an Atlas can go.

So let's see:
Minimum Range on LRM is 180M.
Target has to REMAIN within 200M to get lock.

Do you not get how pointless this is? I certainly do.

I doubt you even play this game, I think you're just a troll.

[Screech]

XFactor777, on 15 August 2013 - 12:49 PM, said:

Yea, you're right, brawling with a 100 ton massively armored giant death machine that can carry obscene amounts of firepower and can fire it constantly without pause while simultaneously drawing the entire enemy teams attention is a bad idea.

Yep, that's why you kill them at range. Try not get stuck in the slime trail they leave behind.

[Lightfoot]

LRMs are bugged right now. On some mechs they fire 150% of the actual LRM missile count. If you think they are good now or raining death on you, you are using/being killed by one of these bugged Mechs. If you think LRMs are weak, you are using a correctly functioning LRM Mech.

Like I said though, they have made LRMs the hardest weapon to use so they should reward the user with high damage to targets if they hit. Because you have to maintain reticle contact the entire flight duration to keep the LRMs tracking, LRMs are much harder, riskier, to work with than any other weapon in MWO. Risk = Reward. Reward here would be high damage.

If you want to make LRMs a moderate damage support weapon they need to be fire-and-forget to lower the risk to the user to moderate also. Fire-and-Forget means: You aim, get a lock-on, fire the LRMs, done. The LRMs track to the target with no more assistance from you. This seems to fit MWO's vision of LRMs so make them fire-and-forget. Or keep them the same and make them do direct-fire type damage.

[The6047]

This highlights one of the largest differences between solo pub drops and groups.

I would like to start off by saying that it is unfortunate that missles are countered so hard by OP ECM. On the flip side, missles are OP to those w/o ECM. You can kill mechs at a decent distance w/o ever entering harms way with proper team targeting.

If you solo pub like me it is really a coin toss. So many games where not a single person has ECM and LRMs rain death on all. A team drop will have people deticated to running ECM, duh.

Since 12v12 was introduced pub matches are LRM-warrior. From my perscpective you are way off the mark. I almost feel forced to run a mech with ECM because of how bad it is right now.

My opinion regardless of mech or team is that LRM boating is a boring/no skill way to play. To those who boast of their skill with LRMs, you are not impressing anyone.

[Weaselball]

Master Q, on 15 August 2013 - 01:19 PM, said:

I doubt you even play this game, I think you're just a troll.

You caught me. I don't play at all. I just run up on LRM boats in my ECM mechs and laugh as they log onto the forums and make cry threads.

[Gulinborsti]

Master Q, on 15 August 2013 - 11:11 AM, said:

You do realize that 90% of the time I play brawler, right?

I mastered up the Jenner chassis, the Centurion chassis, and the Victor chassis. Two of my Victors were running snipe-types for a while.

Atlases don't run that way, sad to say. The hardpoints require missile usage. And they're too slow to brawl the way a Victor might with SRMs.



You do realize most of the stock builds, and most of the tabletop builds, for an Atlas use the LRMs as their long range offensive option.

You are soooo wrong about the role of the Atlas and it's brawling capabilities ;-)
It's THE brawler and SRMs are a vicious weapon in close range fights (3xSRM6+Artemis ftw).

[Master Q]

The6047, on 15 August 2013 - 01:28 PM, said:

My opinion regardless of mech or team is that LRM boating is a boring/no skill way to play. To those who boast of their skill with LRMs, you are not impressing anyone.

A moderate portion of LRMs (two 15-launchers, standard build for an RS) is not "boating." But with ECM in the game the way it is, those LRMs become wasted tonnage.

[Joseph Mallan]

Master Q, on 15 August 2013 - 07:43 AM, said:

It's obvious PGI has no intention of ever making LRMs usable.

Played in several matches last night, trying to work my Atlases for a change. The options for an Atlas almost all involve some form of either LRM or SRM loadout.

And then I had an epiphany. I realized: PGI never wants anyone to use LRMs. Ever.

Without exception, the teams I faced were 50% or higher ECM variant mechs. Atlas-D-DDCs, Commando with ECM, Spider with ECM, Raven with ECM, Cicada with ECM. The "Assault" groups were always a set of mechs huddled around an Atlas-D-DDC. The scout groups were ECM'ed to high heaven.

It made a mockery of LRMs. Why even bother carrying them? Sure, I could load on a TAG. But by the time my TAG hits something, and I hold it for long enough to get lock, the enemy has already poptarted or sniped and gone back behind cover. Even when a friendly had both TAG and their own ECM, hoping for a counter+lock to hold for LRM flight times was ridiculous.

Snipe an enemy with PPC, then hit them while their ECM is down? Sure. Except they're still covered by friendly ECMs, and 4 seconds is not long enough for the lock to hold through flight times.

ECM's overpowered nature is what is causing the snipe meta in the game, more than anything else. The ability to carry a riding "off button" for an entire class of weapons is just stupid.

Make it double the lock-on times, or something. But hiding everyone from sensors so thoroughly, functioning as an off-button to an entire weapon class until they're too close to be fired anyways, is making the game terrible.

It isn't PGIs fault in this Q. It's the player's fault. In closed beta LRMs were a powerful force, 2 LRM20s could rack you up a slew of kills and assists. But the brawlers were incensed that they were unable to close with and fight a disciplined LRM team.

So look at your brothers in arms, or i is their doing that has made Missiles a pale imitation of a once great weapon system.

[Royalewithcheese]

Lightfoot, on 15 August 2013 - 01:26 PM, said:

LRMs are bugged right now. On some mechs they fire 150% of the actual LRM missile count.

What mechs are those? Just, um, out of curiosity.

[Joseph Mallan]

Royalewithcheese, on 15 August 2013 - 04:40 PM, said:

What mechs are those? Just, um, out of curiosity.

I'm watching you!

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 15 August 2013 - 04:44 PM.

[Gulinborsti]

Royalewithcheese, on 15 August 2013 - 04:40 PM, said:

What mechs are those? Just, um, out of curiosity.

Carefull, he got CHEESE in his name

[El Bandito]

For the umpteenth time--make GECM be a soft counter--like how GECM is supposed to be.



Also, you might want to watch out for LRM/SSRM whiners. They hate any guided weapons that cause noticeable damage.

[El Bandito]

Royalewithcheese, on 15 August 2013 - 04:40 PM, said:

What mechs are those? Just, um, out of curiosity.

Any and all mechs that has 6-15 slot missile launchers.

[Novakaine]

Weaselball, on 15 August 2013 - 01:43 PM, said:

You caught me. I don't play at all. I just run up on LRM boats in my ECM mechs and laugh as they log onto the forums and make cry threads.

I love when ecm mechs run up to my Stalker and catch a face full of lasers and streaks.
Or chasing em down with LRM's, because most light pilots are too stupid to run out of range.
Which by the way are most of the one's whining about LRM's being to powerful.

[Arcturious]

LRM's are massively under powered right now.

You just have to look at most of the responses in this thread to see why.

My 2x LRM 20's are fine. My 3x LRM15's work great. My 4x LRM10 are awesome etc.

If you run a single LRM10 or LRM15, you can't contribute to the match anywhere near the tonnage used.

LRM10, 3T ammo and a TAG. That's 6 tons as an absolute minimum. You can't hit anything other than a stationary target without Artemis. So 7T. A light uses ECM near you and locks you out completely. So you add BAP. That's 8.5T on a weapon system you will be lucky to get 100 damage with. Not even considering AMS yet.

It is the ONLY weapon in the game currently that experiences this fall off in utility. A single AC2 will always have the potential of 150 damage per ton of ammo. A laser will always do the damage over time on target.

Telling people to just take more LRM's or LRM ammo is missing the fact that they are fundamentally broken right now.

Sure, taking LRM60 plus with over 1000 rounds can do well. So can any other weapons equal to 30 odd tons of equipment!

In the current implementation, there is no use in entire mech chassis that were designed around the use of one or two LRM10 or 15. The HBK-4J, CN9-D and TBT-5J just to name a few.

Two things need to be done. Improve pathing for LRM's so they scatter more randomly across a mech on impact. Increase damage, splash etc. Balance for the utility of a single LRM10.

Then they have to find a way to stop boating of LRM's from simply disintegrating people. They already have a method available, which is proper launch tube implementation. Make it so you can only fire out the tubes, the correct number of missiles. Add a small delay in to represent the reloading and clearing of the tubes to prevent warheads from colliding in the tube and exploding.

Then even if you pack 4x LRM10 into a 10 tube slot, only one can fire at any time. You know, if it was even slightly realistic.

This would then give meaning to mechs like the CPLT-C4, with its 40 dedicated tubes.

It's only rocket science, how hard does this have to be?

Edited by Arcturious, 15 August 2013 - 07:40 PM.

[Sephlock]

Unfortunately there is a significant portion of the community that wants LRMs in mid-flight to go away if they cover their eyes.

[DegeneratePervert]

Atlas is an utter waste if used as an LRM platform... Catapults, Awesomes, and Stalkers do it better. Stick to brawling.

[RickySpanish]

I've had some successful matches stacking LRMs on my Awesomes, the only problem is that as someone else pointed out, in order to make LRMs effective you really do NEED to stack them. That also includes at least 6 tons of ammo and a TAG, not to mention Artemis and BAP. I personally don't run Artemis on my PB because I often fire my missiles from behind cover anyway once the medium range game starts. I also carry an ER-PPC to make D-DC's lives even more miserable.

To the folk complaining about LRM's lack of effectiveness: closing to medium range, and you know, not spurging salvo after salvo into the walls helps.