85 replies to this topic

[Kyle Polulak]

Tell us what you think of the new Medium Mech tweaks!

Spoiler

Blackjack:
Torso Pitch Angle increased to 30 degrees
Torso twist speed increased by 25%
Centurion:
Torso pitch angle increased to 25 degrees
Torso twist speed increased by 25%
Arm pitch angle increased to 35 degrees
Cicada:
Torso pitch angle increased to 30 degrees
Torso twist speed increased by 10%
Hunchback:
HBK-4H, -4J, -4P, -4SP:
Torso pitch angle increased to 20 degrees
Torso twist speed increased by 25%
Arm pitch angle increased to 35 degrees
Max engine size increased to 275
Torso pitch speed increased by 10%
Torso twist angle increased to 125 degrees
HBK-4G:
Torso pitch angle remains at 25 degrees
Torso twist speed increased by 25%
Arm pitch angle increased to 35 degrees
Max engine size increased to 275
Torso pitch speed increased by 10%
Torso twist angle increased to 125 degrees
Kintaro:
KTO-20:
Torso pitch angle increased to 35 degrees
Torso twist speed increased by 25%
KTO-18, -19, -GB:
Torso pitch angle increased to 30 degrees
Torso twist speed increased by 25%
Trebuchet:
Torso pitch angle increased to 35 degrees
Torso twist speed increased by 25%

[Tabrias07]

Wow, it's f*cking nothing.

[arghmace]

Quote

HBK-4G:
Torso pitch angle remains at 25 degrees

It is currently 16 so does it remain at that or is it increased to 25?

[wayoout]

The idea was to give an incentive to use mediums. Not to make mediums better. Meaning a reward type thing like spotting was susposed to be for lights (but is not). Making mediums "better" is not going to give them more armor or more weapons. So since damage is still King this is meaningless!

[Rather Dashing]

[COUGH]HARDPOINT SIZES[/COUGH]

[Vulix]

Would have been nice to see some acceleration buffs too for all mediums. I'm not sure how much the buffs introduced in this patch are going to help. A bit hard to judge when we still don't have tonnage limits nearly 1 year after the game went open beta.

[Tabrias07]

Vulix, on 20 August 2013 - 10:29 AM, said:

Would have been nice to see some acceleration buffs too for all mediums. I'm not sure how much the buffs introduced in this patch are going to help. A bit hard to judge when we still don't have tonnage limits nearly 1 year after the game went open beta.

This. Mediums need better engine scaling/higher caps and higher acceleration. Not torso twist.

[Doctor Proctor]

My HBK-4G already had one of the highest twist ranges and twist speeds around, what it needed was TURN SPEED so that I could actually get behind the Atlas that's twice my tonnage and shooting at me. Unfortunately, because my turn speed is so low, he can usually twist/turn fast enough to keep up with me.

Also, I like using my HBK-4G because of it's AC/20. Using a STD275 means I have to start stripping ammo, stripping backup lasers, stripping armor or dropping from an AC/20 to something smaller in order to make up the extra 3 tons in weight. At that point I'm basically driving a Cent, which I already own. It doesn't really do anything to help the survivability of these mechs or keep them from getting outclassed by Heavy mechs that can mount more weapons, more armor and STILL have almost the same speed.

On a positive note though, the buff to Torso Pitch Angle is actually a good one and will help deal with mechs like Jagers that that like to run up hills knowing that I can't bring my biggest weapons to bear on them when there's even a relatively small height differential.

Edited by Doctor Proctor, 20 August 2013 - 10:33 AM.

[Sable Dove]

I can't speak to the Treb or Blackjack, but this isn't going to help Cicadas (since their CT can be hit from any angle), or the Hunchback (since their RT can be hit from any angle), and what little help it might be for Centurions, it's not going to be much use, because torso turning doesn't help you when enemies are all doing 20-35 damage all at once to one location.

Mediums would have been better server by increasing acceleration/deceleration, and maximum torso twist.

[Farpenoodle]

I can see why a HBK pilot would be happy with these changes. But the rest of the changes for medium pilots seem dubious at best. Accel/decel as well as turning radius buffs would have been far better.

[Butane9000]

Honestly these balancing changes are kind of pathetic. Heavies can be just as fast while still maintaining more firepower and lights are still more agile and fast while having only marginally less firepower.

Stop using movement based quirks as your only option. Start expanding into more unique ways of differentiating mechs. Like having the Hunchback take less damage to it's hunch or the Centurion shield arm taking reduced damage.

Also you only increase the total Hunchback engine size by 15? So you're only giving it a speed boost of 15-20 KP/h?

Honestly mediums need a much bigger boost then this. Tonnage limits should help but we'll see.

[Dunne]

Changing the pitch angles and turning speeds help, but people aren't going to be playing mediums with any competative seriousness until you get Drop Limits into play. Once people can no longer run forces of 6 Assault Mechs, 2 Heavies, and 4 jumping lights, THEN you'll start seeing folks play Mediums, regularly. Then Heavies of all sizes will be the majority on the battlefield. Then folks will play Commandos and Locusts (when they're released) seriously, instead of as gimmik builds or nostalgia.

We need drop-limits; everything else is secondary until that is in-play.

You've had a year. You now have a month.

Get on it.

Chop-chop.

[Xeno Phalcon]

With the exception of the hunchbacks these changes are pretty much nothing what people were expecting, most thought it would be accel/decel and turnrates that would get bumped. Not that I mind more torso twisty speed on my blackjack, already felt very responsive so should be fun.

[Jack Starborn]

For me, nothing has changed. My HBK-SP had std250 engine and will continue to have it. Why will I take bigger engine?
I would have to spend Artemis, double and armor / ammo to fit a bigger engine. Pointless.
However, I will enjoy greater pitch angle (it was ridiculous low) and torso speed twist.

[Alex Wolfe]

I'm glad the mediums will have an important niche on the battlefield at last: shooting up and down ridges with torso-mounted weapons, and wiggling their arms a bit better.

Good going there. Our time has come.

Edited by Alex Wolfe, 20 August 2013 - 11:05 AM.

[Ripper X]

Wow a lot of feedback for something that people haven't even tried out yet. How about being more constructive and actually wait for the game to be back up and try out the new updates before making any comments?

[VagGR]

yeah i tried it...it doesnt make any difference...faster/more tosro twist does not save u from 2ppc/gauss...

[Budor]

More and faster torso twist, now you can choose from which direction youll get 1 shot. Thanks a lot PGI!

[Doctor Proctor]

Ripper X, on 20 August 2013 - 11:00 AM, said:

Wow a lot of feedback for something that people haven't even tried out yet. How about being more constructive and actually wait for the game to be back up and try out the new updates before making any comments?

Normally I would agree with you, however, I can go onto Smurfy with my current STD250 HBK-4G build and remove 3 tons from it to simulate what having a STD275 would be like. The same goes for any of the other Hunch variants as well.

Heck, since I'd probably have to drop the AC/20 anyway, I can pretty much create an approximation of the build on one of my Cents since they have a higher engine cap anyway. So I can see that my loadouts will be MASSIVELY affected since I, like many Hunch pilots, already use a STD250 instead of the STD260 because the extra weight isn't worth the sacrifice in firepower for the small gain in speed. The numbers may be slightly larger, but he fundamental problem is the same.

Also, it doesn't matter how fast my torso twists, it's TURN SPEED that will determine if I can get behind an opponent. And it's ACCEL/DECEL RATE that determines how much fire I'll take if I go around a corner and get spotted by 4 enemy mechs that I didn't know were there and try to reverse course to get back into cover. Since those things won't have changed I'll still have the same problems of getting blown to bits when I make a wrong move since I don't have the speed, firepower or the armor to make up for the mistake. And I'm sorry, but 98.0kph (STD275 speed on my Cent with speed tweak) isn't different enough from 89.1kph (STD250 speed on my HBK's) to make a huge different for a mech that loses 75% of it's firepower when a body part that can be hit from literally any angle gets shot off.

Edit: Tried new tweaks on my HBG-4G now that I got the patch. Basically handles about the same, but we were on River City so I didn't really get to test out the increased Torso Pitch.

Edited by Doctor Proctor, 20 August 2013 - 11:46 AM.

[Ripper X]

Not yet having the chance to try out the new update, I can say that I agree that medium mechs do need a faster turn speed and faster take off and stop speeds. Actually that is what I was expecting really. I am surprised that turned out not to be the case.