77 replies to this topic

[Enigmos]

Yup. Not wearing it out but jeeze, this bad mouthing is just awful. Makes PGI look saintly.

[Kraven Kor]

OriginalTibs, on 30 August 2013 - 08:22 AM, said:

Cool story, bro, but I ain't buyin'. Hyperbolic, angst-ridden vitriol from a smallish subset of the playerbase competing with one another for some undefined trophy for vituperative rhetoric isn't even very interesting. The developer isn't finished, and whether you give them a dollar for space in your hanger doesn't change that. Development stage is still beta, like it or not. Your financial decisions are irrelevant to the development stage of someone else' game development.

Our financial decisions are wholly relevant to a company which would like us to give them money.

We may not be enough to matter, in the grand scheme of things, but only time will tell on that. I certainly see more lambasting PGI than defending them these days. But that alone could be a biased opinion.

Again, time will tell. I still think that PGI somehow managing to win some or many of us back somehow would be beneficial to their bottom line.

[Enigmos]

That your (our) financial decisions are ours should have been a given: not sure why you are making a point of that. My point should have been equally obvious: their game is theirs, but if you want to fork over your dollars to them that transaction is irrelevant to the status of their game. It has nothing whatsoever to do with whether the game is in beta or not.

I'm sure PGI would very much like to win as many of us as possible. But the badmouthing by some of us is radically out of ratio with the flaws left in the game. Is the game perfect? Of course not. Not even PGI's marketing is trying to say it is.

Edited by OriginalTibs, 30 August 2013 - 10:28 AM.

[PictishWolf]

Some of us really care about this game. We really do want it to be successful. We want it to be fun but at the same time, as immersive of a mech simulation as possible. This was what was pitched from the beginning but what we have appears to be quickly devolving into a feature-poor, unbalanced arcade game.

We complain publicly and rage-quit and demand refunds because we're way beyond polite discourse. We tried that for months and months. It all fell on deaf ears. Many logical, well thought out solutions to problems were provided by us but were ignored and instead, we got faulty, game-breaking implementations.

The devs have shown by their actions and their words that they seem to have very little integrity. They are chasing pennies and catering only to what they think will increase the player base. It might get a lot of people to try it but they won't stay. What they fail to understand is that building the most immersive, most balanced, and best looking mech game ever made would give the result they're seeking.

While I have almost lost faith, I still hold onto a tiny glimmer of hope that the devs will have some humility and realize that they have wasted a lot of development time, money, and community goodwill and that their best move, if anything is to be salvaged, is to work WITH us to fix the gaping holes in the game. If they could do that, I'm fairly sure they could rebuild the trust they've squandered and bring this game back from the brink.

Unfortunately, I suspect that won't happen. I expect to mourn the death of this game. Please prove me wrong, PGI/IGP.

[iHover]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 28 August 2013 - 01:30 AM, said:

FORCED to play in 3PV? LOL

I havent played 1 match in 3PV, and it hasnt hurt my scoring or KDR so far.

Anyhow, don't put words in my mouth. I would not cheer for gold ammo. no community warfare? he said we are going to get a demo for launch in the newest update. I'm fairly convinced that Bryan would probably get fired for saying that if it wasnt going to happen 3 weeks from now.

To bad you are so bitter over things with so little impact that continue to remain subject to change though.

Why he didn't get fired for the out right lies he told about 3pv. These folks have No integrity and don't feel compelled to follow through on anything they tell the community.

[Corvus Antaka]

iHover, on 30 August 2013 - 10:46 AM, said:

Why he didn't get fired for the out right lies he told about 3pv. These folks have No integrity and don't feel compelled to follow through on anything they tell the community.

Yeah, thats right. That's why Russ apologized. That's why PGI added a hardcore mode and thought about keeping ques seperated.

If PGI had no integrity, they wouldnt have bothered with any of this. They would have just given us a merged 3PV que, said ****, we changed our minds, and wouldnt have wasted time building seperate ques in case it was in fact necessary to seperate these gamemodes.

A locked 1PV mode, adjustments to current 3PV, etc etc, are all still possible solutions. a few weeks of merged beta testing gameplay before release to find the issues and make a final decision on how to handle the 3PV and 1PV issues seem reasonable enough to me.

There is a much greater lack of integrity amongst the gamers who have turned on PGI with very nasty vitriol, continued lies and unbelievable trolling posts & threads that are way above and beyond what would be morally accepted in any society and is only even possible due to the anonymity of the internet.

3PV is a minor issue, and very rarely it can cost a match. Is this a problem? yes. Do I expect PGI to fix this? yes.

But PGI has fixed many things in the past year. developing a new UI was never on the books, and doing so plus the cryengine bugs that crytek had to fix for this all to work is far beyond what was expected. Such hitches happen when you build new things.

Frankly, I'm impressed PGI has the integrity to keep us informed and to be so forthcoming with their releases. Yeah, PGI is still learning the ropes. They aren't Sony. They didn't have WoW experience to draw on.

But overall, I am certainly much more impressed with PGI for all their failings, than I am with the group of signature trolls that blatantly violate copywrite laws (fair use) by mis-using PGI's company logo in their signatures, by slandering PGI daily, while still continuing to log in and enjoy the game.

If you really had integrity or moral ethics you would leave, or accept that PGI, like any human organization, is not perfect, and everyone makes mistakes and things change. That is life.

[EvilCow]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 30 August 2013 - 11:03 AM, said:

They would have just given us a merged 3PV que, said ****, we changed our minds, and wouldnt have wasted time building seperate ques

Really they would have done something like this?

[Kraven Kor]

OriginalTibs, on 30 August 2013 - 10:27 AM, said:

That your (our) financial decisions are ours should have been a given: not sure why you are making a point of that. My point should have been equally obvious: their game is theirs, but if you want to fork over your dollars to them that transaction is irrelevant to the status of their game. It has nothing whatsoever to do with whether the game is in beta or not.

I'm sure PGI would very much like to win as many of us as possible. But the badmouthing by some of us is radically out of ratio with the flaws left in the game. Is the game perfect? Of course not. Not even PGI's marketing is trying to say it is.

What I am trying to say is, the badmouthing is directly related to the feeling of not getting what we paid for and in fact being scammed / lied to on some level.

Let's face it, Honest Business is kind of a myth in this day and age. So the "paranoia" and "negativity" expressed by many of the raging players right now is something we have come by naturally due to many businesses @#$%ing us over in some way or another at various points in our lives.

It is yet another extension of the whole "world isn't fair" thing. And the world, nay the very Universe, is not fair.

PGI can't be the Saint of the Gaming Industry to lead us all to the promised land. But we can and will attempt to hold them to those promises that are important to us.

This isn't about the game being good, bad, finished, beta, not beta... it is about the feeling that we have been systemically lied to and sold a false bill of goods. I really don't think it was an intentional @#$% you to the BT / MW fans or anything. I think business realities have forced them to this place / position / decision and even if they wanted to magically give us what we believe we were sold, they couldn't, not in any acceptable time frame.

Myself, I would be appeased by an actual heartfelt apology which included a statement that PGI would "return to original design goals," followed by evidence that they were making good on that statement, What that means for me, ultimately, is deeper gameplay and tactics. More command and communication options, more objectives and assymetrical objectives, more maps, more interactivity with the map itself (static defenses, summonable tanks or something), and the aforementioned, and promised, split queues.

In fact, I would be happy if the 3PV drone was just something I could shoot down, mechs had a limited supply of them, and they were subject to ECM. Make it all part of information warfare. Many others, however, would not at all be happy with this.

I have to think there is a way to at least make enough of us happy / content to stop the uproar, and "Sorry, this happened, and will continue to happen regardless of what our customers say" is just not a good way to win back your frustrated customers.

[Lance425]

I wouldn't give children any more information than was necessary either...

[Enigmos]

Well, I will hope that PGI dismantles the causes of anger not by apologizing but by fortis demonstratum proving they were right to make the decisions they have, but I never expect something the artist declares unfinished to somehow be complete anyway. Personally I feel we have been very lucky to be playing it hands-on when we could have been locked out here in the forums begging for a peek even though the game was feature incomplete.

Do I expect they will resolve every problem we have pointed out? Of course not. But when an artist tells me he isn't finished I school myself to avoid passing judgment.

And yes I do very much believe that modern game development is an Art form in the capital A sense of Art.

Edited by OriginalTibs, 30 August 2013 - 12:41 PM.

[Thorqemada]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 30 August 2013 - 11:03 AM, said:

But PGI has fixed many things in the past year. developing a new UI was never on the books, and doing so plus the cryengine bugs that crytek had to fix for this all to work is far beyond what was expected. Such hitches happen when you build new things.

I agree that PGI faced quite some unexpected challenges from both the technical and the psychological side of the game development Business and that some People are on an unfortunate Vendetta against them.

Yet i really do not feel that the current UI is so feature mighty that the necessary development of a new UI 2.0 was unforseeable and wonder how much risk they go to put it so close to the official "Launch" of the game.

Hope it works out!

Edited by Thorqemada, 30 August 2013 - 08:49 PM.

[Nick Drezary]

Gosh, is it like 3 or 4 threads with links to different web resources reporting community riot at one day?

[C E Dwyer]

Alekzander Smirnoff, on 26 August 2013 - 06:37 PM, said:

I only use 3pv on occasion and that is mostly just to peek over things but the fighting is always in 1st. Having arms locked is way too much of a handicap.

This use of 3PV is exactly the reason the core people want nothing to do with 3PV, or want seperate ques,maybe if you stayed locked in what you started with and couldn't switch in game things might have been less agressive..

ie if your going to do what most people reguard as cheating (looking over crests without exposing yourself) then you have to take the map and arm penalty.


but I somewhat doubt it

[Chas]

Well. I've been hanging on, hoping that PGI would give me sufficient reason to keep spending money on this game.

They have, with their actions, given me the incentive to never spend another dime on them.

I'll go give my money to MWT or something.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

That's what I see when I see Panda post.

[A banana in the tailpipe]

pastor of muppets, on 23 August 2013 - 07:09 AM, said:

tumbling down

I wish I could thumb down this post.

[Aeolus Drift]

Nick Drezary, on 30 August 2013 - 04:45 PM, said:

Gosh, is it like 3 or 4 threads with links to different web resources reporting community riot at one day?

Wait NIck, You just noticed this now?