115 replies to this topic

[Khobai]

again you dont know that. its all speculation at this point.

what I do know is that PGI will likely pick the option that lets them monetize the best. So I tend to think each alternate config will indeed be a seperate variant, to force you to buy 3 mechs.

Edited by Khobai, 30 August 2013 - 08:59 AM.

[MustrumRidcully]

Khobai, on 30 August 2013 - 08:58 AM, said:

again you dont know that. its all speculation at this point.

what I do know is that PGI will likely pick the option that lets them monetize the best. So I tend to think each alternate config will indeed be a seperate variant, to force you to buy 3 mechs.

Or they sell them for three times the price?

Omnimech's canonical C-Bill cost are pretty high. You can get a Level 1 Tech Atlas for around 8-8 Million, a Clan 75 ton heavy might require 20 Million.

But would players be willing to spend so much C-Bills or MC?

[VXJaeger]

No it's not. Unbalance is 'cause there is huge gaps between weapons, by both damage- and tonnage based ones.

[Joseph Mallan]

VXJaeger, on 30 August 2013 - 09:35 AM, said:

No it's not. Unbalance is 'cause there is huge gaps between weapons, by both damage- and tonnage based ones.

Well yeah, but wouldn't it be stupid if a 12-15 ton weapon was only as effective as a 1 ton weapon?

Is a 45 as good as a M-16?
Is a M-16 as good as a 50 Cal?
No, they aren't.

This is why we do have the ability to load a mix of weapons on most Mechs.

The basic problem is pin point convergence.

[3rdworld]

Joseph Mallan, on 30 August 2013 - 09:41 AM, said:

Well yeah, but wouldn't it be stupid if a 12-15 ton weapon was only as effective as a 1 ton weapon?

Is a 45 as good as a M-16?
Is a M-16 as good as a 50 Cal?
No, they aren't.

This is why we do have the ability to load a mix of weapons on most Mechs.

The basic problem is pin point convergence.

Yep that convergence is why I keep getting CT cored and no one ever hits anything else.

oh wait.

[VXJaeger]

Joseph Mallan, on 30 August 2013 - 09:41 AM, said:

The basic problem is pin point convergence.

Well too bad if there is good shooters, who got the nerve to wait that extra ½ s before launching to get max effect delivered.

[Joseph Mallan]

3rdworld, on 30 August 2013 - 09:50 AM, said:

Yep that convergence is why I keep getting CT cored and no one ever hits anything else.

oh wait.

Looks like a good amount of missiles and you still lost a Torso... SO there was some solid pin point damage there

VXJaeger, on 30 August 2013 - 09:57 AM, said:

Well too bad if there is good shooters, who got the nerve to wait that extra ½ s before launching to get max effect delivered.

Tell it to the Marines. The kind of Pin Point in this game is not natural to me! And I am a good shot.

[VXJaeger]

Joseph Mallan, on 30 August 2013 - 10:00 AM, said:

Tell it to the Marines. The kind of Pin Point in this game is not natural to me! And I am a good shot.

Whateva, IRL from 600m I shoot left leg from a mosquito and leave its balls intact. Something I learned in military.

[Joseph Mallan]

VXJaeger, on 30 August 2013 - 10:05 AM, said:

Whateva, IRL from 600m I shoot left leg from a mosquito and leave its balls intact. Something I learned in military.

Pics or it didn't happen.

[VXJaeger]

Joseph Mallan, on 30 August 2013 - 10:07 AM, said:

Pics or it didn't happen.

Just fakin LOLled, well played

[Pht]

Renthrak, on 27 August 2013 - 12:31 AM, said:

The very idea that MWO's woes can be traced to a single system is folly.

Actually, the weapons problems CAN be traced back to a single seed.

They originally used the equipment numbers from the TT system (weapons and armor #s) but they didn't use the combat mechanics those numbers were balanced for.

They took those numbers and put them into a combat mechanich that has FAR more weapons hitting any single armor panel the the armor or damage numbers were EVER designed for.

Because of this, people were dying very quickly in closed beta.

So they doubled the armor and internals numbers...

Which threw off the weapons vs armor balance

So they bumpped up rate of fire on some of the weapons ...

Which threw off the weapons vs armor balance in another direction ...

and so on, down to the current ghost heat/desynched gauss rifles, etc.

Unintended consequences in action.

Quote

As for the hardpoint system, there is very little room between additional restrictions and stock-weapons-only, which is no better than no hardpoints at all.

I'll have to heartily disagree:

http://mwomercs.com/...4497#entry54497

There's a rather nice spot in between gunbags and stock-only.

[Khobai]

Quote

Yep that convergence is why I keep getting CT cored and no one ever hits anything else.

Highlander isnt the the best example. Because using jumpjets will get you shot in the legs pretty often.

[3rdworld]

Khobai, on 30 August 2013 - 12:15 PM, said:

Highlander isnt the the best example. Because using jumpjets will get you shot in the legs pretty often.

The statement was sarcasm, and the pick with the absolutely devastated highlander is to show how convergence isn't a problem, as no artificial inaccuracy is needed. Pilots can take care of that themselves.

Joseph Mallan, on 30 August 2013 - 10:00 AM, said:

Looks like a good amount of missiles and you still lost a Torso... SO there was some solid pin point damage there

No missiles. It is simply the 5 Ds

Dodge
Dip
Duck
Dive and
Dodge,

through a twist and JJ in there as well.

Edited by 3rdworld, 30 August 2013 - 01:38 PM.

[AC]

Pht, on 30 August 2013 - 12:09 PM, said:

Actually, the weapons problems CAN be traced back to a single seed.

They originally used the equipment numbers from the TT system (weapons and armor #s) but they didn't use the combat mechanics those numbers were balanced for.

They took those numbers and put them into a combat mechanich that has FAR more weapons hitting any single armor panel the the armor or damage numbers were EVER designed for.

Because of this, people were dying very quickly in closed beta.

So they doubled the armor and internals numbers...

Which threw off the weapons vs armor balance

So they bumpped up rate of fire on some of the weapons ...

Which threw off the weapons vs armor balance in another direction ...

and so on, down to the current ghost heat/desynched gauss rifles, etc.

Unintended consequences in action.



I'll have to heartily disagree:

http://mwomercs.com/...4497#entry54497

There's a rather nice spot in between gunbags and stock-only.

There is indeed a nice spot in between Gunboats and stock-only. If PGI would just add a critical space limitation to each weapon slot, they would prove the same level of customization we have now, but prevent the ultra high damage weapons from being boated.

[Jestun]

No.

The slots are fine, what is being put in them is not.

[Pht]

AC, on 03 September 2013 - 06:51 AM, said:

There is indeed a nice spot in between Gunboats and stock-only. If PGI would just add a critical space limitation to each weapon slot, they would prove the same level of customization we have now, but prevent the ultra high damage weapons from being boated.

Than what should they do about mechs that are boats, in stock form, like the blackhawk?

and omnimechs?

Fixing the 'mechlab will indeed make the game more fun in the long term - it's something I'd love to see - but it won't fix the problem combat mechanic that's causing any weapon that does the most damage the easiest the quickest to utterly domninate.

If / when they "whack" the PPC mole, another mole will pop it's head up.

Edited by Pht, 06 September 2013 - 02:47 PM.