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Timidity Is A Great Tactic!


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#61 Tesunie

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Posted 14 September 2013 - 05:26 PM

View PostJohn Buford, on 14 September 2013 - 03:29 PM, said:



Yup you got it pretty right there about how to win and what you need to do. Kind of why there is the Topic Timidity is not a Tactic, and Follow the Frakking Atlas. When people follow that very simple advice they win and when they don't they loose alot.


There is a time to be "timid" and a time to be "bold". Knowing when to do either action is the key to success on the field of battle. Sometimes, it is best to hold a bottleneck and wait for your foe to jam themselves in. Gain overwhelming firepower against as few incoming fire as possible. Other times you want to hang back, hide or do a poke and "run like the wind".

Different situations require different tactics.

#62 -Muta-

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Posted 14 September 2013 - 05:53 PM

No need to be shy brother.

But some new guys love to take free damage pushing alone, THAT is the BIGGEST and most common reason why noobs die. (I am sure you have seen a noob roaming around the map on a raven which fastest speed is 97 KPh.)

I know they wouldn't have made much of a difference anyways hahaha but yeah that is completely the other end.

#63 Void Angel

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Posted 22 September 2013 - 01:29 PM

The difficulty with waiting for the enemy to channelize themselves in a PuG is that waiting requires you to stop - which is very dangerous, especially without voice coms. Any time you're all moving toward the same direction, the team is more or less focused on that goal; more importantly, they can all see the rest of the team moving with them, so they're much less likely to break when you make contact. On the other hand, if you stop, people tend to become less focused. They look around, spread out a bit... and then when something happens they tend to scatter like cockroaches when the lights come on. It's not deliberate, or even particularly foolish - it's just that when 12 people with minimal direction encounter a situation requiring snap judgement, you're going to get about 12 different responses. This is because not only are they all different people who have not played together, but because they're also seeing twelve different things.

If the PuG is working well, by all means hold up, let the slow people catch up, and type out instructions - but remember that you're taking a big risk doing that in a PuG.

#64 Nick Makiaveli

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 08:55 PM

View PostMutaroc, on 14 September 2013 - 05:53 PM, said:

No need to be shy brother.

But some new guys love to take free damage pushing alone, THAT is the BIGGEST and most common reason why noobs die. (I am sure you have seen a noob roaming around the map on a raven which fastest speed is 97 KPh.)

I know they wouldn't have made much of a difference anyways hahaha but yeah that is completely the other end.


Not everyone has been around long enough to be able to buy a better engine.

And liking your own post just to farm likes? Who does that?

#65 Void Angel

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 09:11 PM

Forum trolls; do not feed.

#66 MandaloreWise01

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 06:49 AM

you know, timidy is what keeps me alive 90% of the time. the other 10% is shooting idiots and PPC sniping

#67 wintersborn

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 10:47 AM

I grew very tired of capping and scouting or marking targets for LRM boats with a early death and no reward for my effort. So I turned my light into a Sniper and scrapper. I will run up and Snipe the first part of the round then fall back to blast off some scrap behind 2 or 3 big mechs or maybe distract a big mech for others.

#68 Void Angel

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 12:15 PM

I've stopped bothering to drop in Conquest mode. In the PuG environment, it simply plays too similarly to Assault - but with the added randomness of being unable to win because the enemy happened to get a faster comp on the random drop.

As far as scouting, you can generally do that without much risk - especially if you have ECM and a seismic sensor. LRM spotting, on the other hand, I wouldn't do terribly much in a PuG. First, because any LRM jockey worth his salt will maneuver to negate the enemy's cover and is perfectly capable of getting his OWN locks - and second, because LRMs aren't much used on the battlefield any more, so you may see several drops without a real LRM boat on either team.

#69 Nick Makiaveli

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 10:50 AM

View PostVoid Angel, on 25 September 2013 - 09:11 PM, said:

Forum trolls; do not feed.


But how else am I to perfect my forum troll poison? Have to test it somewhere.....

#70 Levi Porphyrogenitus

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 11:16 AM

OP - The best way to phrase your proposal is this: Prudence is the handmaiden of Victory.

This is actually a quote from Rome: Total War, when your general has the Doubtful Courage trait. Ever since I had a stupid good general who picked up the trait briefly (I think I overused his bodyguard unit a bit and he ran from battle once; his army won, but he got the trait) that line has stuck with me.

It certainly applies to MWO, even on the unit level. Watching the tournament during the Launch Party, the team that was most patient and most careful in their timing tended to come out ahead. There were several bold moves, but they almost never payed off.

Prudence tends to allow a team to remain relatively fresh. If somebody is jump-sniping, or peek sniping, or doing occasional slashing attacks (Jenners, for instance), then the team that hangs together and coordinates counter fire without getting frustrated and trying to rush or chase the enemy seems to do plenty well. Snipers can get the worst of a trade if their enemy is patient and able to coordinate return fire. Slashing attacks by lights go badly most often when the enemy can focus their fire while the light is engaging and break off (not chase) once he's on the run.

That said, it's worth noting that certain situations call for aggressive maneuvers. Stuck in a tight choke point with a few enemies blocking the way and a bunch of allies backing you up? Push through at full throttle, twisting to spread the damage around, and break the enemy line. Once one mech gets through their whole defense falls apart.

Be warned, though, this only works if there are around a lance or fewer enemies and you have at least parity in numbers. Trying it without enough backup or if there are too many enemies for you to rush through them before they bring you down is a recipe for disaster and an early grave. I also recommend only trying it in something that can move reasonably fast (60+ kph) and has decent armor (larger Mediums are about as light as I'd go for playing line breaker).

#71 Kjudoon

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Posted 30 September 2013 - 12:18 AM

"Your job is not to die for your country, but to make that other dumb ******* die for his" George Patton.

Screaming "blood for the blood god!" and seeing anything less than a banzai charge into enemy guns as cowardice is stupid. Makes me think of British and French generals throwing the lives of millions away to move their drinks cabinet a few meters closer to Berlin beause they never learned there is a time and place for that tactic. The dead have no glory, while the living can continue to fight.

But time and time again, I witness it.

I'm a firm advocate of play your role and play your mech. It was mentioned before but I think overlooked. If you build a brawler, go brawl, but be smart with it, and don't forget that you have others who can help you. There's a reason that since the Romans, archers, catapults and trebuchets were used to soften up the enemy even when under cover, so when the brawkers DID charge in, they were depleted. The LRM boats are your archers, and can save your bacon by giving you a chewed up Atlas or even blow up that pesky little Jenner that's been nipping at your butt. They get Kill Assists and you get easier kills.

If you're a scout and not targeting, backstabbing and caping, what the bleep good are you? You can't go toe to toe with a Heavy, generally, if they're an average shot. If you can shoot on the run (I can't yet) then get to work doing it. If you can't shoot, cap. If you can't cap, spot. If you built a sniper mech, then good golly! Get the to a place of cover and a lot of open space in front of you and have fun popping rounds into somebody to help out the brawlers that hopefully didn't rush into a gauntlet you can't help them with. These are the tactics of Mechwarrior since the days of the D6.

Full disclosure - I run LRM boats because I am a firm believer of having a mountain between me and my enemy and try to get kills without ever exposing myself to a chance for damage. When I run out of missiles, then I start looking for soft targets to hammer with my guns in a hopefully unscratched heavy mech.

There's nothing wrong with timidity if rightly placed. But it can turn to cowardice too. I've done more than a few games where I've seen the "Theta Death March" begin and gone "oh hell no!" and with a heavy mech gone cap hunting, or sat back and lobbed in LRMs because I don't enjoy dying 4 minutes then spending 9 spectating the Spider as it runs. Consider this old fact from the TT game: The team that won initiative went LAST. Why? Beause you got the tactical advantage of knowing where the enemy mechs were going! So instead of rushing off to Theta to die in a spectacular mess of bravado, take a second to see other options. Caution works.

#72 Evogenesis

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Posted 02 October 2013 - 03:36 AM

Alistair,

Your story of the tunnel on Forest colony reminds me of a very similar incident I faced. On comm with my friend we were in that trail that runs parralel to the tunnel running a couple of strikers. There were 5 heavy friendlies that entered the tunnel but were now bottlenecking at the exit.

Oh no! Timidity rears its ugly head.

My lancemate and I charge in on the flank, do some damage, and pull back in the face of fierce fire from the enemies blocking the exit along with crossfire from across the lake.

The bottleneck continues and losses are beginning to mount. Timidity rules the day.. or so it seems.

We lead a second charge this time with the help of a third. Punching through their lines I reach the entrance and do a half circle spurning them on. The message is received. Sometimes the sight of a friendly is all it takes to spur action. The 5 heavies come pouring out the tunnel, we take the arch and roll through the enemy line.

#73 YourBusDriver

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Posted 02 October 2013 - 03:56 AM

You are absolutely right Alistair Winter. I do best when I use my stock Cicada CDA-3C to circumvent the enemy line, and then PPC them in the rear. At the mere whiff of discovery, I speed off utilizing my mech's top speed of 118.8 km/h to deliver my arse from danger. I can comfortably out-range LRMs by 80 meters, and with my speed I avoid snipers easily. By the time anyone has gotten to me, I've worn their armor down, and my dual MGs rip them apart.

Of course, this tactic does provide a useful service to my comrades. By diverting the opposition when they turn their backs to face me, they become susceptible to the heavy fire from the main convoy. As a result, most of my opponents die facing backwards rather than towards those whom actually killed them. Its almost as if I'm handing free kills to my allies.

Edited by YourBusDriver, 02 October 2013 - 04:00 AM.


#74 Void Angel

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Posted 03 October 2013 - 10:07 AM

Though if the other team has good lights, they'll hunt you down and slaughter you like a hog - just wait till you've upgraded to double heat sinks, endo-steel, and an XL. =)

#75 Rowanas

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Posted 03 October 2013 - 12:10 PM

I'm the proud owner of three jenners and an Awesome. In the awesome, I won't go anywhere or do anything unless someone else is there first. My XL just can't handle a surprise. The Jenners, on the other hand, I'll generally suicide into the side of enemy lines. I'm sure most people here have seen what a single light does to disorganised heavies and assaults. They turn around, turn their back on the advancing frontline and take the easy kill. Sometimes I misjudge it, and my team don't get there in time to make best use of the chaos, but when your last sight before death is a couple of Centurions and an Atlas cresting the hill, bright blue beams arcing across the screen, LRMs sparkling in the sunlight above their heads, you know you've just swung the game in your team's favour.

I might not earn much XP that game, but that's fine. I came to play, and hell, I'll know what I've done.

#76 Autobot9000

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Posted 03 October 2013 - 12:11 PM

You're right with your first post, but I still go in first every time ;)





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