24 replies to this topic

[Gallowglas]

SuckyJack, on 09 September 2013 - 03:02 PM, said:

Would you rather see 8v8/10v10 or 14v14/16v16?

The more, the merrier. I find that more players makes for either more nuanced tactics or more chaos. Either is more fun gameplay.

[Sir Hunter]

Good discussion all. I started a similar thread about a week ago as our unit continually gets frustrated about the lack of premade 12s that are around - we either get the "match not found" message or just keep on dropping against the same two or three opponents. Our conclusion is that premade 12s are not worth the hassle/time of set up and people are veering away from them. This in turn is upsetting the purpose and balance of the game. In addition it takes away a lot of the rationale to be an organized unit in the first place. My opinion is that the pre game UI is the major problem. The fact that you cannot see a queue with a list of individuals and teams is ridiculous. In addition other shooter games usually allow you to form a team of any size up to the max with the holes being filled by bots or PUGs. Finally the constant 'fine tuning' or fixing what isn't broken is undermining player confidence. For me the game currently carries little 'spark' - I hope thongs change next week but I'm not counting on it.

Edited by Sir Hunter, 10 September 2013 - 08:33 AM.

[BOWMANGR]

I prefer 8vs8 than 12vs12 but I don't think that we should be limited to one or the other. 8 vs 8 was WAY better for individuals to change the tide of battle and if that individual happened to be you then it was awesome. Now, 12vs12 feels a bit like a scrapyard battle to clear out the newbies and the pilots that mindlessly charge both of whom die in minutes and then if the matchmaker did its job then the match may end up interesting BUT if the matchmaker didn't do its job then the whole match ends up a boring roflstomp of one team over the other.

Ironically, if you think about it 12vs12 after removing the newbies and 'rambo' style pilots from the game becomes a 8vs8 but with above average pilots. The problem is that I find myself in lopsided matches way more than what I was used to when it was strictly 8vs8.

Sometimes, I try to play support role mechs only to discover that the Assaults in my team are newbies and they don't know what they are doing. You cannot support someone if he can't even fight properly. Other times the opponents have the newbies and its like a shooting gallery. This is also not fun unless you are 14 years old and enjoy winning without a challenge.

Other times I try to play a Medium. This class is NOT a frontline class especially during the opening stages of the match. Unfortunately, due to an unusual percentage of cowardly Assault pilots I often find myself fighting enemy Assaults in my Medium. I can try to hold them off but I can't fight them all by myself. So I naturally die. Then I spectate and I see the Assaults in my team without a scratch playing hide and seek with the enemy. It's frustrating.

In 8vs8 one pilot could try to do his thing and if he was any good he COULD make a difference even if the matchmaker was putting all odds against him. In 12vs12 it's so chaotic and the enemy firepower is so much that you cannot do anything alone and you have to rely in others to actually play out their ROLE. Unfortnately, many people do not understand that every mech has a ROLE and they are not suited to do every single thing with any mech.

We've all been in a match where a single Spider/Commando/Jenner breaks through your team's Assault frontline and suddenly EVERYONE LOSES THEIR MINDS and starts chasing the Light turning their backs to the main enemy force even and leaving the whole frontline wide open.
I've seen Assaults trying to cap instead of fight. I've seen Assaults pretending to be Snipers, I've seen Assaults doing base defense with no reason and so on.
Since the matchmaker tries to even the tonnage most of the time, if your teams 2 Assaults are doing anything other than straight up ASSAULTING then you are going to lose. Especially the last two days it's like the influx of new players has increased because all I see is my team's or the other team's Assaults being newbies resulting in a 12-1, 12-2 roflstomp match.

Role warfare is vital in this game and in 12vs12 even more so. PGI needs to make a specific tutorial about role warfare in MWO if they want 12vs12 to work for PUGs, otherwise it is only good for premades.


tl;dr
8vs8 is better for PUGs and needs to be an option
12vs12 is better for the big maps and for premade groups. PUGs in 12vs12 suffer, especially if the matchmaker doesn't do its job properly.
PGI needs to tutor players about role warfare so they can use their mechs properly, especially after tonnage limits are enforced.

[Almond Brown]

The 12 v 12 group Matches have the same issue the 8 v 8 did. When you only face hordes of Assault mechs mixed with a couple lights, then throw in the FOTM weapons load-outs on all of them, the FUN wains quickly. Hopefully CW restrictions will bring back that FUN element when Teams are forced to build within a set of guidelines that will remove much of the BS seen in use today.

[DegeneratePervert]

I'd much rather have:

8v8 on- River City, Forest Colony/snow, Frozen City/Night

12v12 on- Terra Therma, Caustic Valley, Alpine Peaks, Tourmaline Desert, Canyon Network

But I dunno if PGI's servers can regulate that effectively.