20 replies to this topic

[RiotHero]

As a newb I've noticed a few things. The first is that there really isn't any strategy involved in this game. For example every single time I've played the Volcano map the entire team just marches right up into the middle area. Is this game based on revolutionary war stand in a straight line and fight tactics? I'm always the only one flanking. In conquest it is just as bad. Half the team will rush to cap but, ONLY the nearest one. The rest just camps. If the whole team would go mid and to either side you could take two points at once then reconnect but, no one will ever flank.

The second thing is spotting is basically useless. I was excited about setting up my light mech for a scout role but, there is no point. I will flank their whole team, scout the biggest slowest most exposed guy from behind and missiles never arrive. Spotting is actually more distracting than useful (unless it is for your own info) because rarely do assists ever come from it and I get exposed trying to remain line of sight. I think part of it is that everyone uses auto-cannons, ppc, and medium lasers. I don't see hardly any lrm's not enough to make spotting worth it.

I guess, I'm just used to military style fps games where squads, tactics, flanking, rotating, and scouting are very important to a win. This is more like a big face to face smash'em up. After some time I'll get used to it though. It's definitely a change. Hopefully with the release it will be more competitive.

[Ewigan]

YOu really have to play with others on Teamspeak mate.
Then all what you just said actually really matters.

without Teamspeak (or any other kind of voice comms) it tends to get a bit boring.

[Earl White]

There is strategy, but don't expect much more than a big ball of death in public games, if you want to set up separate lances doing flanks etc you'll want to join a faction and team up with players. You can get an assist by just hitting a mech, so if you dash around and shoot every mech once, you will get a lot of c-bills, for spotting assists you need to be spotting a mech while its hit by LRM missiles. You won't always have mechs with LRMs though, so don't count on getting that bonus.

Also you might want to try spotting them initially then moving back into your ball of death for a while, and scouting behind or to the flanks of your group so you can warn your team of any enemies trying to flank your team.

As a light mech, you are more useful at harassing enemies drawing their attention, while your allies are moving in to attack, as well as scrambling their sensors with an ECM module.

Edited by Earl White, 11 September 2013 - 04:37 AM.

[VIPER2207]

RiotHero, on 11 September 2013 - 04:24 AM, said:

The first is that there really isn't any strategy involved in this game. For example every single time I've played the Volcano map the entire team just marches right up into the middle area.

I'm always the only one flanking.

In conquest it is just as bad. Half the team will rush to cap but, ONLY the nearest one. The rest just camps. If the whole team would go mid and to either side you could take two points at once then reconnect but, no one will ever flank.

The second thing is spotting is basically useless.

I will flank their whole team, scout the biggest slowest most exposed guy from behind and missiles never arrive.

all of these points only happen in PUG (i.e. public games).
The best advice i can give: go to the ngng-teamspeak-server ( www.nogutsnogalaxy.net , klick top left button regarding teamspeak-server) and find yourself a team. you will find out, that playing with at least a full lance of 4 players is a huge advantage in strategy, fun and ability to win. most guys at ngng are realy smart and also help new players.
just give it a try

[Itsalrightwithme]

+1: You need to join a team and coordinate via TeamSpeak.

When you have no teammates you can really rely on, and your team's intention is mostly to brawl, then the best of the bad options is to go to the center. If you had all gone right, the enemy may have gone all left. If you had split your forces, you risk getting pinned down and destroyed.

You can mitigate this "pessimistic" approach by using team chat at the start of the match, make suggestions. "Heavies assaults head toward center but wait at opening," or something like that. Keep in mind if the brawl were to happen in the center, then the team that controls the inside space can win more easily.

Spotting while playing solo ain't useful, bring a teammate with LRMs.

The point of winning a firefight here is to pour more damage and kills to the other side than they do to you. So it's not quite the linear formation of the 1700s-1800s, it is more about controlling your engagement lines in the style of late 1800s warfare (US Civil War, Franco-Prussian War) leading up to WW1. The Revolutionary War linear formation is about maximizing firepower while minimizing damage as rangefinding was still very poor (as was firearms accuracy at that time).

[Redshift2k5]

Tactics are not automatic. If you want strategy you need to bring one, and you need to communicate that strategy.

Never expect 12 strangers to suddenly behave in a tactical manner with no direction and no communication. There is a map function (B for battlegrid) allowing you to take command and place order markers on the map for your team.

You can also join 4 man teams or 12 man teams where communication allows even deeper strategy.

[mailin]

As a light driver in a pug match you need to use team chat more than the other guys. This is because one cardinal rule, stay together, doesn't necessarily apply to lights. They have freedom to move about the map. Use your freedom to move and find the enemy, but let your team know what you're doing. When you spot the enemy, use team chat to let your friendlies know the numbers, locations and type of enemies spotted. At this point do not engage because that's not your job. Once your friendlies are engaged, look for enemies that are alone, or lrm boats that you can harass. If you start taking damage, run away to rejoin your buddies and get one or two enemies to follow you to their doom, or head to cap a bit to draw them back. So, there is strategy that can be applied, but it is not easy just using in-game chat.

[MadCat02]

as a newb you are matched with other newbs until you gain some skill and higher win rating you will be playing agaist unskilled players

good players max out armor and ferro fibrous upgrade , kite behind buildings and poke from 900 meters .

itll get better

Edited by MadCat02, 11 September 2013 - 05:47 AM.

[mailin]

As far as lrms are concerned, you need to remember that missile boats tend be lumbering behemoths. They need to close to within the 1000m maximum range, and have no obstructions that the lrms will hit. This can be pretty tricky to achieve on some maps like Terra Therma and Tourmaline Desert where there are a lot of rocky spires. Give them time, or wait and see if the lrm boat becomes isolated, then pick him apart.

[Pastor Priest]

Others have said it but I will reiterate: get in Teamspeak and find a group. Communications using the in game system are difficult at best, and specialized mechs, such as your spotter, are more difficult to use when you have no idea if others will bring a build complimenting yours.

Edited by Pastor Priest, 11 September 2013 - 07:05 PM.

[Mogney]

Yup pug matches are total grab bag. Join a clan if you want a more intelligent combat experience. Here is a great one for new players.

http://mwomercs.com/...rofanity-guild/

[Lostdragon]

I have been playing for a few months but just recently joined a unit to get into team play. The difference in PUG matches and 12v12 premade team matches is night and day. It is like playing a different game. Strategy, tactics, and teamwork all happen in every match, whereas in a PUG you might see one or two of those if you are lucky.

[mailin]

I drop in solo pug matches, 4 mans, and competitive 12 mans. By far the hardest are pug matches because you never know what you're going to get. I get the most enjoyment out of the 4 mans because when I drop with them they are part of the competitive 12 man team that I'm on, which means we tend to have a fairly good idea of what works and what doesn't. In those matches I will typically type something along the lines of "let's do a base defense", or "heavies go left". It doesn't always work, but when it does even the pugs get excited about how well the "team" has played. So, really it is possible, even just on in-game chat, but it is a lot harder than other games where you don't need to rely on everybody else. Try dropping with friends and you might be amazed at how much strategy comes out, just because you have people that like dropping with you and who want to see you succeed.

[Wintersdark]

IMHO small groups are the most fun you can have in the game. You've still got the random aspect of pugs, but you've got a core you can rely on and communicate with, and this allows you to bring specialized machines to the battle and employ more interesting tactics - all without the headache and hassles of wrangling 12 players together.

With that said, as you work your way into higher Elo rankings, solo dropping in pugs gets better. You'll end up more often in with premade groups (on both sides), and matches will be a lot more interesting and strategic.

Remember, being new means you're matched with other new players, many of whom have no clue whatsoever what's going on. Give it some time. In the mean time, if you can't get into at least a small group, build mechs to be self sufficient (ie: Don't rely on LRM support, etc). Be fast, so you can redeploy, and generally stick with the group.

I strongly recommend, at least, when you see decent players around you - not necessarily in how spectacular their performance is, but rather indications that they're at least marginally intelligent - add them to your friends list, say high, start up a group and do some drops together. Even without voice comms, you can get soooo much more done and be much more effective when you're able to choose mechs to complement each other, and have someone you know you can work with.

[Arnold J Rimmer]

What Wintersdark said. I'm with a unit now, but pugging was the absolute worst for me when I started (way back in closed beta ). I cruised the forums for people to drop with, added a few from people I met in-game, then found out about the NGNG Teamspeak server and got on voice comms. It improved my enjoyment of the game immeasurably. But even before using voice, just dropping with a 'wingman' who you knew wasn't a total tool made it much more interesting.

[Deathz Jester]

RiotHero, on 11 September 2013 - 04:24 AM, said:

As a newb I've noticed a few things. The first is that there really isn't any strategy involved in this game. For example every single time I've played the Volcano map the entire team just marches right up into the middle area. Is this game based on revolutionary war stand in a straight line and fight tactics? I'm always the only one flanking. In conquest it is just as bad. Half the team will rush to cap but, ONLY the nearest one. The rest just camps. If the whole team would go mid and to either side you could take two points at once then reconnect but, no one will ever flank.

The second thing is spotting is basically useless. I was excited about setting up my light mech for a scout role but, there is no point. I will flank their whole team, scout the biggest slowest most exposed guy from behind and missiles never arrive. Spotting is actually more distracting than useful (unless it is for your own info) because rarely do assists ever come from it and I get exposed trying to remain line of sight. I think part of it is that everyone uses auto-cannons, ppc, and medium lasers. I don't see hardly any lrm's not enough to make spotting worth it.

I guess, I'm just used to military style fps games where squads, tactics, flanking, rotating, and scouting are very important to a win. This is more like a big face to face smash'em up. After some time I'll get used to it though. It's definitely a change. Hopefully with the release it will be more competitive.

You pretty much summed up the game at its current state. [no sarcasm intended towards you]

[Gremlich Johns]

RiotHero, on 11 September 2013 - 04:24 AM, said:

As a newb I've noticed a few things. The first is that there really isn't any strategy involved in this game. For example every single time I've played the Volcano map the entire team just marches right up into the middle area. Is this game based on revolutionary war stand in a straight line and fight tactics? I'm always the only one flanking. In conquest it is just as bad. Half the team will rush to cap but, ONLY the nearest one. The rest just camps. If the whole team would go mid and to either side you could take two points at once then reconnect but, no one will ever flank.

The second thing is spotting is basically useless. I was excited about setting up my light mech for a scout role but, there is no point. I will flank their whole team, scout the biggest slowest most exposed guy from behind and missiles never arrive. Spotting is actually more distracting than useful (unless it is for your own info) because rarely do assists ever come from it and I get exposed trying to remain line of sight. I think part of it is that everyone uses auto-cannons, ppc, and medium lasers. I don't see hardly any lrm's not enough to make spotting worth it.

I guess, I'm just used to military style fps games where squads, tactics, flanking, rotating, and scouting are very important to a win. This is more like a big face to face smash'em up. After some time I'll get used to it though. It's definitely a change. Hopefully with the release it will be more competitive.

There is strategy, but as others have indicated, find yourself a team.

as far as role warfare is concerned (like Scouting) forget it for now (if ever). PGI's game does not lend itself to that model, however much they want you to believe they are trying to implement Role warfare. AND, few players even know what scouting is so knowing to target an enemy mech (press "R" mates) doesn't dawn on them. Also, with no knockdown, the lights can be relatively inviolable so why scout when they can fight assaults. Ever see a 3xSSRM2 commando take out an Atlas? This game has it. Dragon bowling was during closed beta, but PGI disabled knockdown back when that was the rage.

[Helmer]

Gremlich Johns, on 11 September 2013 - 12:55 PM, said:

Dragon bowling was during closed beta, but PGI disabled knockdown back when that was the rage.

To add to Gremlich Johns' previous statement. PGI took disabled knockdowns until they could implement it better. They've stated knockdowns would return, however, they have not given us an ETA.


Cheers.

[John Buford]

Was going to do alot of typing to expaling your questions but with all responses already they have more than explained the status of the game. As a light Pilot or any pilot that is you need to get a group of friends and do some drops and then you will see some actualy tactics. My friends and I are looking to do some drops together if we can ever just get around to it. Looks like we will have 2 lights and 2 meds one of which is a Missle boat which will work well for us.

[RiotHero]

Awesome advice thanks, I wasn't trying to be to seem to pessimistic but the overall feel from the game was causing it. I guess if anything I was pissed that I made such a horrible choice in Mechs and wasted time eliting it if it was only going to be this face to face rumble type warfare. I would have picked something with much more armor and weapons. I did switch to a hit and run harasser type role some time ago after figuring out anything else wasn't useful. I'll probably just switch again and follow a heavy for support.


I'll have to check around for some teams in the meantime.