46 replies to this topic

[Alpha087]

To those of you who looked upon this 'mech and saw only failure. Only a mere miniature version of an RS brawler, or a slower version of a Gauss platform Dragon...

I say to you, that you have greatly under-estimated the potential of the mighty Orion.

http://www.mechspecs...hp?topic=3720.0



Let your calls for consistency be met with evidence of this 'mech's potential.
Screenshot of the results of several drops in a row, some above average, some below. But the results have all been higher than any other build I've seen used then attempted myself.

Edit:

http://cloud-2.steam...6112009A25E58F/

http://cloud.steampo...81F8FA3BB703A5/

http://cloud-2.steam...B49109D7FA86B6/

http://cloud-2.steam...E66227A0C866AD/

Edited by Alpha087, 21 September 2013 - 07:30 PM.

[RavensScar]

I'm afraid your image isn't properly embedded - I had to right click -> open in new tab.

Nevertheless, 1100 damage - good job! What build were you running?

Unfortunately, 1 match isn't really proof of anything. I've heard of Blackjack's breaking 1000 damage, but they're still pilot death traps! The Orion isn't as bad as some people are making out, but I don't think it's going to be capable of the match-on-match performance of the Jag or Phract.

[Anjian]

Your picture links is broken.

Anyway, I did six kills in a game yesterday using a non elite ON-1V, this useless mech with a big torso, packed with dual nerfed and equally useless UAC5s, in its torso with a stock STD 300 engine and no elite bonuses. Then later within the hour, on the third run of a brand new ON-1K, fought a game to the last man standing, everyone dead, the Orion alone in the battlefield amidst burning mechs, with 4 kills in the belt, including a final one on one with a fast Centurion.

[Alpha087]

Threw it up on mechspecs. The other couple games I've tested this heap with has generally held a solid 400-500 damage by the end of each match. It really all depends on how careful you are in positioning yourself, and how much you conserve your ammo.

I have tried every which way to make a brawler work on the K, and I have to say. This mech should just never be used for a role such as that.

[John MatriX82]

Yeah if I do good I can make slaughters even in a Dragon or in an Awesome, but that doesn't prove that the platform is fine, it's just that you've been lucky, you're a good pilot and nothing else.

Orions are cr4p. They are mini-atlases that share the same low-arm points, a CT that is on par or even bigger than those of Dragons or Awesomes; you have to expose basically the whole mech to shoot and your CT won't soak (and output) the same DMG that an Atlas can, at the same time without being any kind of fear factor for your enemy and you won't certainly lead any charge into that.

At high elo levels I'm having an hard time even to basic my VA. As soon as it will be done, I'll gladly get back to Landers, Stalkers and whatever else. BTW, the release of the Orion even made me rethink my evaluation on the Victors. Hell Victors are thousands of times better!

[Anjian]

I did my best game on my ON1-K with only 4 Medium Lasers in a group and an AC20. By some people's definition, that's like a brawler configuration, or at least a short range. But I don't really go out looking for a brawl. Instead, I support brawls already happening.

In any case, the best armor in the game is not to think you are a superman, plan like you got eggshells for your armor, and think how you can get the best out of the situation.

[Bishop Steiner]

Alpha087, on 21 September 2013 - 12:30 AM, said:

To those of you who looked upon this 'mech and saw only failure. Only a mere miniature version of an RS brawler, or a slower version of a Gauss platform Dragon...

I say to you, that you have greatly under-estimated the potential of the mighty Orion.

http://www.mechspecs...hp?topic=3720.0

Yes, I have had good matches too. Doesn't change the fact the CT is the size of the Titanic. Usually just means you dropped against utter PUG Noob fail on the other team.

[Bishop Steiner]

Alpha087, on 21 September 2013 - 01:26 AM, said:

Threw it up on mechspecs. The other couple games I've tested this heap with has generally held a solid 400-500 damage by the end of each match. It really all depends on how careful you are in positioning yourself, and how much you conserve your ammo.

I have tried every which way to make a brawler work on the K, and I have to say. This mech should just never be used for a role such as that.

And that is kinda the point. I can do 1200 damage on a good match with an Awesome packing LRMs. If I survive to break 600 pts on any sort of direct fire/ brawler Awesome, I know I faced noobs. The Orion SHOULD be more capable in close combat, as most of it's stock firepower is geared toward that role. I don't expect it to fill the Juggernaut role (heck they poor HBK is SUPPOSED to fill that role and fails), but it is supposed to be a rugged, tough all purpose mech. Right now it is a good support mech.

Apparently IS mech designers are universally idiots, who make the most important parts of their mechs regularly into the biggest target. I can only hope Clan Mech designers are more intelligent.

[Modo44]

John MatriX82, on 21 September 2013 - 01:31 AM, said:

As soon as it will be done, I'll gladly get back to Landers, Stalkers and whatever else. BTW, the release of the Orion even made me rethink my evaluation on the Victors. Hell Victors are thousands of times better!

News at 11: Lighter mechs require different tactics to work than assaults. Just because you can put a similar build on it, don't expect the Orion to replace an Atlas. Treat it like any other heavy, and it will kick ***.

[John MatriX82]

Modo44, on 21 September 2013 - 06:01 AM, said:

News at 11: Lighter mechs require different tactics to work than assaults. Just because you can put a similar build on it, don't expect the Orion to replace an Atlas. Treat it like any other heavy, and it will kick ***.

I've already sold it. I can do better stuff in my next-to-be-sold variant/chassis which is the DRG-1N, to a point I'm even re-evaluating to keep that dragon xD

So yes, definitely lighter mechs can be better than this. Starting from Cataphracts.

Edited by John MatriX82, 21 September 2013 - 06:10 AM.

[operator0]

John MatriX82, on 21 September 2013 - 06:04 AM, said:

I've already sold it. I can do better stuff in my next-to-be-sold variant/chassis which is the DRG-1N, to a point I'm even re-evaluating to keep that dragon xD

So yes, definitely lighter mechs can be better than this. Starting from Cataphracts.

Shhh..Don't tell anyone, but the Flame is a damn good chassis.

[Bishop Steiner]

Modo44, on 21 September 2013 - 06:01 AM, said:

News at 11: Lighter mechs require different tactics to work than assaults. Just because you can put a similar build on it, don't expect the Orion to replace an Atlas. Treat it like any other heavy, and it will kick ***.

No Orion on the Battlefield yet has gone toe to toe vs my Jagermechs or my Ilyas and walked away, unless I was already critically damaged when we met.

I drive Mediums and Heavies, and thus don't expect it to tank. But it should not be universally outclassed by a frankenmech 5 tons lighter, and a SUPPORT mech 10 tons lighter. The Orion is decent, but it is far from great, and ATM, arguably the 4-5th "best" of the Heavy chassis. The Jagermech and Cataphract are hands down better (the only area the Phract loses is as missile support, but then it also has a jumping version, something the Orion cannot match). The Catapult is probably better. This leaves the Orion in company with the Quickdraw. And the Quickdraw has generally shown a lot more survivability, though generally it also lays out less damage.

The only heavy the Orion is demonstrably better than is the Dragon, which is 15 tons lighter. And shares the same crappy CT. Laughable, especially after listening to all the talk about 75 tons being the "heavy mech sweetspot" (always felt 70 tons was actually better, but what do I know).

The Orion, like the Awesome, CAN be serviceable. What it cannot do is actually shine in the roles it was designed for, just like the Awesome. Sue me for thinking it should be better than "average", or should be more than a real good support mech.

operator0, on 21 September 2013 - 06:14 AM, said:

Shhh..Don't tell anyone, but the Flame is a pretty good chassis.

FTFY. hard to praise it much higher unless it actually comes close to being able to stand up to a Firebrand or Ilya. But it is a solid little beast I enjoy running.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 21 September 2013 - 07:24 AM.

[Lightfoot]

any decent shot can take the Orion down in 5-10 seconds. It's not defendable due to the CT size and the amount it projects forward. Your only defense is to not be shot at. You will lose any duel to a good pilot.

Sure, I am in the Orion and sometimes I see damage all over the mech, but my opponents were too far away or just bad shots.

They have never fixed the Awesome, even though no one ever uses it anymore it's so bad. Orion is new so maybe they will take a look, but it's likely now or never.

[Middcore]

Lightfoot, on 21 September 2013 - 01:47 PM, said:

any decent shot can take the Orion down in 5-10 seconds. It's not defendable due to the CT size and the amount it projects forward. Your only defense is to not be shot at. You will lose any duel to a good pilot.

Sure, I am in the Orion and sometimes I see damage all over the mech, but my opponents were too far away or just bad shots.

They have never fixed the Awesome, even though no one ever uses it anymore it's so bad. Orion is new so maybe they will take a look, but it's likely now or never.

This is about the size of it. The Orion is not equipped to win a straight up fight against, well, anything. I would retreat from a 1 on 1 fight against a light or medium in it, not kidding. The CT is too big a target, even a mediocre shot will be able to hit it easily, and torso twisting doesn't help because the CT projects forward much like on the Dragon.

There are other 'mechs with squishy torsos, to be sure, like Catapults, but the K2 at least has hardpoints that allow you to fire over cover and protect your torso. I'd take a K2 over an Orion for this reason, it will live longer. The Orion has to expose its entire body up to its waist at least to fire due to the positioning of its hardpoints.

The Orion can have decent games in a supporting role, IF it can take potshots at enemies who don't pay attention to it. The minute anybody notices you and starts to take shots at you, it's time to disengage or die.

And we have no shortage of support-oriented heavies that can't take a punch in return in the game. I have, oh, a half dozen or so in my garage myself, and most of them do even the support job better than the Orion.

[Lexx]

I went with a completely different approach with my Orion V. I saw how it had lots of missile tubes and made an LRM boat out of it. I put on 3 LRM 15s with 1800 rounds of ammo. I love how it fires all 45 missiles in one group instead of breaking them up like most other mechs will.

[Middcore]

Lexx, on 21 September 2013 - 05:22 PM, said:

I went with a completely different approach with my Orion V. I saw how it had lots of missile tubes and made an LRM boat out of it. I put on 3 LRM 15s with 1800 rounds of ammo. I love how it fires all 45 missiles in one group instead of breaking them up like most other mechs will.

That's cool and all, but like I said, there's no shortage of LRM boats and support 'mechs.

[SgtMagor]

the way the Orion is built, I only use it as a support mech. I do better in a Centurion or YLW. the Victor just totally outclasses it, I like my Protector but it will never replace my Dragon Slayer!
,tried the Dragon champion I think I like it better than the Orion. first time I tried it got 2 kills, and 411 points in damage.

Edited by SgtMagor, 21 September 2013 - 05:36 PM.

[Johnny Reb]

Lexx, on 21 September 2013 - 05:22 PM, said:

I went with a completely different approach with my Orion V. I saw how it had lots of missile tubes and made an LRM boat out of it. I put on 3 LRM 15s with 1800 rounds of ammo. I love how it fires all 45 missiles in one group instead of breaking them up like most other mechs will.

Same, only really effective Orion build for me, mastered mine last night:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...833716911a4fbdb
Still unless tonnage limits come into play, I will take my Highlander lrm boat over this.

[Bishop Steiner]

SgtMagor, on 21 September 2013 - 05:29 PM, said:

the way the Orion is built, I only use it as a support mech. I do better in a Centurion or YLW. the Victor just totally outclasses it, I like my Protector but it will never replace my Dragon Slayer!
,tried the Dragon champion I think I like it better than the Orion. first time I tried it got 2 kills, and 411 points in damage.

I did actually put together a variant of the Protector that has been BEAST for me, but no matter how nasty the hurt i can lay out, if the OpFor decides to focus on me, it's curtains. I really do think with even a mild CT pass (And the one CarrionCrow is recommending would make it truly beast) the Orion could have a ton of potential. 75 tons even.

I don't get why the react so quick to fix a second rate robochimp piece of scrap like the Kintaro, but mechs people have wanted and begged for and waited months for seem to be ignored.

[FupDup]

Bishop Steiner, on 21 September 2013 - 06:11 PM, said:

I did actually put together a variant of the Protector that has been BEAST for me, but no matter how nasty the hurt i can lay out, if the OpFor decides to focus on me, it's curtains. I really do think with even a mild CT pass (And the one CarrionCrow is recommending would make it truly beast) the Orion could have a ton of potential. 75 tons even.

I don't get why the react so quick to fix a second rate robochimp piece of scrap like the Kintaro, but mechs people have wanted and begged for and waited months for seem to be ignored.

It's especially puzzling because it's the ####ing KERENSKY mech. I mean come on guys, the most iconic character in all of Battletech. He's be rolling over and puking in his grave if he caught wind of what PGI's art department did to his favorite ride...