345 replies to this topic

[Corwin Vickers]

I think it is a combination of factors as well, computer speed, connection quality, lack of skill, general whininess.

You will also observe these players claim that they died because their "elo is too high and the match maker gave me all scrubs."

They will also blame losses on the other team having voice comms, "premades", hacks and bots.

They are also known to chain fire triple AC2s, fire LRMs at any range, and wonder why their PPCs aren't doing any damage to the spider at their feet. (Hint, it's the spider'***** boxes and not PPC minimum range.)

They are frequently dead way in front of their team alone or way behind their team alone and spend the rest of the match asking why no one was supporting/guarding them despite ignoring all communication before their death. Sometimes they are the last man alive because they were capping bases as the rest of their team died which obviously requires them to tell the rest of the team how great they are because they are the last guy left alive.

At some point someone told them it was ok to blame their inability to play on Spider hit boxes as well. Before this it was LRMs, Splatcats, SSRMs, PPCs, Gauss, Lasers, jump jets, you name it.

Spider hit boxes gave them 300 ping and 10% packetloss, someone proved it on youtube.

Oh, and like the guy I killed earlier, he couldn't have missed because he was using "spread SRMs and an LBX," whatever that's supposed to mean...

The common motivation here is that when they die/lose it's not because they need to learn to adapt to the same conditions that everyone else is dealing with, it's because of some external unfairness that if it could only be removed they would be the gods they know they are.

[psihius]

Corwin Vickers, on 06 October 2013 - 07:19 PM, said:

I think it is a combination of factors as well, computer speed, connection quality, lack of skill, general whininess.

You will also observe these players claim that they died because their "elo is too high and the match maker gave me all scrubs."

Well, about the ELO stuff, at least that is pure truth from the perspective of the one, who plays since closed beta and is proficient enough to be able to tell if he is matched with total noobs. When playing solo it's not that pronounced, but when we team up our lance of 4 - most of the time we are dropped with total noobs on our side against a more or less decent folks on the other side without the noobs. Almost every match is runned in two scenarios - we take point, usually die because of massive focused fire and despite inflicted heavy damage (like killing 5 to 7 enemy mech's before being all dead) our team just gets killed despite being seriously superior in numbers. The other scenario is when we hold back a little and engage when fight has started so we are not under focus fire. Usually ends up in a realisation that despite our heavy support and tons of damage and kills, our whole team is already dead and we get focus fire taken out. At the score screen the usual picture is our lance having from 300+ damage on the first dead to 600-700 damage on those who lived to the end, we have 5 to 7 kills spread through our lance (the record is 9 kills per our lance) and other part of the team has like 50-60, some 120-150 damage, 0 kills. Occasionally we are lucky to have a few guys who know what they are doing - at that moment the game changes, drastically.

Although I noticed a curious pattern - if I play outside the 16:00 - 20:00 GTM time - I have no trouble at all, I just own anything that walks assuming I didn't made a mistake of walking into a trap or getting caught with my pants down.
I have a theory that during that time there are too many people playing from eastern europe who are fed up with WoT and bring their low-skill-no-brain hands to MWO. Playing during that period of time is almost pointless - winning 9 to 3, getting killed and watching your team get slaughtered 9 to 12 by 3 half-alive mech's is not what I want from the ELO system...

Long story short - there is a humongous problem with the matchmaking. But I fear the problem is not really in the ELO, as more in the fact that when PGI made that skilled people started to drop with total noobs - people just stopped playing MWO. Our unit had an online of 30 to 50 people, now we barely get enough for one 12 player team and one or two 4's running around. And people kind'a prefer to play solo because matchmaker does not put them with noobs too often.

Edited by psihius, 07 October 2013 - 01:19 AM.

[ShinVector]

Captain Stiffy, on 06 October 2013 - 06:53 PM, said:

This. Why do mechs appear to take PARTIAL damage from hits so often? Even I would honestly say about 50% of the time for ALL hits on ANY mech this is the case.

Hmmm.. We need high Res video dudes.
I have already dis-proven the AimRobot's Spider Hit video to bad luck misses and hit, and paper doll not reflecting damage done issue.

We need to see the armour values too see whether hits are hitting properly.
Also realise that you Spider legs at need 42 damage to destroy clean off. That's 28 armour + 14 internal.

The one Cor showed with the Spider jumpjetting backwards at River City Citadel.. You can see that the Spider still had left leg armour flashing at the 14 sec mark and when he landed he had only yellow internal structure left.

As I mentioned before:
1. Usually the case is hit reg issue due to lag or what not.
2. Paper doll not updating properly being mistaken for less damage done.

Edited by ShinVector, 07 October 2013 - 01:58 AM.

[mekabuser]

ok. im a spider pilot from day one.. back when no one.. no one used a spider so i know i bit about them.
yeah, they are tough, but a good spider pilot will know how to not be hit in one, just like a good commando .pilot etc.
when I make a dumb move, im dead, often within a second.
I hunt spiders, IN my spider with just an erppc. Now yes, i have great ping, usually around 30, but i see no difference between my damage to spiders or any other mech. They die all the same.
a great deal of dealing with spiders or any light mech is battlefield awareness and when and HOW to engage them.
I cant believe that there is 17 pages of text about this mech
each enemy mech has its pros and cons and half the battle is knowing how to ID what your enemy has and howand when to counter his advantage. .

[Koniving]

Now, I called this issue a long time ago at the very beginning of this video -- which is long after I've known it. Very first sentence. The statement is true for LRMs, SRMs, and ballistics. This is actually why I'm so pissed at the AC/2 penalty stopping macros; damage is lost when you fire 3 or more AC/2s at once.



In this video, at 2:50 while waiting for the lights to return and attack us again, I have the commando shoot my hunchback. Of the 5 shots, only 1 connected at less than 30 meters away.

Btw. 5 enemy spider 5-Ds all with PPCs, and they all lost to a Hunchback.

Interestingly enough at another time we repeated the test with lasers, and every hit registered (as a front torso shot, due to the design of the Hunchback 4G's hunch so that the entire weapons pod itself counts as front torso from all angles [thus 46 right front armor if you want to run an XL, 2 rear as the size of the right rear torso is the size of the Hunchback's fist)]).

Quoting below for posterity.

Koniving, on 06 October 2013 - 05:47 PM, said:

No problem. But so you know, that problem happens to most light and medium mechs.

Today a mech shot me 3 times with an AC/20 twin ER PPC and registered zero damage.

I was in a stalker. We synch-dropped on opposite teams to have a one on one fight on an off side of the map. "I hit you." "I know, I shook." "You ain't got no damage." "I know. I'm invincible!"

"Holy ****! That ain't fair!"

My flamer stalker butchered his Atlas.

I refer you to this.
http://mwomercs.com/...66#entry2812866

I also note that the "1% of the time" line is b.s., it happens at least once per match for me. I've headshot stationary mechs to produce "rear torso damage" more often than I've had failed registration of ballistics or missiles against spiders.

Koniving, on 06 October 2013 - 06:25 PM, said:

Combination speed + shape. If the commando could jump we'd have similar problems.

HSR goes out of whack with every press of the space bar, screwing up the calculation.

Jenners can do something similar if they jumped more often, but they don't.

Ravens don't benefit because the one that can jump can't go fast enough; though my AC/20 Raven has benefited from the occasional AC/20 to the face failing to register against me.

The issue is most prevalent on spiders. When spiders first began they had no issues. PGI never changed their hitboxes. I could headshot spiders pre-HSR with no issue. The issue doesn't lie squarely in the spider's hands is my point. Their speed and shape exasperate the problem. But I agree, it happens a LOT with the spiders.


Skip to 4:55, pre-HSR. No trouble at all hitting them without lag compensation. What's flawed isn't the hit-boxes but their speed, calculations involved with them, and especially the ballistic and missile HSR (I have trouble hitting assaults with SRMs while going 30 kph).

Edited by Koniving, 07 October 2013 - 07:46 AM.

[Clit Beastwood]

Captain Stiffy, on 05 October 2013 - 11:15 PM, said:

wrong thread sz

I laugh every time I see your name lol

[akpavker]

AssaultPig, on 05 October 2013 - 08:58 AM, said:

has this been linked yet?

the truth is out there mehlan......i mean mulder!

[Wispsy]

akpavker, on 07 October 2013 - 03:37 PM, said:

the truth is out there mehlan......i mean mulder!

And this is specifically different from all the other videos that link the majority of mechs showing hit registration errors?

[akpavker]

Wispsy, on 07 October 2013 - 03:38 PM, said:

And this is specifically different from all the other videos that link the majority of mechs showing hit registration errors?

im sorry i thought this thread was about spiders???

[Scandinavian Jawbreaker]

mekabuser, on 07 October 2013 - 06:57 AM, said:

each enemy mech has its pros and cons and half the battle is knowing how to ID what your enemy has and howand when to counter his advantage. .

Impossible scenario in the chaos of a PUG match. Mediocre aim + small fast target + hit detection problems = QQ on spiders.

[Wispsy]

akpavker, on 07 October 2013 - 03:54 PM, said:

im sorry i thought this thread was about spiders???

The thread is..but the issue is not :/

[akpavker]

Wispsy, on 07 October 2013 - 04:13 PM, said:

The thread is..but the issue is not :/

true sir yes.....i will not argue with the great wispsy and will try harder to claim a leg or two of yours:)

[Wispsy]

akpavker, on 07 October 2013 - 04:24 PM, said:

true sir yes.....i will not argue with the great wispsy and will try harder to claim a leg or two of yours:)

That is the correct attitude.

[General Taskeen]

Good thing Streaks don't require any skill or anything. Couldn't dodge em even with jump jets in my SPD-5V, one blast and you're done.

[Clit Beastwood]

Wispsy, on 07 October 2013 - 04:33 PM, said:

That is the correct attitude.

lol i think it was last night that wispys shots were sure registering on me... or someone from his team at least.

[akpavker]

Wispsy, on 07 October 2013 - 04:33 PM, said:

That is the correct attitude.

respect!

[TychoTheItinerant]

Corwin Vickers, on 29 September 2013 - 11:53 PM, said:

So let's say you "fix" the spiders hit boxes. Not all spiders are fast. So now you have penalized slow moving spiders because of your inability to learn.

Valid point but who the hell would run a slow spider?

[akpavker]

TychoTheItinerant, on 08 October 2013 - 09:09 PM, said:

Valid point but who the hell would run a slow spider?

you could be lvling the spider and not have speed tweek yet. reguardless every mech that is lvling will have disadvantages. out side of lvling i cant think of any reason to have a slow spider.

Edited by akpavker, 08 October 2013 - 09:33 PM.

[VXJaeger]

General Taskeen, on 07 October 2013 - 05:29 PM, said:

Good thing Streaks don't require any skill or anything. Couldn't dodge em even with jump jets in my SPD-5V, one blast and you're done.

I love how Jenner/Spider-pilots shread tears after meeting a SBAP-Kintaro Sweeter than honey.

Edited by VXJaeger, 08 October 2013 - 09:47 PM.

[Corwin Vickers]

My brother is a new player and when he bought his spider he had exactly enough money to buy it. It took him a lot of games to buy that 4.3 mil engine, double heat sinks, endo, ferro, and he still doesn't have speed tweak because it's his only spider.

He put the engine in a jaeger though so I don't think he ever plays the spider.