32 replies to this topic

[SnowdogJJJ]

To be clear - I love the game, like where it is going and play all the time. You guys ROCK!
but
What can be done about premature capulation "cappers" game won soley on cap.

You know what I mean, lose or win a game with bearably a shot fired, maybe 1 mech killed?

Here is what I see as some of the challenges.

There is no bonus to defend the base, all c-bills/exp are paid out to damage, components destroyed, spotting and kill assists.

With that type of pay out system (and it work pretty well for the most part) there is no great reason for anyone to defending the base? If you defend and win you make almost nothing since you did not participate in a fight.

A few ideas:
Capping is just a bonus, not the end game. Give an extra 20,000 c-bills to the cappers but the game plays on.

Allow voting on capping being a win or not (end of game), let the game continue.
Death match option (would be cool)

Is there really no solution until we get different game types?

I rarely play Conquest anymore due to the fact that everyone wants to fight and no one wants to cap. There is little reward for capping, if you don't cause damage you don't get compensated, other than winning the game ( very little compensation for winning now) why would I bother capping, just so all my team mates (who fought hard) get tons of c-bills and exp while I get almost nothing. See my point? I am not complaining , just trying to lay out the challenge as I see it and hope/beg for a solution.

"Stay Nominal my friends"

[New Day]

Well it's impossible now, so I don't see why you're complaining about. There is little capping in conquest because cap times are so ******* slow.

Base defenses on assault. Turrets and what not would solve the problem.

[Pyrrho]

I have found a pretty effective strategy to counter my worry that someone will come base cap my team early. I grab my CTF-1X, I find a cozy, well shaded area (with a nice LOS to my base), and then I wait. I wait, and I watch to see how many little lights are coming my way. Usually, when 3 or 4 show up I am able to alert my team to what is going on, surprise at least one of them with a quick death, and then go down in a blaze of glory if a rush of more 'mechs show up.

Sure, I know, waiting around is boring. But, according to you, so is stomping around barely getting off one shot fired before a capture happens.

Sometimes, just sometimes, I can convince a friend or two to hang back and play defense.

On the smaller maps, all bets are off, but on the newer ones it works great.

[SnowdogJJJ]

First of all am not complaining, just stating a fact that needs a solution. And you are wrong it is still an issue with almost everyone I play with (yes less of an issue) but you hear "cap *****" cap Noob" #$@%#@ ******* and the like often in the game these days when it ends as I described.

Since you think there is no issue then you will not have a solution. Your voice has been heard but I think you are in a small minority.

[GumbyC2C]

Assault should be asymmetric with one team having the goal of capping and one team having the goal of defending. There should be a system of perks for both teams in that scenario. Perhaps the attackers get a few orbital bombardments and the defenders get some limited repairs or something along those lines. Or maybe both get limited repairs at their respective starting points and the attacker's repair base can be destroyed by the defenders so as to tempt them to leave their base to gain an advantage on the attackers. Lots of people much smarter than myself work at PGI. They should have some ideas for fixing this issue.

[SnowdogJJJ]

Maybe not allow cap until 1/2 your team is dead and rusting lol

It is just a conversation not a frigging religious war here. ease up and enjoy life

[The Boz]

GumbyC2C, on 22 September 2013 - 05:54 AM, said:

Assault should be asymmetric with one team having the goal of capping and one team having the goal of defending. There should be a system of perks for both teams in that scenario. Perhaps the attackers get a few orbital bombardments and the defenders get some limited repairs or something along those lines. Or maybe both get limited repairs at their respective starting points and the attacker's repair base can be destroyed by the defenders so as to tempt them to leave their base to gain an advantage on the attackers. Lots of people much smarter than myself work at PGI. They should have some ideas for fixing this issue.

What you're describing should be a whole new game type called Siege or something.

[SnowdogJJJ]

For me it is not about stopping the Capture of the base (and losing to it), it is about prolonging the fight. Fighting is something that I think we all enjoy more than winning or losing. There is nothing better than a great battle, with a bit of give and take. I don't like losing to cap but yes that is part of the game. I just am trying to think of better ways to compensate defenders and make the battle last longer.

For beer and bacon!

[Mechteric]

SnowdogJJJ, on 22 September 2013 - 05:32 AM, said:

Allow voting on capping being a win or not (end of game), let the game continue.
Death match option (would be cool)

Then just suggest deathmatch, having capping without having capping make a difference in the outcome of the match makes no sense whatsoever.

[OznerpaG]

the best solution is to play only conquest matches - i haven't played an assault match in 2 months (except by rare accident) and i'v never been happier

and 0% chance of ''premature capulation''

[DocBach]

Yeah, its kind of a really aggravating win or loss to bypass the enemy completely. I'd like to see the speed of the cap in assault nearly halted until a certain percentage of enemies were killed, then have it increase a bit for each enemy killed after that until it finally reaches the current cap rate at like 4 enemy mechs remaining, so you have to actually hurt the enemy to cap. It's pretty dumb to have a Spider with no leg claim a victory over two lances of heavies and assaults because a timer said so.

"Oh well, I know we traveled 30,000 lightyears across space for this fight, but that dude stood around our oil drill thingy, lets pack it up and head back to the dropship!"

"But sir, there's eleven of us left and my sensors are showing the enemy is just a legged spider, we can take it back!"

"I SAID NO, DAMMIT! WE'VE BEEN DEFEATED! RETREAT!"

[Satan n stuff]

In my experience cap wins usually happen because both teams decide to go a certain route ( usually circle right ) and neither side wants to turn to fight when they figure out the enemy is on the opposite side of the map. Then a few players on each team will whine at the enemy for a bit for not turning around, while they themselves are likely already on the enemy base. This might have something to do with a lot of players being afraid of committing to a fight, because when the enemy is on your base you can't back down or you'll lose anyway.
"Let all these PUGs get themselves killed first, I'm too valuable to die" - the vast majority of MWO players.

[Dirus Nigh]

Properly defending your cap points will solve the problem.

[Satan n stuff]

Dirus Nigh, on 22 September 2013 - 07:16 AM, said:

Properly defending your cap points will solve the problem.

If only we had a mech class that could run back to defend and identify what's on the base...

[sokitumi]

The entire cap mechanic is such a crutch for the dev team. Come on... is that the best you can do for over a year? Cap and multi cap? Any word on an actually interesting gametype - dropship - or has that been mothballed too now? Any excuse why simple AI for turrets or w/e is explicably absent from the entire game?

[Nik Van Rhijn]

For whatever reason the devs have been impervious to requests to stop capping - oh wait they did increase cap times so fatties could get back to defend bases most times.
Sorry but it seems to be mostly - I want to run my slow death machine without it having drawbacks. Same people complain about dying to lights a lot of the time.

[PEEFsmash]

It is a win-condition of this gametype that prevents you from taking nothing except Atlases and walking to midmap and crushing anything. It forces scouting, and it gives lights/meds a purpose. This is a base defense/base assault gametype.

The complainers here are just assault/heavy pilots that want their chassis to have nothing except positives. Anything that even forces them to try a little bit hard is too much.

Edited by PEEFsmash, 22 September 2013 - 09:38 AM.

[Purlana]

Not my problem if your "SCOUTS" fail to do their job.....

Edited by Purlana, 22 September 2013 - 09:47 AM.

[Artgathan]

SnowdogJJJ, on 22 September 2013 - 05:32 AM, said:

There is no bonus to defend the base, all c-bills/exp are paid out to damage, components destroyed, spotting and kill assists.

This is incorrect - if you kill another mech standing in your base, you are awarded a "Defensive Kill Bonus" which is good for 10,000 C-Bills and 50 XP (I think. The exact values of the C-Bill and XP reward may be different).

The purpose of the base is to add another strategic layer onto the delightful combat cake. If there was no base capping people would just form a line of 12 assault mechs and steamroll to the other side (this is still actually effective on small maps such as Forest Colony or Caustic Valley).

As PEEFsmash said above, bases give a reason for lighter mobile mechs to exist.

[Bhael Fire]

The "solution" to preventing early capping is to use teamwork and tactics. I think many new/bad players have a very hard time grasping this concept; Capping is there to keep the game strategically diverse.

I rarely have games end early because of capping and when it does happen it's because the players on my team refuse to use teamwork and/or common sense, leaving the base completely exposed.

It's important to realize that one of the implied mission objectives in Assault is to protect your base. If you don't, you deserve to lose.