52 replies to this topic

[Ruccus]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 27 September 2013 - 07:37 PM, said:

Single gauss is viable. On a Blackjack. Gauss is more specialized now, harder to use, and easiest to use when focused on as the primary gun, hence good dual gauss use.

But it works just as well single, it just takes more practice, piloting skill and attention.

It's no heat, fastest flight time and powerful punch are all still very powerful.

I had just under 300 matches with the old Gauss in my Blackjack, and I feel I'd be letting my team down if I continued to run the Gauss. I used the old Gauss because it was a solid, versatile weapon which could both snipe and act as a 'poor man's AC20'. Now if I don't want to go with the standard AC20 build I'll go with dual AC5s which I think is almost as good as the Gauss at sniping and is a much better all-around loadout that can help my team in a variety of situations.

A pair of AC5s have 620 range, a decent projectile velocity, and you can put four rounds on a target in 1.5 seconds then step back in cover. When an enemy mech comes close or when you're in a situation where you're wingmanning an assault mech they destroy the Gauss in dps (6.67dps vs 3.16dps), while still having 67% of the alpha capability of a Gauss. If you count the charge-up they get you 10 damage three quarters of a second before the Gauss' 15 point alpha, then another 10 damage three quarters of a second after the Gauss' alpha. So long as you survive the first Gauss alpha you can put 40 damage on a mech (8 rounds in 4.5 seconds) before you have to worry about the second Gauss round coming at you.

Using the new Gauss in a medium mech turns you into a 'one-trick-pony' that can be effective so long as nobody gets close to you, but if nobody gets close to you the dual AC5 build should be able to put up similar numbers. I suspect if you ran ten matches in a Blackjack with a dual AC5 build and another ten with a Gauss build the highest damage single match might go to the Gauss but the average damage of all the matches would probably go to the dual AC5s.

[kuangmk11]

Here is how I would change it (while keeping the charge mechanic).

• Allow it to stay charged as long as the button is held
  
• only explodes while charged
  
• generates some heat while its charged
  
• Give it some loud and obvious sounds for its recycle and charge
  
• if the button is held again after firing but before the recycle, charge it again.

[thesleepyslam]

i was expecting this thread to be about how gauss rifles are overpowered.

Honestly i'm running the old dual gauss cat build that i made back when the game first went open beta. i'm havin' great games.

[Ruccus]

thesleepyslam, on 29 September 2013 - 07:21 PM, said:

i was expecting this thread to be about how gauss rifles are overpowered.

Honestly i'm running the old dual gauss cat build that i made back when the game first went open beta. i'm havin' great games.

As both a Blackjack pilot and Jagermech pilot, I'd argue that with the firing change the Dual Gauss is not underpowered but the Single Gauss is. When fitting weaponry there are some issues to contend with like weight, ghost heat, and hardpoints. Most mechs have enough hardpoints that the firepower of a single Gauss can be easily surpassed by two of a different weapon without a significant hit to alpha strike capabilities, but it becomes more difficult to surpass the low heat, long range 30 point alpha of a dual Gauss due to hardpoint restrictions and ghost heat.

The Gauss has become kind of like a big machinegun - running two of them works a lot better than one.

[ReXspec]

CYBRN4CR, on 26 September 2013 - 10:26 PM, said:

That means the other 55% actually like it. Which means according to PGI, it's balanced.

If almost everyone uses it over everything else, it's not balanced. Which guess what? Was actually happening a few months ago.

PPC/Gauss meta anyone? Hmm? HMM? Remember that? It's all anyone was ever talking about. Thus it needed to happen.

And guess what? They succeeded in de-synching them, and not only that but made the Gauss a role-specific weapon - in the same category as LRMs. Good from afar not so good up close. But at least the Gauss can still hit up close. The only catch is you now need to be skilled with the weapon to do so.

And you know what? Let's say they didn't have such a mechanic? With the change in PPCs such players would be flocking to Gauss in droves because it was super-buffed with the speed PPCs used to enjoy. Especially with the AZ module. Oh man! There would be no end to it! Dual Gauss! Dual Gauss all I ever see is Dual Gauss! Even MORE pinpoint damage complaints.

Even a change to the cooldown to 6 seconds alone wouldn't be enough to stop such a shift. You know why? Because every sniper during that meta said that it wouldn't stop them from still doing pinpoint damage.

But you know what is? The charge mechanic. It didn't stop the pinpoint damage. You know why? Because PGI wants these weapons to have pinpoint damage. But I'll tell you what it did stop flat in its tracks. Almost everyone using them except for the dedicated few. Which is exactly what PGI wants.

Now when someone plays Dual Gausses, and does well in it, who in their right mind is going to say that's OP or cheesy? Very very few. Because now it takes a lot of skill to do well in one, which is what a weapon with the lowest amount of bullet drop, highest damage at the lowest possible heat and second best max range with the best bullet speed (the ideal damage at range weapon) in the game needs. A hard meta-prevention mechanic. Enough for a lot of people to say it's scrap at face value, but not enough that barely anyone uses it because it is absolutely impossible to use. If it was truly absolutely impossible to use, not even I a low class sniper could use it, and it would see less use than a Narc. But I can work around the mechanics and have gotten kills it. And so have others. This means it still has the same power as before, and in a truly skilled player's hands it has the power to be very deadly.

So honestly? It needs no buffs to stats. If anything the audio cues do need to be buffed so you can hear them better in a firefight.

The gauss rifle has been repeatedly mutilated for the sake of "balance" time and time again on this particular rendition of mechwarrior. The OP has a point: It is not NEARLY where it should be, and I don't think the devs (or what the majority of MWO players except old Battletech-ers like me) realize what the Gauss was intended for.

I think the devs are getting too bogged down with the concept of "balance" and not realizing that, in the battletech universe, certain weapon systems were rendered either completely obsolete, or useful only in niche situations. This was also true for the previous mechwarrior games.

The Gauss is a compromise between a heavy-hitting, ballistic weapon system, and a low heat, low-caliber AC. Ergo, it is going to make certain weapon systems obsolete or under-par on certain mechs.

Plus there is NO justifiable reason the charge is on the Gauss rifle other then "balance." If they really want to balance the Gauss, then I propose this:

1. Take off the charge entirely.

2. Keep the charge, but have the charge last as long as the trigger is held down. This will fix the frustrating accuracy problems snipers are having with the weapon.

You're right. It needs NO buffs to stats, but those are my suggestions as far as mechanics for the weapon system goes.

[Curccu]

Gauss is fine.

[ReXspec]

Curccu, on 29 September 2013 - 10:57 PM, said:

Gauss is fine.

Either a troll, a bad joke, or sarcasm.

[Curccu]

ReXspec, on 29 September 2013 - 11:07 PM, said:

Either a troll, a bad joke, or sarcasm.

Honest opinion, I use gauss a lot and like it. My dual gauss 3D is one of the most lethal mechs I have.

[R Razor]

Get Punkbuster or some other software that eliminates macros and all weapons (UAC-5, Gauss) that are PGI balanced through a timing mechanism suddenly become balanced as intended. That's not to say they'd be perfect but at least they'd be in line with what the designers conceived.

[ReXspec]

Curccu, on 29 September 2013 - 11:10 PM, said:

Honest opinion, I use gauss a lot and like it. My dual gauss 3D is one of the most lethal mechs I have.

Oh I love my Gauss on my Atlas-K-- I just see no justifiable reason (canonically speaking and balance wise) why the charge on the Gauss has to be there. If anything, it's an arbitrary inconvenience at best, and makes it downright impossible to use the gauss at worst.

[Curccu]

R Razor, on 29 September 2013 - 11:19 PM, said:

Get Punkbuster or some other software that eliminates macros and all weapons (UAC-5, Gauss) that are PGI balanced through a timing mechanism suddenly become balanced as intended. That's not to say they'd be perfect but at least they'd be in line with what the designers conceived.

What does macro really give you when using gauss?

[R Razor]

Curccu, on 29 September 2013 - 11:38 PM, said:

What does macro really give you when using gauss?

No need to remember to release within a certain window..........for snipers not so much, but in a brawl where you're moving and watching targets and it takes more coordination than a sniper it can make a huge difference.

[CANCERBERO]

well... i like the gause riffle...i prefer the old style but is not a big deal is just practice...the real thing that bothers me is the sound..was quite low and now with the new one its worse ...i know i know you have the green sign to show you when your gause are ready...but when you are on a close fight and you are using the weapon like a brawler and not like a snipper i dont look that green spot..im trying to aim...and with all the other sounds are impossible to hear the charge and now its worse.

My other question is..ppc and er ppc should not charge in the same way

here i leave a video where you can see how a gause works and why the way of the charge on mwo is wrong

Edited by CANCERBERO, 02 January 2014 - 12:49 PM.