187 replies to this topic

[SubXulu]

Because when you have a pair of them firing like a double barrel shotgun, the sound they make is simply awesome ... surely that is reason enough.

"This... is my boomstick!"

Edited by SubXulu, 01 October 2013 - 12:57 AM.

[Captain Stiffy]

For the record the "LB" in LB 10-X is "Large Bore"

[Zyllos]

Captain Stiffy, on 03 October 2013 - 09:02 PM, said:

For the record the "LB" in LB 10-X is "Large Bore"

The "X" also usually means "extended range". So why is the LBX considered a shotgun by PGI if it's an extended range AC?

What the LBX should be doing is firing a flak canister that bursts when within X meters from a solid object in front of it's flight path, releasing it's pellets out in a spray. What this does it let the LBX have further range than a regular AC at the expense of being spread out and terrible against armored locations. But hit unarmored locations, you have a pretty good chance of destroying equipment there.

I do also agree that the critical hit mechanics is just done plainly wrong. For critical hits to matter, either internal structure has to survive MUCH longer so that repeated hits don't just completely destroy a section (which is why players aim for torso sections instead of arms, you just remove the arm, deny the mech any armor points allocated there, and take off any weapons that was mounted in both locations) -OR- getting a critical hit is dangerous to equipment, regardless of what weapon it getting the critical hit.

I personally would suggest doing a combination of both above plus one more thing.

• Instead of internal structure equaling 50% of maximum armor, I would make internal structure equal 100% of the armor. This just straight up makes mechs 25% more survivable.
  
• Lower the HP of all equipment in the game so that just a few hits, even from an AC/5, is extremely dangerous for weapons.
  
• Remove the 2x/3x critical hits chance from all weapons except those that are considered "Critical Seekers". Remove the extra damage to internal structure from critical hits. Then make SRM/SSRM be considered "Critical Seeking" weapons (meaning they have a 1x/2x/3x chance).

But this should be done in combination with a fix to pin point accuracy and weapon convergence.

Edited by Zyllos, 03 October 2013 - 09:22 PM.

[FerrolupisXIII]

because i cant aim

[F lan Ker]

S!

LBX could use some love. It is after all an advanced AC/10. The cluster ammo does not even work as in BT where the slug breaks to clusters some 90m before target, not right away after leaving barrel. And where is selectable ammo slugs/clusters? I use the LBX to kill lights, even the Spider dies when hit and any Mech without armor is soon dead. Sure not a ranged weapon and needs a team to be effective but nevertheless, I like the boom of it

[Johnny Reb]

Khobai, on 27 September 2013 - 01:05 PM, said:

There are no advantages to it really. Its worse than an AC/10. And much worse than two AC/5s.

Even the the one thing LB10Xs are supposed to be good at, which is getting critical hits, its considerably worse at doing than an AC/10.

Like machine guns if you got exposed components then the lbx rocks, if the target has armor not so much.

[Kmieciu]

Every time someone says that an LBX is great against light mechs I shed a tear :-) Only when you are incapable of hitting fast targets with other pinpoint weapons. The most dangerous weapons are those that can leg a light mech in one ore two salvos:
2xAC20, AC20+2xERPPC (2xPPC at 90-270 range), 2xGauss, 3x AC10. Any light mech pilot can confirm that. One minute you are running at 150 kph, the suddenly you loose a leg and slow down to a crawl, and then seconds later you die.

Spreading damage all over a light mech is the worst thing you can do. If you see a Spider with only cockpit armor left and red internals all over it means your team has failed miserably at aiming. I have seen 3 or 4 people armed with lasers, lbxs and srms chasing a Spider for 5 minutes before putting it down. On the other hand, I have also seen guys armed with 3xAC10 or 4xAC5 that leg light mechs in seconds.

LBX is a great weapon to brawl against an Awesome, Dragon, Tebuchet, Cicada and Kintaro and Orion. Those mechs have enormous center torsos. No matter where you aim, you hit the center torso. Especially when they don't torso twist. But against a smart enemy that torso twists and uses jump jets? Forget about it. Try your LBX against a Centurion, and throw in some SSRM if your at it ;-)

LBX is great for doing lots of damage and assists, and also for kill stealing. But those things will not win you matches. The guys that carry the team use PPCs and AC20 to punch holes through enemy assaults and to leg the lights. They can disable a Highlander or a Victor by doing just 120 damage (3 salvos).

LBX users are like the machine gun spiders - they need other people to be effective.

Edited by Kmieciu, 03 October 2013 - 11:10 PM.

[F lan Ker]

S!

Well as said before, LBX is a team weapon. Centurions die with it fast if you know where to hit them, lights are legged fine with it too and firing it at close range can headshot the as well. Jump jetting Mechs are not a problem either, timing is the key. But as said, massive damage is done with other weapons, but LBX has it's role too.

[Tincan Nightmare]

Captain Stiffy, on 03 October 2013 - 09:02 PM, said:

For the record the "LB" in LB 10-X is "Large Bore"

Not to be too much of a {Noble MechWarrior} (but what the hell I am) I'm pretty sure it stands for Lubalin Ballistics, the original developer of the weapon. Course you may have known that and just been making a play on words, but I get a cheap thrill when I get to throw information of little import out into the internet.

[JuiceKeeper]

personaly i am using them on ctf 4x, i built once again that metal salad build after lbx spread decrease and i must say its amazing and fun to play definitly viable. u cant rush to fronline on 1st minute of battle but for hunting solos and finishing enemies its really fun

[psihius]

AC/10 or any other weapon can't give you 7 components destroyed + kill from a single light like using 2 LB-X 10 on a Jaggermech/Atlas/Cataphract
It's more of a "finish'em'all" weapon, extreemly effective at the end of the match when everyone is half-baked. The idea is to be a fire support and not a front-line brawler.

We used my D atlas with 2 LB-X as a "finish him" version after two teammates on their atlases striped the armor from the enemy and moved to sides to shield their torsos from the damage. Works like a charm.

[MustrumRidcully]

I think one way to sum up the LBX problems is:
Hitting is necessary, but not sufficient.

[Mcgral18]

Thejuggla, on 30 September 2013 - 10:12 PM, said:

Think its spread is fine, just needs more damage. Somewhere around gauss(15 damage) would be good I think. Would be a decent softener at range and a good brawling weapon closer up.

....if it did that much damage it would be rather overpowered. It's not bad where it is, but what it really needs it that bursting cluster round and slug ammo. I don't think PGI is going to give us those, though.

[Ngamok]

Because they sound cool as heck.

[Dexion]

Because 3 of them On a CTF IM is to much fun NOT to do it...

And switching them out for AC10's doesn't leave enough room for ammo lol.

[GMAK]

Mcchuggernaut, on 27 September 2013 - 01:03 PM, said:

I have almost never seen anyone using them. What's wrong with them? Do they need some kind of buff? What are their advantages/disadvantages over other ballistic weapons? It seems to me that since they are so close range specialized that they should either do more damage per projectile (thereby making up for the short range and spread by being very deadly up close) or fire faster than the other longer ranged heavy hitters like the AC20. Do I just not know what I'm talking about or am I right?

Edit: Do they crit internals more often like machine guns?

Whats wrong with them?
It's that the spread do damage to all part of the mech instead of a single part. Compare to ac10.
This is the reason why I don't use it. I think it could get a buff.

[Captain Stiffy]

Mcgral18, on 30 September 2013 - 08:29 AM, said:

I've found 3 LB10Xs to be more effective than 3 AC10s, but probably because my aim is rather poor. It's very nice for taking lights out, and will outperform most things other than an AC40 in a brawl. Only downside is a squishy XL engine.

For the same tonnage as 3 AC10s, you can also get 3 LB10Xs and 3 MLs. If I could aim better, perhaps the AC10s would have better performance.

This is the point the whole issue turns on - sometimes you can be accurate and sometimes you just can't but with LB10's you get damage when you want it even on 'impossible' shots.

[Dago Red]

Thejuggla, on 30 September 2013 - 10:12 PM, said:

Think its spread is fine, just needs more damage. Somewhere around gauss(15 damage) would be good I think. Would be a decent softener at range and a good brawling weapon closer up.

I wonder if it would be possible to make them do extra damage if they don't hit the same component? Like say any area that takes more than one pellet takes the standard 1 damage but a section that gets wacked by a lone one takes 2. So it at least works as well as srms at long range and then can be used for pinpoint work closer up without overpowering it.

Mind you getting hits to register at all seems to be hard enough that I'm sure this is an infeasible idea.

[TexAce]

While I agree they need a tiny little buff they are still fun as a double barrel shotgun on a jäger.

[Captain Stiffy]

Zyllos, on 03 October 2013 - 09:21 PM, said:

The "X" also usually means "extended range".

According to Sarna;

Quote

The LB 10-X Autocannon, having a higher caliber, causes higher damage than lower-caliber autocannons, though it is limited to medium range.

I have a copy of CITYTECH right here but it doesn't talk about that.

Edited by Captain Stiffy, 04 October 2013 - 08:25 PM.