37 replies to this topic

[Johnny Reb]

My current Kintaro might fit the bill, only has one erLL for the long range engagements but its is deadly to lights and a serious threat to everyone else.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...038311e6e70b540
Also, why tag? Cause it lets the streak lock on so much faster, totally worth it when running 5 streaks.

[Void Angel]

Something I haven't seen mentioned in the replies I scanned - buy three variants of a chassis and skill them up. Once you get enough pilot skills unlocked, the basic level bonuses double, and it's like playing a whole new 'mech. You can keep going with the Hunchback; it will give you a good blend of firepower and speed (I recommend the P and SP to round out the chassis,) while the Cataphract is a solid choice as well. Unlocking the pilot skills will noticeably increase the performance of your 'mech.

Also, a word of caution; while you can (and probably should) sell 'mechs back in order to free up mech bays, be aware that unless you actually have an owned variant in your mech bay, you cannot purchase pilot skills for it - even with general experience (GXP.) I'm currently short one Atlas (and one 'mech bay) from mastering that chassis, and that extra module slot is important.

[Johnny Reb]

Great advice, you want better abilities need to get 3 of the same good threads explaining it! Search!

[Krivvan]

I'd actually say what you're looking for is a Jenner.

But my answer to almost everything is "Jenner."

[Aym]

Krivvan in a Jenner IS the answer to everything, but seriously Jenner is a solid option, as is Cataphract 3D for what you're describing, although in different ways.

[Void Angel]

I wouldn't recommend a light chassis right now - you want to have solid piloting skills before you do that, lights are a niche playing style, and it's not what he actually was looking to play anyway.

That being said, I do enjoy my lights. At least in PuGs.

[Conso]

Void Angel, on 03 October 2013 - 10:56 PM, said:

Something I haven't seen mentioned in the replies I scanned - buy three variants of a chassis and skill them up. Once you get enough pilot skills unlocked, the basic level bonuses double, and it's like playing a whole new 'mech. You can keep going with the Hunchback; it will give you a good blend of firepower and speed (I recommend the P and SP to round out the chassis,) while the Cataphract is a solid choice as well. Unlocking the pilot skills will noticeably increase the performance of your 'mech.

Also, a word of caution; while you can (and probably should) sell 'mechs back in order to free up mech bays, be aware that unless you actually have an owned variant in your mech bay, you cannot purchase pilot skills for it - even with general experience (GXP.) I'm currently short one Atlas (and one 'mech bay) from mastering that chassis, and that extra module slot is important.

I am aware of pilot skills, I've unlocked all the basic skills of my hunchback with 10,000 XP to spare, and I do intend on focusing on buying variants after I've finished upgrading my main 'mech. The problem with that at the moment, however, is cost. Since your income is directly tied to your performance, having a 'mech with which I am competent with is essential to progressing. I also don't want to repeat the mistake I made with my CTF-4X where I throw away millions only to find out it doesn't suit my needs (admittedly, that was because I checked all specs save for speed, since all the other CTFs had the same; carelessness on my part).

I have gotten relatively good with my hunchback, pulling in around 100,000 a match instead of the 30,000 I was getting before, but I want to make sure there aren't any other mechs I'd be better with before dropping over 7,000,000 c-Bills.

Void Angel, on 04 October 2013 - 10:33 AM, said:

I wouldn't recommend a light chassis right now - you want to have solid piloting skills before you do that, lights are a niche playing style, and it's not what he actually was looking to play anyway.

That being said, I do enjoy my lights. At least in PuGs.

Right. I have no doubt that lights can be very effective, in the right hands. But I currently lack the expertise in handling mechs to do anything more useful than annoy assault mechs by running circles around them before getting my shiny metal rear-torso curb stomped by medium and other light mechs.


Speaking of lights. I have a question about XL engines. Are they considered a "must have" if you can afford it? When should they not be used?

[Appogee]

scJazz, on 02 October 2013 - 05:54 PM, said:

While you are there check out the Cataphract 3D which has always been a usable "competitive" mech no matter what the currect FOTM happens to be.

Now... just...
buy a Cataphract 3D
pew pew with ballistics, with energy backups and JJ
???
Win

When PGI gets bored with the currect Ballistic OP Meta and nerfs them because people got tired of me blowing their arms off with Autocannons you can switch up line 2 to read... "pew pew with Energy with Ballistics backups and JJ" at which point the cycle of weapon balancing will revert to the original case and the cycle begins again. During this process the Cataphract 3D will never suck so have fun!

EDIT: Bonus points! I forgot! Cataphract is a form of Heavy Cavalry! You wanted a Lancer/Knight well here you go
http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Cataphract

^This.

[saagri]

I would suggest a Victor, although the xl engine needed for it would be brutal to buy.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...fef16dce728ac7e

The gauss is a bit hard to use up close but because of it's speed and low heat generation it could still be useful and the gauss can peg lights with careful aiming as well as being long ranged.
SRM's for close range punch and medium lasers for the versatility at short to medium range.
JJ's are a must and if you use it in battle can spread damage easily and help traverse terrain.
Max 78 kph makes you one fast assualt, 70.9 without speed tweak.
You might want to play around with the armor values a bit but generally it's always best to keep them infront of you hence almost all the armor is up front.
Also, don't forget to torso twist, this mech can easily twist, fire, then twist to spread out damage.

Edited by saagri, 05 October 2013 - 12:18 PM.

[Appogee]

Conso, on 05 October 2013 - 11:46 AM, said:

Speaking of lights. I have a question about XL engines. Are they considered a "must have" if you can afford it? When should they not be used?

Like everything in MechWarrior, the choice of XL vs Standard engine requires trade-offs.

XL Engines:
+ are lighter, enabling you to carry bigger weapons and equipment payloads
- extend into your side torsii, which means you will die if you lose your side torsii
- use up additional slots. (Sometimes you can run out of available slots before you run out of payload tons.)
- cost a lot of money

Standard Engines
+ inexpensive
+ don't expose you to the risk of ''death from side torsii''
+ don't require additional slots (enabling the minor Ferro Fibrous armor upgrade to be an option)
- heavy, significantly reducing your weapons and equipment payloads

In practice, whether you will want to use an XL or stay standard varies from Mech to Mech, and from loadout to loadout. So there's no ''one size fits all answer'' to your question.

Examples of Which Engine to Use When:
. XL are rarely used in Stalkers or Atlases, as those chassis already have heaps of tons of payload, but wide torsii. XL would not be worth the additional exposure to 'death by torsii', and it would use up too many slots.
. XL engines are almost always used in Light Mechs, because you want to every additional ton you can get for payload, their side torsii are usually pretty small, and the additional speed makes them hard to hit.
. People usually mount Standard engines in their Centurions, because uniquely,, that chassis takes reduced damaged to the CT through its torsii, and its two energy hardpoints in the CT mean it can zombie on.
. I sometimes use a Standard engine in my Cataphract 3D and Firebrand, precisely because noone expects it. They always shoot out the side torso first - then get a bad surprise when I keep shooting back!


I hope this assists your understanding.

Edited by Appogee, 05 October 2013 - 12:33 PM.

[scJazz]

Conso, on 05 October 2013 - 11:46 AM, said:

Speaking of lights. I have a question about XL engines. Are they considered a "must have" if you can afford it? When should they not be used?

They are a must have for Lights, yes. If you can't afford one for a light then do not buy a light.

As for other mechs they should be used when the shape of the Mech makes it acceptable.

You can view this guide to consider shapes.
http://mwomercs.com/...x-localisation/

Stopping here since Appogee just answered it.

[Koniving]

You can, actually, get away with max engine size and max armor on a light that does not require ammunition. But if you want anything worth while in terms of weapons on a light that doesn't have lower arm actuators, you'd best throw in that XL engine.

Here's an idea of what you can do with 25 tons if you don't have an XL...

Spoiler

[muskrat]

My Vote is for the Cataphrat 3D
Very versital Mech
Sniper build
Gaussx2 PPc
Support build
AC10 ERLLx2 MedLaserx2
AC5x2 ERLLx2 MLx2
Brawler build
AC20 Medlaserx4
AC20,Lbx10 Mlx4
JJ on all
Good armor, speed

Muskrat

[Clideb50]

Conso, on 02 October 2013 - 05:27 PM, said:

That is to say a versatile class that combines decent survivablity with good mobility and high damage. Able to perform most roles competently if required, but at its best when using that mobility and versatility to engage the enemy where he is at a disadvantage.

That is to say a versatile class that combines decent survivablity with good mobility and high damage. Able to perform most roles competently.

That is to say a versatile class that combines decent survivablity with good mobility and high damage.

...

You, yes you! I have the perfect 'mech for you! The Centurion Medium Battlemech. Particularly the CN9-A. It has a default speed of 64.8 kph and is equipped with an AC10, 2 medium lasers, and an LRM 10. A lot of players will take the ac10 off, max the armor out, put in a bigger engine and fill the missile rack with SRM6's. I've not had much success with this, but I've seen people go tear through enemy lances when done properly. Mine is fitted with an LB-10X, 2 med lasers and 2 streaks. (link)

I'll leave this little info vid as extra info about the centurion. I hope it helps. Welcome to mwo by the way!


EDIT: I forgot about 2 factors that also make the Centurion nice:
1) The left arm can equip nothing. While this sounds dumb, it's actually a shield. About to take a terrible hit from an enemy mech? Spin your torso around and left that so called "useless" left arm take the hit for you. It takes some practice but once you get it down, it's an extra 40-something armor points to your mech's health.
2) The Centurion is often called a "zombie" 'mech. Many Centurions have returned from the battlefield with nothing but their head, center torso, and one leg intact. The center torso on the Centurion is tiny, so you'll most likely lose a side before your center. Plus the fact that the center can equip two energy weapons means even that only 3 parts left Centurion is still a threat.

Edited by Regulus1990, 05 October 2013 - 02:14 PM.

[Void Angel]

Conso, on 05 October 2013 - 11:46 AM, said:

Speaking of lights. I have a question about XL engines. Are they considered a "must have" if you can afford it? When should they not be used?

They're must-have; finances do not enter into it. Essentially, a light relies on speed to survive, and does not have the tonnage available to both forgo an XL and mount significant firepower while maintaining that speed. For example, a Jenner with a standard 300 engine and decent armor would be able to mount a grand total of two medium lasers - and nothing else. Lights are so fragile already that the XL limitation doesn't hurt them too much, and they need the weight reduction in order to obtain reasonable firepower for their size.

In general, XL engines should be used on any chassis that uses high speed, or that has small side torso boxes. One of the main complaints I hear from Awesome pilots, for example, is that their center torso hitboxes are too large. Because of this, they cannot torso twist and spread damage as effectively; spread weapons like LB-X autocannons and SRMs strike more on the CT, and their 'mech is far more fragile in practice than their Stalker cousins. The Cataphract is in the same boat - unless you are rolling with a dedicated close-range brawler, I recommend an XL every time. If you're going to take the punishment, you may as well take advantage.

Conversely, mounting an XL engine on an Atlas is an excellent way to acquire ridicule. The Atlas has balanced torso hitboxes, maximal toughness, and a good torso twisting range. Combined with its humaniform arms, this allows it incredible durability in the hands of a skilled player - it can be killed, of course, but it dies hard under anything but the most overwhelming concentrated fire. Even more than the Atlas, however, the Stalker's side torsos do not support XL. They extend down the length of the 'mech (except the top - that's still CT) making the Stalker very easy to cripple or kill from the side - and hard to kill from the front due to the narrow profile.

Bah, I see that others have already explained more or less what I just said, but there's enough differences in opinion that I'll leave my contribution intact. =) In practice, you should avoid XLs unless you have a good reason or find your chassis never gets side-cored - and lights ALWAYS have a good reason.

[Sadistic Savior]

Conso, on 05 October 2013 - 11:46 AM, said:

Speaking of lights. I have a question about XL engines. Are they considered a "must have" if you can afford it? When should they not be used?

They should not be used if you plan on being in a position where you will take damage.

IMO, XLs should be confined to mechs used for scouting/spotting or long range support with ECM. If you are going to be getting hit a lot (or risking it) they are a bad idea. Double the chances of getting killed. I would only ever even consider them on lights...on Mediums or heavies or assaults they are practically suicide. As the attacker, I LOVE attacking mechs with XL engines. They are much easier to kill.

I played a hunchback in a game last week...at the end of the game I was missing both torsos, both arms, and a leg...I was still able to attack (head mounted medium pulse laser). You cannot do that with an XL. I would have been dead long ago.

Edited by Sadistic Savior, 07 October 2013 - 07:54 AM.

[Void Angel]

That being said, Victors and the like often do very well with XLs - and I'm seriously considering slapping an XL 400 in my Battlemaster. Hee-hee!

[Conso]

Okay, so a little update. I've been playing around with my new phoenix pack Shadowhawk and I'll quickly summarize my feelings about it with this picture.






I just bought the Speed Tweak Efficiency and I'm saving up for a better XL Engine: I'm thinking somewhere in the 300-310 range. The current build I'm testing has a XL Engine 275, two AC/5s and an AC/2. It has worked out excellently, so far. I find it difficult to express how much I love autocannons. This was the end result of my last match.



After I've bought everything I want for my Shadowhawk, I'll start fiddling with my Battlemaster and test out a heavier, harder hitting version of my playstyle. Then I'll try out my Locust and see if I can't get better with light mechs for a change.