39 replies to this topic

[Deathlike]

Well, have fun... it's on sale now!

[Karazyr]

Electron Junkie, on 08 October 2013 - 05:28 AM, said:

The problem is that the hitboxes are so borked that you can shoot a shutdown Spider with two AC20's and it will just power up and scoot away taking ZERO DAMAGE. Multiply that by 4 Spiders in a match and it is broken.

When we are having matches where a single Spider is Center Coring 6 Heavy/Assault mechs and taking almost zero damage through out the entire match there is an exploit that needs to be addressed.

omg lawl you really think that happens? really? oh god you really do....

if you shoot a spider whilst it is STILL it will die, no amount of hitbox borking will change that, when its moving that's a different story. spiders are not the invincible boogy men of mwo they are just slightly annoying lights, as i stated before if you are really getting wiped out by something that has 3 weapons you need to rethink your strategy.

dont take this as a defense of spiders, they are broken but they are hardly god mode.

[Wesxander]

Funny I just tried the running and out 6 mechs. My strat involves hugging them so they cant shoot me without shooting their own friendlies. First mech targets me I rewind in my spider from behind a highlander circling him to 30 meters out in front. He takes his shots naturally as I am teleported out. Then another mech targets me again I get rewound out to where his computer says I should be not the servers. Again. I resume course to one the highlanders can you guess what happened again? That's right give them a NO prize I get rewound out from the mech again in front the mech that just targeted again. Die in fireball. Going 151 kph. ping is about 55 to 70 most the time. 59 ms this time I think. Core I 7, 8 ghz 1333mzh ram, 77Z mother board, GTX 650 TI boost card. FPs running about 45 to 78. 152fps in some zones. Had same issue in core I 3 I had but it went away for week while I did my new core I 7. Anyone says spiders cant die and ungodly more so than any other mech is unfairly biased because they have hard time with them want them gone. I been core shot in the past month easier than anything thanks to the new improved "Rewind" exploit being used by most players.

[ShadowSpirit]

I can't help but wonder if it's coincidence that two of the champion mechs are mechs with known hitbox issues? It's probably a simple thing such as, "Well it's a popular chassis."

Which, hopefully leads to the question ... why is it popular? Anecdotal evidence has strongly supported (and more recently hard evidence) that the Spider, Centurion are "supremely durable" for their weight class(es).

[Nihtgenga]

Derrpy, on 08 October 2013 - 12:31 PM, said:

omg lawl you really think that happens? really? oh god you really do....

if you shoot a spider whilst it is STILL it will die, no amount of hitbox borking will change that, when its moving that's a different story. spiders are not the invincible boogy men of mwo they are just slightly annoying lights, as i stated before if you are really getting wiped out by something that has 3 weapons you need to rethink your strategy.

dont take this as a defense of spiders, they are broken but they are hardly god mode.

No one talked about "god mode", but there is enough evidence that if you shoot a spider, there are chances that the hit will not be registered - regardless, if the mech is moving or not. This is a known issue also with other chassis like the Centurion. Take into account that this may happen more than once in a match, and you know the point we're hinting to.

Wesxander, on 08 October 2013 - 03:09 PM, said:

I been core shot in the past month easier than anything thanks to the new improved "Rewind" exploit being used by most players.

We're not talking about the rewind exploit here. That's a separate issue and not bound to the spider chassis alone.

[Al Bert]

well i think all (well: most) of you qualify for the next community award, reading these posts *sigh* you should have - just maybe - read this

Edited by Al Bert, 09 October 2013 - 09:12 AM.

[Ridersofdoom]

yep its true Centurions are inmortal too.

[LtPoncho]

Those 5 Streak Kintaro's have a purpose now...it's the only thing that will bring them down quick.

[mikromancer]

I'm not so sure it's the hitboxes as much as the ballistic/missile HSR having problems.

I know for a fact that I've annihilated spiders several times with a a single ac/20 round, so when I hit a spider dead centre with an ac20 or a load of artemis srm/12 I expect it to politely explode for me. either that or be very bloody hurt, to the point where internals are splashing out all over the place and someone can nail him dead with a small laser.

in conclusion, anyone defending spider/fast mech HSR breakage right now is exploiting it for profit, or has never had an invincible light mech core their heavy/assault from the front and is crazy.

[Namerof]

mikromancer, on 09 October 2013 - 11:56 AM, said:

I'm not so sure it's the hitboxes as much as the ballistic/missile HSR having problems.

I know for a fact that I've annihilated spiders several times with a a single ac/20 round, so when I hit a spider dead centre with an ac20 or a load of artemis srm/12 I expect it to politely explode for me. either that or be very bloody hurt, to the point where internals are splashing out all over the place and someone can nail him dead with a small laser.

in conclusion, anyone defending spider/fast mech HSR breakage right now is exploiting it for profit, or has never had an invincible light mech core their heavy/assault from the front and is crazy.

The problem with that is it happens with lasers too, so I'm going to have to disagree with you there.

[Nihtgenga]

Al Bert, on 09 October 2013 - 09:11 AM, said:

well i think all (well: most) of you qualify for the next community award, reading these posts *sigh* you should have - just maybe - read this

Yeah, sure, guess point 1+2 are valid. Neither do such things exist on a broad scale despite many proofing vids, nor is it good style to even talk about it, because it has been around for a long time and already mentioned somewhere.

Now THATs a good contribution and will help much more in both informing newer players and accelerate correction by PGI, which has not happened since months despite widespread ticketing. Excuse me, of course I will shut my mouth in humbleness and leave this perfect game without any doubt or possible (of course not reasonable) criticism of any kind immediately.

[Flying Judgement]

Derrpy, on 07 October 2013 - 05:43 PM, said:

dude it has 3 weapons, if your getting owned by a mech that can fit at most 1 ll and 2 ml you need to think about your life.

i will admit its broken but its hardly game breaking, more just irritating.

whot ? O.o
i have a large pulse laser and 2 medpulse laser in my spider thats around 23 alpha strike werry fast reload time easy to aim and minimal heat issue extremely small profile and fast.
On top
its have the invisible shield in front!

http://www.youtube.c...d&v=1CkiNvfy1vs

and an 80 % AC 20 resistance...



u cant just ignore me in the spider its almost have the same bad hit detection as the raven 3L had a few mounts ago.
And 3 alpha in the back usually kills everything. making 4 kills and 500 + damage not to rare either

Edited by Flying Judgement, 09 October 2013 - 10:12 PM.

[Karazyr]

Flying Judgement, on 09 October 2013 - 09:59 PM, said:

whot ? O.o
i have a large pulse laser and 2 medpulse laser in my spider thats around 23 alpha strike werry fast reload time easy to aim and minimal heat issue extremely small profile and fast.
On top
its have the invisible shield in front!

http://www.youtube.c...d&v=1CkiNvfy1vs

and an 80 % AC 20 resistance...


u cant just ignore me in the spider its almost have the same bad hit detection as the raven 3L had a few mounts ago.
And 3 alpha in the back usually kills everything. making 4 kills and 500 + damage not to rare either

11tonnes of weaponry? build please i find that hard to believe.

i never said the spider didn't have bad hit detection, i said its not game breaking like some people say it is, some people just cant comprehend that a good pilot can kill their fatty mech.

considering the people who QQ about the spider have ping in the 200s im not surprised they are having hit problems, latency happens people

[Mehlan]

Derrpy, on 10 October 2013 - 05:35 AM, said:

11tonnes of weaponry? build please i find that hard to believe.

i never said the spider didn't have bad hit detection, i said its not game breaking like some people say it is, some people just cant comprehend that a good pilot can kill their fatty mech.

considering the people who QQ about the spider have ping in the 200s im not surprised they are having hit problems, latency happens people

It's doable...and gets maybe 5 alphas( 3.25 cooldown @ 22.6 if I recall correctly) before it cooks itself. Mechlab gives it, roughly 18 seconds before overheat

[Karazyr]

Mehlan, on 10 October 2013 - 06:11 AM, said:

It's doable...and gets maybe 5 alphas( 3.25 cooldown @ 22.6 if I recall correctly) before it cooks itself. Mechlab gives it, roughly 18 seconds before overheat

sure its doable but not very smart, 1ll and 2 ml would net you better overall performance whilst maintaining ecm and JJS, with that build you can alpha all day every day doing 19? damage +long range

[Mehlan]

Derrpy, on 10 October 2013 - 06:43 AM, said:

sure its doable but not very smart, 1ll and 2 ml would net you better overall performance whilst maintaining ecm and JJS, with that build you can alpha all day every day doing 19? damage +long range

Im not arguing with you, pointing out it was viable.... personaly. I like/prefer the 5k. No worries about heat regardless of the map, reduce the jets and bump up the armor.

[Fragger56]

I've just done some math and figured out how large the Spider is supposed to be and from this, it seems pretty obvious why spiders "take little damage"

A spider at full speed can move at up to 150+ KPH, at 150 KPH the mech is moving at a rate of 41.6 meters per second.

Now the rate of travel in M/S is important, as once you factor in ping, you should realise that the spider, on the server end can be a significant distance away from the client POV.

In my case, I typically have a ping of 50ms.
Within 50ms, a spider at 150KPH will have traveled 2.08 meters, now some of you might think that 2 meters isn't much, but a spider is only supposed to be around 10m tall.
2m on a spider is the difference between hitting the CT and the RT, or hitting the RT and missing to the side.


Any game with any amount of latency and server confirmed or hybrid client/server hitreg will have offset issues like this, its the nature of the internet and latency. In most games the targets and hitboxes are large enough that the offset caused by latency should be negligible, but in MWO we have the spider, which can cover a distance larger than one of its hitboxes in the time covered by a typical players ping.

As your ping goes up, this situation becomes worse, and spiders can become nearly impossible to hit, as at 150ms, there would be nearly a full spiders width worth of offset between where your client thinks it is and where the server says it is.

This issue can also be mitigated by using weapons with FAST projectile speeds (Gauss) and a small amount of lead.

I've gotten to the point that I can usually hit the exact component I want to on a fast spider as i aim for the next component over to compensate for the offset.

Example:
Spider is moving from right to left at max speed 300m in front of you, with gauss and a 50ms ping, if i aim at his RT (left from my POV) I'll get hitreg on his CT, if i aim CT, it will hit his LT (RT from my POV) and if I aim at his LT, the shots will likely miss his arm completely cause its so thin.

BTW, I think the Locust will be even worse than the spider when it comes to hitreg once it is released, due to the conclusions drawn from that math up above.
Locust will be smaller than the spider and move faster, leading to even more offset which will probably lead to more 'ZOMG LIGHTMECHS' threads...

Edit:spelling and stuff

Edited by Fragger56, 11 October 2013 - 12:35 PM.

[Event Horizon]

Yea, sick of all the people bitching about spiders and using the hitbox excuse. The hitboxes work no different on a spider than they do on any other mech. HSR lag issues with hitboxes can happen with any mech that has a high ping, not just spiders.

[Kaijin]

Derrpy, on 07 October 2013 - 05:43 PM, said:

dude it has 3 weapons

4 of them have 12 between them

[Karazyr]

Kaijin, on 15 October 2013 - 12:20 AM, said:

4 of them have 12 between them

i cant imagine anything more hellish than being attacked by 4 lights *shudder *