98 replies to this topic

[Magna Canus]

Xmasterspy, on 10 October 2013 - 08:47 AM, said:

So you know... I had a bug where if I were to alt-tab to a different window across my 3 montors, I could not get back into the game without pressing the mouse button 9 (some reason alt-tab back would not work). I would wait until no one was around before I would click. However, someone alwasy seemed to jump in front of my shots. So no, I have no problem containing my joy-fire, just a problem with people that TK other players.

As for this topic, I really only want to play with my friends on Mumble\TS. Do not move me without asking first. I am here to play with my friends.

Sorry if you felt pointed out. With a legitmate sorry it is ok. What I am talking about is people running around at the beginning firing their weapons NOT LOOKING WHERE THEY SHOOT. If you have an issue with your monitors you might want to do something about that.

[TheAtomiser]

Typical mech game that involves moving people around: "Durrrrr I'm the company commander".

[elsie]

Shar Wolf, on 09 October 2013 - 10:54 AM, said:

...

I ASK.
If you do not respond: THAT DOES NOT EQUAL SAYING DO NOT DO IT.
I am no leader, I give up command after I shift lances.
I may have no skill with actual leadership, but I do have some skill with knowing what mechs fill which roles.
If making use of that skill is arrogance - then I for DAMN SURE do not want to know where you fall on that scale.
...

If you're not a leader, then perhaps you shouldn't take command. Or at least keep it and lead.

Having all the lights in one lance and travelling as a pack is only consistently useful in Conquest. Otherwise, depending on the map, you want them split up and scouting different approaches. Then once the enemy is located, they regroup and act as taggers and strikers (as one possibility). It's the concept of combined arms.


elsie

[Lyoto Machida]

Lord Baldric, on 09 October 2013 - 11:40 AM, said:

You have a right to use the feature. Its there and unrestricted. It is meant to be used.

I'm simply saying there are consequences to every action.

That you do not have the right to tell someone they are not allowed to be upset simply because you did not receive a reply.

That you should use the reporting system for people who break the CoC in their distaste (TK's, excessive profanity/slurs).

You can move people and they can be upset about it.

Nothing more nothing less.

Most of the time I see people moved, they don't issue any commands during the match. So now, I just grab company command to prevent my lance from getting split up and I DON'T issue any commands. PGI implemented it like this so do whatever you want.

In real life lately, I've been noticing people that get into the right turn lane when I'm in the right-most lane going straight at a stoplight. They will then attempt to outaccelerate me to cut in front of me, instead of waiting in line with everyone else in traffic going straight. I have a faster car than most so I accelerate with them and hope that they crash into a parked bus or tractor trailer. If they end up clipping me, it's not my fault as I'm going straight in the lane I already had possession of. Hopefully they get seriously injured in a fiery explosion as a reminder to other drivers with poor decision making skills as to what could happen if they choose to illegally take shortcuts.

What was the point of that anecdote, you may ask? We don't make the laws here...PGI does. If there is no law in place requiring that I need to let cars in front of me pass while making illegal maneuvers, I won't do it. Same thing applies to splitting groups...if PGI was shortsighted enough to release the feature allowing lances to get split up by whomever grabs Company Commander first, then lances should be allowed to get split up. However, the flip side of that is that someone may grab CC to prevent their lance from getting split up and then not utilize it at all...that is also legal. Personally, I couldn't care less, as I don't usually listen to random PUG commanders I don't know (unless I recognize their name or something)...I'd rather trust the 3 other guys I'm on comms with than random players. Again, not our fault that PGI has chosen to not prioritize in-game comms.

Heavenly Angel, on 10 October 2013 - 05:11 AM, said:

I always break up lances when I see them because it stops them from running off on their own and leaving the team to fight 8 vs 12.

This guy is an example of what I'm talking about.

[Thunder Lips Express]

Masterzinja, on 08 October 2013 - 04:17 PM, said:

I actually had something similar happen to me a couple of nights ago. I took command to put our lights together into charlie lance for a resource misson when one of the guys on my team started calling me names and insulting me for taking command. Basically, he threatened me with his premade, and I told him to put his money where his mouth was.

When the match started I was immediately attacked by three of these guys on my own team, which my friend and I dispatch with little damage to ourselves. They spent the rest of the match telling me that my friend and I were marked men, and that his whole laughable clan was going to death-list us.

Now I should add that they never once mentioned wanting me to put them in a lance together, and in truth they were in a lance and none of them got moved. They were just insulting and being rude because they wanted to grief someone they thought was on his own.

ha my friends had a similar experience with a sync drop goon squad. back in 8 mans but 4 of them dropped on my team and 4 on the other. they both started to attack their own teams and the 4 man premade i was in killed the 4 goons and finished off the two that were left on the other team. ah good times

[Tyicus]

Reporting someone takes up valuable resources, particularly MY time, and the time or some PGI employee who has to sort through all this BS.

recent example:

Game starts, someone behind be clicks an alpha strike that hits me and another guy in the back. I turn around to see who it was, and another player on my team says ' it was Tyicus'.

I was already a bit pissed off about being shot in the back, so i replied 'check your %'s, I was one of the guys that got shot ********!'
Now sure i could have reported the guy that shot me, or the guy I cussed at could have reported me for being vulgar, but really why.

Sure getting TK'd, or repeatedly shot at by some ******** teamate is annoying, but when is it so bad that you have to waste your time and other poeples time by reporting nonsense.

Certainly this thread has devolved into a debate about how pissed some people are that there is now a commander in a unit, which has little relavence to the OP. If someone takes command and you cry about it and TK or shoot them, or screw the team in other ways by not particpating in the battle, you are the one who deserves to be reported. You do not need to ask permission to take command. You do not need to suck up to 2,3, or 4 man premades to achieve victory. It is a 12 man team you are fighting with, and your objective is simple:VICTORY.

If you want to waste space crying about it, well, it gives me a laugh every time i see it. If you try and TK the CO, I will gladly open fire on you.

Command is not an easy job, everyone complains about it, but few have the balls to do it. So do everyone a favor next time and ****, and then do your job.

I for one am going to start taking command whenever I can, and there is no way I am going to waste time asking babies if they like it or not.

[Saiyajin12]

Hellen Wheels, on 08 October 2013 - 04:39 PM, said:

If I take command, and I move you around, it is for a purpose. My purpose might be unclear to you at the time, but rest assured, when I am done moving you around, I will release the button and allow you to make any changes to my decisions.

If you are in a group, then fly colors, and I won't move you. If you are not flying colors for your group, then that's just too bad. Fly your colors or stop bellyaching.

If I am busy whilst waiting for the MM to make me a match, I may switch windows and start adjusting my ITunes or whatever and might not immediately press ready quickly enough for your tastes. I may have gotten up out of my chair and washed a dish in the meantime, and took too long wiping my hands clean before I press ready. If that takes too long for your tastes, then that's just too bad.

And after all that, if you still insist on "taking matters into your own hands" and start TK, then you WILL be reported.

TL:DR? GROW UP.

Summary of what you said: do things my way or grow up.

Yeah...ok boss...

[Saiyajin12]

Shar Wolf, on 09 October 2013 - 10:54 AM, said:

I apologize for misreading about you getting upset. but you are missing my point.

I ASK.
If you do not respond: THAT DOES NOT EQUAL SAYING DO NOT DO IT.
I am no leader, I give up command after I shift lances.
I may have no skill with actual leadership, but I do have some skill with knowing what mechs fill which roles.
If making use of that skill is arrogance - then I for DAMN SURE do not want to know where you fall on that scale.

I have an abysmal W/L
I acknowledge that my ELO is about as low as it can go.

HOWEVER.

I have found that rearranging the lances has increased my chances of winning to 2 out of every 3 games.
UNLESS PEOPLE GET UPSET ABOUT IT.
People doing so has become the surest way I know my team has already lost.
2/3 is a Very large number for my W/L, and as far as I know there is nothing wrong with maintaining something that has consistently shown to maintain that number.

so once more:
WHEN ASKED if you do NOT RESPOND
You forfeit the RIGHT to get upset in ANY WAY when you find things shifted.

That clear enough?

Placebo effect. As in you feel like you contributed to the win if you shuffled people around at the start. It's good to have your heart in the right place, we're all in it to kick the other team's behind, but shuffling around guys in what you feel is right when you admitably don't have too much experience in leadership does not really contribute to the game much (other than causing premades to get annoyed, and pugs to not care). Had it been a loss you would have felt nothing negative about it. Lets put it this way, has anyone actually thanked you for shuffling guys around?

That said, premades that get annoyed enough to start friendly firing are just being ridiculous... sure lances have an easier time moving with each other and coordinating, but it's not worth the grief it causes to the rest of the team as well as the poor commander who most likely had everyone's best interest at heart.

Also thanks to whoever pointed out that grabbing lance command will lock the lance from being shuffled, did not know this. Will spread the word

[Sweet Baby Pirate]

Ecliptor, on 07 October 2013 - 07:47 PM, said:

because of this me and everyone in my merc unit will always grab the command first so you can't mess around with our units

This is the solution, right here. If you have a preference re. lance composition, take command. Otherwise someone else will, they will make the reasonable assumption that the lances were assigned randomly, and reassign as they see fit.

Also - say you drop with one of your mates. He's in a Stalker and you're in a Raven. Is it really wise to follow him around because "oh we want to play together"?

QQing or TKing when you don't like the commander's decisions are the behaviours of a baby.

[Duncan Aravain]

Too many assistant fry supervisors at McDonalds think they are the next tactical genius. Just take lance command and relax.

[C E Dwyer]

Guntherstreiker, on 06 October 2013 - 10:04 AM, said:

Hello,

I would like to know where is the section to report bad behaviour to pgi ?

During a game, i was changing the composition of the team as allowed since last patch, to make our assaults beeing in the same squad.

Then i have been insulted and team killed by 2 players because they were on TS.

I find the kind of behaviour very bad and those guys should be banned for a time, just to learn them good manneers.

Regards.

profile> support> create new ticket> gameplay> report a player.


Doesn't matter what lance a persons in Ts will still work.
People in groups don't want to be moved about they should say something.
If they do get moved, then they should say why they don't want to be moved, so it can be corrected.

Being abusive and unreasonable, and attacking team players before there is any chance to correct things deserves to be punished.

end of message

[Mighty Spike]

Like another guy in the other thread said:

"You may have a good idea, but it does not mean it is the best, nor does it mean that everyone buys into. If you move my group around, and I ask to be put back in with my premade, you really should do it,
----->out of respect for players, do not force your view of play on others, even if you may be right."<-------

Edited by Mighty Spike, 11 October 2013 - 06:31 AM.

[Fut]

Embalmed, on 06 October 2013 - 06:28 PM, said:

I was in a drop with a lance full of friends, and some guy in a victor kept moving me around. He relinquished leadership and my friend moved me back. Upon start, the guy alpha struck my friend's leg. While I am rather fond of the sarcasm, I tend to scale it back in this game, so I doubt I was being singled out for something other than being one guy in an all Steiner lance. Anyways, moral of the story... communicate your intent, or prepare for someone to strip your armor.

You make it sound like it's a justified action.
I really don't think that MWO's player base should just have to accept intentional Friendly Fire.
That sort of behavour shouldn't be tolerated at all.

Hopefully PGI cracks down on this sort of childish ******** behavour.

Sweet Baby Pirate, on 11 October 2013 - 05:14 AM, said:

QQing or TKing when you don't like the commander's decisions are the behaviours of a baby.

^
Also, this is the attitude that the entire community needs to adopt.

Saiyajin12, on 11 October 2013 - 02:37 AM, said:

Placebo effect. As in you feel like you contributed to the win if you shuffled people around at the start. It's good to have your heart in the right place, we're all in it to kick the other team's behind, but shuffling around guys in what you feel is right when you admitably don't have too much experience in leadership does not really contribute to the game much (other than causing premades to get annoyed, and pugs to not care). Had it been a loss you would have felt nothing negative about it. Lets put it this way, has anyone actually thanked you for shuffling guys around?

It may actually contribute more than people care to admit.

It's anecdote time:
A few years back I was at a Paintball Park with a few friends. Typically paintball games are like PUGs, which is to say a bunch of random people on a team, sprinkled with small groups of friends.
Our first few matches were horrible, we got stomped in unbelievably quick ways.

One of the older players on the opposite team decided to have a little chat with us in between games.
He suggested that we find somebody on our team to act as a leader. and he insisted that it didn't matter who it was. Having a leader, any leader, was better than everybody just running off on their own.

We elected an 8 year old kid to be our leader for the next match. He split our group into little squads and gave us a really basic plan of attack. We still lost the next round, but it wasn't a complete stomp like the games before it. After a couple more matches, we started to find our groove and actually became competitive with the other team.

So, my point: Having any player step up as Commander in a PUG match is better than having no Commander at all (assuming that the person taking charge isn't doing so with Troll-ish intent).

The problem lies with the stubborn community who refuse to accept that somebody is trying to take command - like it's some sort of insult to them as a player that somebody else is willing/wanting to lead.

I, for one, will follow any orders that are given by a Commander in a PUG. It takes balls to step up with such a hostile and *******-filled community, so the least that I can do is go along with the person.
If we end up losing the match, who gives a ****, it's just a quick meaningless PUG anyhow. Atleast we gave it a real shot for once.

Edited by Fut, 11 October 2013 - 07:18 AM.

[Alaskan Nobody]

Saiyajin12, on 11 October 2013 - 02:37 AM, said:

Had it been a loss you would have felt nothing negative about it. Lets put it this way, has anyone actually thanked you for shuffling guys around?

The losses are no better or worse than when I did not do it - and yes, I have about as many thank me as blow up on me - weirdly enough Usually after the match rather than at the beginning when those who get upset do it

And I may not be skilled at leadership - but as stated I do not hold on to it - and I do know what mechs fill which roles. Leadership being the giving of the commands and the like - the realizing which situation needs which response, which never really involves the rearranging of the lances, to my knowledge anyways.
Yes. I realize that is a form of giving commands.

You never did counter my argument though.

When asked, if you do not respond - you do not really have the right to get upset.
Stargeezer had points in why he did not respond - and this morning I had a thought: Does everyone he drops with have the same issues? do NONE of them pay any attention to the team chat?
I do not ask for a response from everyone in the premade, but if none of you respond - none of you LET ME KNOW IN MATCH you have an issue with being moved (as said, I get thanked about as often as I get shot at) then you cannot get upset when I do so can you?

Unless of course you are just being a {Richard Cameron} (exception: people like StarGeezer who have reasons for not reading the chat in the first place, and who contain their upset to themselves.)

[StarGeezer]

Shar Wolf, on 11 October 2013 - 10:30 AM, said:

Stargeezer had points in why he did not respond - and this morning I had a thought: Does everyone he drops with have the same issues? do NONE of them pay any attention to the team chat?

I can answer this. With the exception of one time when I dropped with a member of this forum and his lance, if I group it's with the same one or two people.

Person 1 - Plays with me almost daily. Uses a similar set-up as mine (analog throttle and mouse). Ergo, has a similar issue...replying to chat involves removing the hands from the controllers, activating chat, typing a response, and then returning hands to the controllers.

Person 2 - Still wet-behind-the-ears newbie...has maybe dropped a dozen matches. Still going through cadet matches, still not sure of all the commands, and probably doesn't know how to use the in-game chat, much less the command console or battle grid. Doesn't play every day...in fact, has only been along with Person 1 and myself twice over the past two weeks. Has scored no more than 40 damage in his best game so far, and is still using the trial mechs.

So in my particular case, I play with no more than two people, neither of whom are always perfectly comfortable with typing in chat. If I type in chat at all (which is rare), it's usually at the very beginning to put in a quick "GL HF" or at the very end for a "GG." Unless I'm already dead, I seldom type anything in the middle of a match. When I do type something after I die, it's usually to convey some info on the enemy I just encountered ("Victor in E3, open core").

It's the main reason I don't scout. I don't have the twitch reflexes to pilot a fast, light mech with any skill, much less stop long enough to report enemy positions, composition, movement, etc.

[LauLiao]

Mycrus, on 09 October 2013 - 03:54 PM, said:

Iz too...

And people wonder why the world is going to pot...

Mogney, on 10 October 2013 - 10:00 AM, said:

I am awed by your mastery of 5th grade English. You are clearly very proud of that yourself.

I would be considering it appears to be a rarity amongst forum posters here.

[Lord Baldric]

Fut, on 11 October 2013 - 06:34 AM, said:

So, my point: Having any player step up as Commander in a PUG match is better than having no Commander at all (assuming that the person taking charge isn't doing so with Troll-ish intent).

The problem lies with the stubborn community who refuse to accept that somebody is trying to take command - like it's some sort of insult to them as a player that somebody else is willing/wanting to lead.

I, for one, will follow any orders that are given by a Commander in a PUG. It takes balls to step up with such a hostile and *******-filled community, so the least that I can do is go along with the person.
If we end up losing the match, who gives a ****, it's just a quick meaningless PUG anyhow. Atleast we gave it a real shot for once.

I agree with the spirit of this. I will gladly follow someone that wants to try and give orders and guide a team. Quite often someone takes command to 1) shuffle teams to their liking or 2)Locks in command to prevent 1. I would say half the time they ignore pleas a from premade lances or release it after the match starts saying fix it yourself.

You are right. People get hostile when some try and take command and give orders. On the flip side its arguable that few intend to lead to begin with. The hostility just makes those that were willing to try not bother which is the real shame. You only get better with practice.

It is very rare that someone is willing to step up and take actual command. Give orders. Listen to scouting and make adjustments on the fly. For certain it is not an easy role to fill. In many cases thankless. I have respect for someone that is willing to commit to it all the way.

Edited by Lord Baldric, 11 October 2013 - 08:31 PM.

[Mycrus]

LauLiao, on 11 October 2013 - 12:38 PM, said:

And people wonder why the world is going to pot...

pot is not a word.

[Liquid Leopard]

Taking command and giving instructions is one thing, but breaking up a 3 or 4-man group is utter BS. The self-appointed commander and his ego do NOT outweigh the cohesion of players who know each other and have been playing (and winning) together.

Last night I was playing in a 3-man team, and we had the same faction insignia. That's a damn good hint that we're together. In case that wasn't good enough, I took Lance Command to try and prevent us from being shuffled.

I found out the hard way that if someone's a big enough jerk, he can shuffle us anyway. "Player T" took "Player A" out of our lance without asking.

Player A said to put him back in our lance, and the self-appointed commander didn't respond. ...Didn't try to justify what he was doing, didn't propose a plan...nothing.

We concluded he was a troll, and the Space Viking Mafia broke his kneecap (legged him). Player T and his friends acted surprised.

Apparently, they were such noobs it wasn't self-evident: When you screw with a cohesive group you have ALL of that group pissed off at you. If you have the nerve to move people around and **** them off, you'd better have a thick enough skin for the consequences. (Player T obviously didn't.)

The next match I took company command and announced, "I'm NOT going to rearrange anyone", and, "I'm keeping us from getting rearranged...again." No one voiced a complaint, so I'm assuming the other pre-made on our side was OK with it.