106 replies to this topic

[MadCat02]

I have used and found every weapon effective at some point in MWO history . What happened ?

PGU "we are happy with the current state of weapon balancing "

State where most weapons are not worth bringing into the game ?


LRMS- lets have 3 upgrades just so the weapon works and maybe not even then !

Its funny that even with all bonuses LRMS still manage to miss targets with a lock-on .

People just poke lrm boaters from the cover and there nothing they can do about that .

LRMS still need more damage .

Medium Pulse Lasers- 1 DAMAGE WILL NEVER MAKE UP FOR 1 EXTRA TON, 1 HEAT and shorter range .Id rather shoot up to 540 meters than have 20% more damage for 100% more weight.

Don't give me that shorter duration {Scrap} . If you can apply damage faster you can miss it faster as well .

THEY WERE FINE AT 1.5 ton . HOW DID THEY GET NERFED!

LBX10-Do you think i care when people shoot me with LBX10 at 400 meters? Well i don't because they will run out of bullets if i don't come closer .

If not than get ac20 .

ER PPC- the problem with ER PPCs is that even 2 don't leave enough heat gauge to use other weapons .

2ER PPC+4 mediums . Runs too hot

2ER PPC+SRMS . Not practical Runs too hot

2ER PPC+2 AC 2 or 2 AC5. Not practical . Runs too hot and weights too much

Keep ghost heat but reduce ER PPC heat .

Machineguns,Flamer,Small Pulse Laser- i don't know what to say because medium laser is always a better choice .

AC10- Its kinda like a middle child between Gauss and AC20 that isn't good at any role.

Edited by MadCat02, 28 October 2013 - 06:17 AM.

[Christof Romulus]

C'mon, it's not 75% =P

[Dymlos2003]

So opinions are now fact?

[MadCat02]

Christof Romulus, on 26 October 2013 - 01:03 PM, said:

C'mon, it's not 75% =P

Its more than 75% actually . Obviously i didn't brake LRMS and SRMS into parts .

Edited by MadCat02, 26 October 2013 - 01:09 PM.

[Khobai]

PPCs and AC5s are about the only viable weapons anymore. Everything else is strictly worse.

[MadCat02]

dymlos2003, on 26 October 2013 - 01:05 PM, said:

So opinions are now fact?

AC5 BOAT vs Large Laser Boat is preferance based on opinion because both work . All weapons that i listed lack utility or dps that is not rewarded when used properly.

Edited by MadCat02, 26 October 2013 - 01:08 PM.

[DocBach]

Khobai, on 26 October 2013 - 01:07 PM, said:

PPCs and AC5s are about the only viable weapons anymore. Everything else is strictly worse.

AC/10 is pretty awesome, man.

[Khobai]

Quote

AC/10 is pretty awesome, man.

Dual AC/5s are outright better though. Its the same damage, with much better range, faster projectile speed, faster refire rate, and only weighs a few more tons.

The AC/20 is also outright better than the AC/10 at less than 400m. The AC/20 is still a fairly decent weapon although dual AC/5s are better most of the time.

But yeah basically PPC, AC/5, AC/20, Streaks are about the only four weapons people use regularly. Medium Lasers also see a lot of use as filler, but only because theres not really any other option for a filler weapon.

I definitely dont think weapons are anywhere near balanced.

Edited by Khobai, 26 October 2013 - 01:17 PM.

[MadCat02]

Khobai, on 26 October 2013 - 01:07 PM, said:

PPCs and AC5s are about the only viable weapons anymore. Everything else is strictly worse.

I still find AC5 and UAC viable . Somewhat . However 2 PPC or ER PPCs result in a very low dps if it comes to a brawl .

[Christof Romulus]

Ballistic:
AC20 is solid.
AC10 is solid.
AC5 is solid.
AC2 can be solid.
UAC5 ... functions.
Machine guns ... alright, that's one for you.
LB 10-X AC ... has its moments
Gauss Rifle is solid.

Energy:
ER large laser ... is situational.
ERPPC ... ... that's 2.
Flamer ... aaand 3
Large Laser is solid
Large pulse laser ... is situational... 4
Med pulse laser ... has its moments
Medium laser is solid.
PPC is solid.
Small laser is situational
Small Pulse laser is situational

Missile:
LRM 5 is solid (Boat + chain fire)
LRM 10 is situational (Boat)
LRM 15 is ... situational
LRM 20 is ... 5
SRM 2 6
SRM 4 ... situational...
SRM 6 ... Okay, this WOULD be fine if not for the hit detection
Streak SRM 2 is solid

Total USELESS weapons: 6 / 26 = ~23%
Total weapons with a use: 20/26 = ~77%

[MischiefSC]

Just because of an argument elsewhere on the forums I just loaded up my 3D with 2ERPPCs, 2ML and 1UAC5, 2 tons of ammo. 17 DHS and a JJ, 325XL.

Actually did great. Now, I'm a crappy poptart and I don't have a good enough mouse to maximize value of the zoom module but you keep the enemy at 600-800m for as long as possible. Stay still; draw fire. Those LLs will doe 1 or 2 points, those PPCs about 2 points each. My ERPPCs are still hitting for 20. Someone have AC2s? Poptart, their damage will spread on you while your damage will all hit a single location. Then when you close you use the UAC5 and MLs. You don't alpha. You try to save enough heat for an emergency 2xERPPC punch point blank and I poped a few lights that way but mostly it's the UAC5 and 2MLs. By that time I've stripped a lot of armor.

ERPPCs work. They're just not the ultimate. They require some cunning and purpose to use effectively. Much like a dual gauss build. It works, it's just not exceptional above other builds.

PPCs and AC5s are not 'better'. They're just pretty flexible and work well without a clear plan. I watched a 4man LRM boat group absolutely wreck face today. They split up, kept about 200m away from each other. It was brutal - almost impossible to stay under cover. You'd move to shoot one in the open and get literally 120 LRMs coming in from the side.

Weapon balance is actually pretty good right now. Pulse lasers are scrap (I'll save the filter some electrons) but otherwise there's a good balance. There's a pretty grey area where you peak out and it's based around a mixture of ballistic and energy, with some missiles if you've got the room.

[Alistair Winter]

Christof Romulus, on 26 October 2013 - 01:15 PM, said:

Total USELESS weapons: 6 / 26 = ~23%
Total weapons with a use: 20/26 = ~77%

Calling the ER PPC and SRM2 useless makes you look ignorant, dawg.

[PEEFsmash]

Christof Romulus, on 26 October 2013 - 01:15 PM, said:

Ballistic:
AC20 is solid.
AC10 is solid.
AC5 is solid.
AC2 can be solid.
UAC5 ... functions.
Machine guns ... alright, that's one for you.
LB 10-X AC ... has its moments
Gauss Rifle is solid.

Energy:
ER large laser ... is situational.
ERPPC ... ... that's 2.
Flamer ... aaand 3
Large Laser is solid
Large pulse laser ... is situational... 4
Med pulse laser ... has its moments
Medium laser is solid.
PPC is solid.
Small laser is situational
Small Pulse laser is situational

Missile:
LRM 5 is solid (Boat + chain fire)
LRM 10 is situational (Boat)
LRM 15 is ... situational
LRM 20 is ... 5
SRM 2 6
SRM 4 ... situational...
SRM 6 ... Okay, this WOULD be fine if not for the hit detection
Streak SRM 2 is solid

Total USELESS weapons: 6 / 26 = ~23%
Total weapons with a use: 20/26 = ~77%

The fact that you classified ER Large Lasers and ER PPCs as useless but Medium Pulse and Small Lasers as useful makes your opinion UTTERLY TRASH and uninformed.

Sorry, I just can't take these sorts of "balance" posts from [people].

Edited by John Wolf, 28 October 2013 - 08:25 AM.
Unconstructive

[Deathlike]

I stopped taking the thread seriously after reading the name of the OP that posted it.

Edited by Deathlike, 26 October 2013 - 01:59 PM.

[KhanHeir]

MadCat02, on 26 October 2013 - 12:59 PM, said:

Don't give me that shorter duration {Scrap} . If you can apply damage faster you can miss it faster as well .

Yep the shorter duration actually means less accuracy, it has the worst of a DOT and Burst weapon.

Completely useless.

Right now Standard lasers are +2 to hit while pulses get a big fat -1

[Christof Romulus]

PEEFsmash, on 26 October 2013 - 01:54 PM, said:

The fact that you classified ER Large Lasers and ER PPCs as useless but Medium Pulse and Small Lasers as useful makes your opinion UTTERLY TRASH and uninformed.

Sorry, I just can't take these sorts of "balance" posts from [people].

Ouch! You sure sick burned me there!

I mean, if what you said were true, that would truly be only the sickest of burns.

I said the ER Large Laser was situational - do you see a number next to it? As for ERPPC's, they function, and, as you can read in other posts I've made, am fine with their current performance - however, against skilled opponents who use cover, the difference between 540m and 690m is not worth 5 heat per shot.

As for me saying that Medium pulse lasers and Small pulse lasers were "useful" is a half-truth. I said medium pulse "had its moments" and small pulse lasers were "situational".

The OP was implying that there were absolutely no situations in which 75% of weapons in MWO functioned - I merely disagreed.

Sick burn though. You stay classy.

Edited by John Wolf, 28 October 2013 - 08:26 AM.
Moderated Quote

[Khobai]

All lasers are situational. Because the only situation theyre better than PPCs is under 90m.

[One Medic Army]

MadCat02, on 26 October 2013 - 12:59 PM, said:

Medium Pulse Lasers- 1 DAMAGE WILL NEVER MAKE UP FOR 1 EXTRA TON, 1 HEAT and shorter range .Id rather shoot up to 540 meters than have 20% more damage for 100% more weight.

Don't give me that shorter duration {Scrap} . If you can apply damage faster you can miss it faster as well .

THEY WERE FINE AT 1.5 ton . HOW DID THEY GET NERFED!

MPL have always weighed 2tons, both in MWO and in Tabletop BT.
If you think otherwise, you are incorrect.

[Macster16]

How are AC10s useless? I find myself having the most success with the AC10 out of all the ballistics. It may not be the best at anything in particular, but it's not the worst at anything either. Not too cold, not too hot. I find the AC10 fits into a "sweet spot".

[GalaxyBluestar]

you can always trust the op to be wrong, every other thread he simply types in x mech with x weapons i regulary make 1000 dmg a match and now those weapons he uses are useless? just which side are you on the side where your skill makes many mechs and weapon systems good or are you really poor stuck with all these poor weapons? you can't be both.