199 replies to this topic

[Fabe]

I wouldn't be surprised if threads like this is the reason why we don't have more dynamic and detailed objective based game modes. I mean why should PGI bother adding a game mode with a goal beyond "brawl in the middle" if people are just going to complain about it.

Edited by Fabe, 29 October 2013 - 05:39 AM.

[Rhaythe]

Fabe, on 29 October 2013 - 05:22 AM, said:

I wouldn't be surprised if thread like this is the reason way we don't have more dynamic and detailed objective based game modes. I mean why should PGI bother adding a game mode with a goal beyond "brawl in the middle" if people are just going to complain about it.

Scary thought. Thankfully, it seems like, at the very least, the capture/defend mode will fit in nicely as it pushes the idea of community warfare forward.

That said, I wouldn't mind a "Solarus Mode". Especially if they include the Duncan Fisher commentary that Living Legends included.



"In the event of a nuclear explosion in your vicinity, we apologize."

Edited by Rhaythe, 29 October 2013 - 05:27 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Karma Police, on 29 October 2013 - 01:17 AM, said:

our team won.

Congratulations your team was the 10%-15% that time. Let the stealth players have their moment, 85% of the time you get your team death match.

[Curccu]

DarkDevilDancer, on 29 October 2013 - 04:40 AM, said:

It's not about the last two guys going for a cap as a last resort that's their only option.

What really makes people mad is when 12 people rush the base instead of playing the game, and for what 300exp and a pathetic amount of c-bills, all it does is waste the time of 12 people and what really adds salt to the wound is when they start the cap but lose they have the nerve to QQ about it.

It's your call do you want to defend your base or start QQ without even trying to defend the base.

[Ursus_Spiritus]

Karma Police, on 28 October 2013 - 03:22 PM, said:

DA**IT this game is about big weapons and explosions!

PGI plllllease give us true deathmatch! its not so much to ask!

"no! we'll give you a ready button instead!"

look i get it. this game is hard, but...

im so tired of newbies being so victor hungry that the match ends with 0 damage!!

what a waste of time.

to all you cappers out there. please get some skills, or better builds or --->

IF YOU WANNA CAP YOU SHOULD PROBABLY**** GO PLAY CONQUEST MODE - thats what it is for! for CAPPING!


PGI if you dont wanna give us true deathmatch, at least make capping available after at least 2 mechs have died! 1 of each team.


sorry for the QQ. but wasting 8 minutes in alpine just to find out each team has gone a different route and then -----> CAP WARRIOR ONLINE, ALL SYSTEMS CAP-ABLE.
makes the game into a meching joke and gets people like me (cause i know im not the only one) kinda cranky.

that said. game is brilliant and i still love it. pgi keep doing a good job. (HINT, HINT)

That is such a huge misconception about Battletech/Mechwarrior.. tactics as always been a HUGE part of this game. Conflict isn't about just beating the p1$$ out of an opponent. Intelligent combat is about winning the quickest and most decisive way possible.

While not always the case, generally, if you want to just "Slug it out" with someone, then there are venues for that. A lesson that seems lost on many.

You want to force your opponent to submit, surrender, lose their will to resist/fight. Unless you are truly blood thirsty that easily is a lesson that many young minded and immature people fail or are slow to learn and understand.

If capping is a viable option to WIN, and it is in this game, then it will be utilized.

It seems there is a concept to this game and similar that the "kiddies" just don't get, because they don't understand limited resources, time restraints, lack of man power/equipment, c-bills, ammunition, etc etc etc... a mind set that is paramount lesson, at the very least for those of us that have played on going table top campaigns and or aspects of the older mechwarrior series.

If you have a tactical advantage (capping) you exploit it and win the day.

Don't like that capping is a part of the game? Find another game to play.

[GRiPSViGiL]

Fabe, on 29 October 2013 - 05:22 AM, said:

I wouldn't be surprised if thread like this is the reason way we don't have more dynamic and detailed objective based game modes. I mean why should PGI bother adding a game mode with a goal beyond "brawl in the middle" if people are just going to complain about it.

Let's hope the Devs appreciate more dynamic and intuitive game modes than this jabroni who started this thread. I know I prefer Conquest over the stale Assault mode.

Assault plays out the same every game. No scouting necessary...you already know where the enemy will be poptarting for 3 or 4 mins until someone is sniped, then the team with more players slowly creeps in until a few more go down then they full on push and clean up. Conquest at least has some maneuvering to secure bases and then skirmishes happen in various areas and even still the team that wins the brawl doesn't always win the game.

That being said we could use a couple new game modes. Variety is key for me...the more game mode and the more maps we have the better.

Edited by GRiPSViGiL, 29 October 2013 - 05:46 AM.

[Fabe]

Rhaythe, on 29 October 2013 - 05:25 AM, said:

Scary thought. Thankfully, it seems like, at the very least, the capture/defend mode will fit in nicely as it pushes the idea of community warfare forward.

I agree,I just hope they come out with some new capture/defend maps instead of just slapping a new game mode onto the current maps. What I would like to see for capture/defend is either a large map with the capture point in the middle where the defending team starts and the attacker starts on a edge of the map. The map should have lots of terrain/cover so the attacker can sneak around to attack from what ever direction they wish with the area around the capture zone being a bit more open.

[Rhaythe]

Fabe, on 29 October 2013 - 05:46 AM, said:

I agree,I just hope they come out with some new capture/defend maps instead of just slapping a new game mode onto the current maps. What I would like to see for capture/defend is either a large map with the capture point in the middle where the defending team starts and the attacker starts on a edge of the map. The map should have lots of terrain/cover so the attacker can sneak around to attack from what ever direction they wish with the area around the capture zone being a bit more open.

If they take a few cues from UT2004's Assault mode, I'll be a happy mechwarrior.

[Amsro]

Not to be a douche, but how does a match last 8 minutes and no one has engaged for 0 damage? I mean that alone would take serious team skill to avoid battle for 8 minutes.

[Fabe]

Amsro, on 29 October 2013 - 05:55 AM, said:

Not to be a douche, but how does a match last 8 minutes and no one has engaged for 0 damage? I mean that alone would take serious team skill to avoid battle for 8 minutes.

It happens, One team goes to their right the other team goes around to their right and the whole match turns into a race to see can drain the other guys cap meter first.

[Rhaythe]

Fabe, on 29 October 2013 - 05:59 AM, said:

It happens, One team goes to their right the other team goes around to their right and the whole match turns into a race to see can drain the other guys cap meter first.

Gameplay strategy on Alpine:

[Fut]

Karma Police, on 28 October 2013 - 03:22 PM, said:

DA**IT this game is about big weapons and explosions!

Really, it is?
I always thought that the big weapons and explosions were a part of this game, not what the game is about.
Sounds a bit silly, but there is a pretty big difference.

[Baltasar]

Cap races happen sometimes when no shots have been fired. Most of the time it's avoidable if your team will just wait before committing a direction until your fast mechs find out which way they are going (most of the time on small maps you can see without even moving from your base. I've had several times when I tell my team, on a map like river city, "Hey, they are going to our left." but my team will still just herp derp away from the base in the opposite direction and cap race ensues and then people complain about capping.

"But we don't have fast mechs to scout" well that's a match maker problem for one. Two, then you should stay close to your base and defend since you can't get your fat *** back to base in time and complain when a lighter toned team takes advantage of your slowness. I have also seen a team lose (when they were up by 5 mechs) cause they can't be bothered to traverse 800 km to their base and kill 2 mechs there.

"Cowards, come out and fight" well let's see, I'm a light or med mech, you have 5 asssaults and most of my team is dead. Why would I run into a death trap of assaults when 1. I can try and split you up and pick you off, or 2 take advantage of your over extended butt and cap your base.

Capping is a viable tactic, learn to play the mode and defend your base (and find the enemy before fully committing). Personally, I would like to see assault change into true assault where you have an attacking and defending post. Also, all those screaming for Death Match, unless there is a way to end the match early, I'm going to laugh at the rage at the one spider left alive, hiding powered down that you can't find, wasting everyone's time for 7 full minutes when people can't even be bothered to wait 60 sec at the ready screen. Right now you can always cap to end early. I guess you can always call out his grid but that is technically against the griefing policy.

TL:DR Learn to play.

[Tastian]

Capping definitely has its place. Its just infuriating for several reasons:

1) Maps are too big. If two lights are on your base and you don't have any lights, you won't make it back on Alpine, Therma, or Tourmaline.

2) Matchmaking is unpredictable. Your team has 1 light; the other team has 5 - who's going to win the cap race?

3) Defense is a poor argument. What if both teams defend? What if you leave 2 guys behind and 5 lights come in and destroy them because they are now easy targets? Scouting, strategy, communication is a rarity in pugs.

4) Stopping cap has no reward. This happened to me today. Our group has no lights and we are in the middle. Before we even engage, a Locust gets on our base. I march all the way back in my Thunderbolt and the Locust runs off. I stick around for a minute, then march back to the fight. Meanwhile my team has decimated the opponent and the Locust gets back on the base. I then follow my entire team back to our base where someone else kills the Locust. Guess who saved our team? Me. Guess who has the lowest damage, points, cbills, and xp? Me. (Alternatively, guess what would have happened if I went back and found 3 lights on base - they would have killed me instantly for coming back alone).


So, yes, its hard; but its also valid. I still support capping, but maybe in a different way. Maybe caps could be a little closer on larger maps. Maybe matchmaking could make sure each team has the same number of lights.

Edited by Tastian, 29 October 2013 - 06:31 AM.

[Baltasar]

1.  I think this is the first time that I have heard that maps are too big.  Part of making it back in time is finding the other team before (granted hearding your team can be like hearding cats though)
2.  Agreed, matchmaking is unpredictable but in a way, it can be nice to have a bit of randomness and imagine yourself in a battle tech situation where you are way under gunned.  At least objective quests at least give a chance for under tonned teams to win when played right.  Also, again, gaining information on team make up and where they are is essential when you have a slow team before you over extend and can't defend your base anymore.
3.  Defense is a great argument.  "What if both teams defend?"  That's why you have one or two scout mechs (yay role warfare!!), to see what the other team is doing.  If the other team is defending you can 1.  See who has the most patience, or 2. Formulate a plan of attack, in the mean time you aren't getting your base capped out from under you.  Scouting and information gathering is rare in PUGs but that is why they keep raging so until they are informed by other people, showed how benificial information can be by experienced light pilots, or just pull their heads out of their butts and learn that hey I can't just herp derp to the middle of the map and win then they will continue to rage.  I don't want to cater to whiney players that can't be bothered to learn a little game mode tactic. 

4.  Stopping cap has no reward" You don't lose by cap, that is the reward (granted it would be nice to get a little defense bonus just to encourage people to RTB but herding cats and lead a horse to water and all that jazz).  Great to see the locust being useful though and pulling some nice tonnage off y'alls line.  Sometimes, it is annoying to be the responsible one tough.  I play med mechs a lot.  I expect lights to go back to the base if it's being capped.  Sadly, there are times when I'm the lightest mech on the team.  I go back, save the cap, and yeah I come out looking like a horrible player stat wise.  Low damage no kills, no assists but we didn't lose to cap and sometimes my team actually pulls it out and wins.  It's just par for the course and I take more personal pride in knowing that I helped my team win rather than racking up numbers but again that's my personal measurement of goals.  It would be nice to see capping get some decent rewards again, as well as some rewards for actively saving your base but I doubt we'll see that change any time soon.edit: Major forum format fail

Edited by Baltasar, 29 October 2013 - 06:59 AM.

[Ronan]

STOP LIKING WHAT I DON'T LIKE could replace sooo many threads.

[sokitumi]

It's an unoriginal, weakly implemented, small-of-vision filler format. This is obvious to anyone, i would think.

[Tastian]

12 man games do everything you just stated Baltasar. They usually have 4 lights and then a ton of assaults and/or poptarts. They are organized, have good communication, know how to cap/prevent cap, and typically the games last for almost 15 minutes because they are sizing up the enemy and picking their position.

What I'm talking about is everything else. You pug or drop with a 4 man group and you'll see everything I've listed. And again, I'm not complaining; i'm merely pointing out the reasons capping can be infuriating. Typically pugs won't scout, communicate, defend, strategize, avoid squirrels, find cover from lrms/poptarts, focus fire, etc... And for them, capping is confounding.

[Firenze]

I actually have started seeing alot more players playing role warfare recently. Its kinda nice. You do get the occassional pugs running around who still dont pay attention at all to the chat, or to their sensor bars.

Seriously, that sensor, and the red arrows help so much. Even if all you get is a blip, you can figure out enemy headings. That can make or break a match.

[Helsbane]

I go for cap a lot, then proceed to kill damn near anything that comes back to stop me. If I can't kill it, chances are it can't catch me as I race back to friendly lines or into cover. Last week I wiped out nearly half the enemy team single handedly as they came back (yes, they were torn up, but there's only one of me), including a pair of assaults, all while piloting a lowly medium.
Last friday evening, our lance of skirmishers / light hunters wiped out ten enemy mechs, all while capping their base out from under them. Great times!
In short, the base it there for a reason, and this reason varies from pilot to pilot. I use it for bait, both in capping the enemy's base, and defending my team's.