27 replies to this topic

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

The damage to the rate of fire to their range to the heat is way over the top. Someone chain firing AC can fire just as fast as someone chain firing small lasers and the AC do a *bleep* load of damage when chain fired!

Lower the rate of fire
or
lower the damage
or
up the heat
or
make them like PPC where they have a range they need to be fired in any thing closer or further they do 0 damage.

There are plenty of things you can do to bring the AC in check.

Thank you.

[Sandpit]

There weren't enough "ACs are OP" threads for you to post in?

[FupDup]

Autocannons weren't secretly OP over the course of MWO's lifetime. The reason you see them in higher usage today is specifically because PPCs were nerfed hard enough to let ACs compete against PPCs. The actual stats of the ACs themselves haven't been changed for quite some time (other than the UAC/5).


Anyways, the only "fix" we need is to reform the heat system. Our current slow-dissipation and high-capacity make energy weapons (I'm talking main weapons, not 1-2 backup ML or whatever) only good for high-damage alpha strikes but utterly terrible at endurance, whereas ACs still have a relatively good alpha and really really long endurance. Increasing our heat cooling rate would help energy weapons actually be sustainable over time like they're supposed to be, and lowering our capacity will make it so high-heat loadouts will need to fire in volleys instead of alphas (low-heat loadouts could still alpha); and without nerfing weapons that don't need to be nerfed.

Edited by FupDup, 13 November 2013 - 09:12 AM.

[Appogee]

...and so the Wheel of Nerfing turns full circle...

[Rhaythe]

Funkadelic Mayhem, on 13 November 2013 - 09:01 AM, said:

-- Whining --

Thank you.

No. Every weapon type has its intents and advantages and disadvantages.

[Barantor]

Appogee, on 13 November 2013 - 09:09 AM, said:

...and so the Wheel of Nerfing turns full circle...

"The wheel of nerfing keeps on turning....

... I don't know where balance is tomorrrrrrooowww..."

[Roadbeer]

This thread is NEW and EXCITING

[Rhaythe]

Barantor, on 13 November 2013 - 09:12 AM, said:

"The wheel of nerfing keeps on turning....

... I don't know where balance is tomorrrrrrooowww..."

It's the Circle of NeeeeEEEEeeeerf...!! And it moves us aaaaAAAAaaall!!

[Joseph Mallan]

Funkadelic Mayhem, on 13 November 2013 - 09:01 AM, said:

The damage to the rate of fire to their range to the heat is way over the top. Someone chain firing AC can fire just as fast as someone chain firing small lasers and the AC do a *bleep* load of damage when chain fired!

Lower the rate of fire
or
lower the damage
or
up the heat
or
make them like PPC where they have a range they need to be fired in any thing closer or further they do 0 damage.

There are plenty of things you can do to bring the AC in check.

Thank you.

Make other weapons equal to ACs.

[Rhaythe]

Joseph Mallan, on 13 November 2013 - 09:19 AM, said:

Make other weapons equal to ACs.

I wouldn't even say that. Energy weapons have infinite ammo but use heat. ACs have low heat but finite ammo. Missiles have ammo and heat but indirect fire and don't require line-of-sight.

Checks n' Balances.

[Murphy7]

For the love of big stompy robots, seriously?

AC's only seem powerful because:

• Ghost heat plays merry hell with energy builds, particularly PPCs
  
• Ghost heat also plays merry hell with AC/2s and AC/20s, by the way
  
• LRMs have been heavily mitigated by ECM and AMS
  
• SRMs have been mitigated by terribly poor hit detection & spread mechanics
  
• Gauss have a shiny firing mechanics that either works for you or knots your underwear, depending on the wind direction.
  
• Flamers are cute
  
• Double armor/structure means all weapons feel weaker, but with better aim that feeling passes

Argue that other weapons should be better so there are more viable choices - great, support you all the way.

Argue to keep toning things down? Most weapons feel like popguns as it is, so no thanks.

[Roadbeer]

Rhaythe, on 13 November 2013 - 09:22 AM, said:

I wouldn't even say that. Energy weapons have infinite ammo but use heat. ACs have low heat but finite ammo. Missiles have ammo and heat but indirect fire and don't require line-of-sight.

Checks n' Balances.

I've been saying this in almost every thread on the topic

Ballistic = Direct Damage. Low heat, Ammo, Chance of internal explosion.
Energy = Damage over Time. High Heat, No ammo,
Missile = Area of Effect. Medium heat, ammo, LoS not required.

Working as Intended.

[Joseph Mallan]

Rhaythe, on 13 November 2013 - 09:22 AM, said:

I wouldn't even say that. Energy weapons have infinite ammo but use heat. ACs have low heat but finite ammo. Missiles have ammo and heat but indirect fire and don't require line-of-sight.

Checks n' Balances.

I agree, but an AC10 should be delivering the same amount of damage per turn as a AC10 As ot stand right now an AC10 is throwing twice the damage and that is not right. All things included it should be up to the player if they want low heat with limited shots or high heat and infinite shots.

[Narcissistic Martyr]

Autocannons are powerful but OP? I'd say not really.

If you get in brawling range an AC20 is wickedly powerful but it does weigh 14 tons. Unfortunately its damage falls off far too slowly making it as powerful than an ac10 at the the ac10's maximum effective range. This needs to be fixed but overall the ac20 is fine.

The AC10 is a decent weapon and is quite effective as a pair or with a PPC or two

The UAC5 now that it's been nerfed to AC5 fire rates is no longer particularly OP.

The AC5 is in an interesting place where two of them weight 1 ton more than a gauss, have a similar range profile, and have much higher DPS and are easy to use.

AC2s really aren't that good anymore with ghost heat but they're still decent enough weapons and have the longest range in the game which is useful on some maps.

Honestly, I'd say that balance is the best its ever been and that currently the only really UP weapons are SRMs due to hit detection, LRMS due to playerbase whining about EZ mode lock on weapons, and the pulse laser series which aside from SPL on the JR7-F don't offer enough benefit for the extra tonnage. Also flamers which need to have a short range PPC like damage mode as well as a more powerful heat generation mode.

Edited by Narcissistic Martyr, 13 November 2013 - 09:29 AM.

[Rhaythe]

Roadbeer, on 13 November 2013 - 09:25 AM, said:

Chance of internal explosion.

Forgot about that. And let's not forget that the gauss cannon itself doesh not react vell to bulletsh.

Edited by Rhaythe, 13 November 2013 - 09:28 AM.

[Sandpit]

Roadbeer, on 13 November 2013 - 09:25 AM, said:

I've been saying this in almost every thread on the topic

Ballistic = Direct Damage. Low heat, Ammo, Chance of internal explosion.
Energy = Damage over Time. High Heat, No ammo,
Missile = Area of Effect. Medium heat, ammo, LoS not required.

Working as Intended.

[Vodrin Thales]

Joseph Mallan, on 13 November 2013 - 09:26 AM, said:

I agree, but an AC10 should be delivering the same amount of damage per turn as a AC10 As ot stand right now an AC10 is throwing twice the damage and that is not right. All things included it should be up to the player if they want low heat with limited shots or high heat and infinite shots.

Do you really think the AC10 is a superior weapon right now. Most of the higher end players in my unit think it's trash, and some go so far as saying that if you mount it when you could mount an AC5, AC20, or PPC with some tweaking of your build, you are doing it wrong (ie, building something that could be more effective with a different weapon loadout).

Edited by Vodrin Thales, 13 November 2013 - 09:32 AM.

[Rhaythe]

Vodrin Thales, on 13 November 2013 - 09:31 AM, said:

Do you really think the AC10 is a superior weapon right now.

Compared to the AC20: Better range. More ammo. Faster firing rate. I certainly don't have a problem with it. In fact, I'd say it's one of the best rounded AC weapons in the game currently. Does it have qualms, sure. But what weapon doesn't?

Sandpit, on 13 November 2013 - 09:29 AM, said:

Tradeoffs?!

I lol'ed.

[NRP]

Why not buff energy weapons, rather than nerfing ACs?

[Roadbeer]

NRP, on 13 November 2013 - 09:35 AM, said:

Why not buff energy weapons, rather than nerfing ACs?

Why not just leave it all alone, and examine a better system than Ghost Heat.

The meta will ALWAYS shift, stop with the kneejerk reactions to it.