150 replies to this topic

[Ghogiel]

JohnnyWayne, on 16 November 2013 - 04:45 AM, said:

The curve actually looks like this:

No it actually doesn't. check the dev post you got that image from and read it again.

I actually was complaining about Elo the whole time the curve looked like that, it was biasing players who had simply played a lot of matches, and as such was wanked, as soon as they adjusted the spectrum the games were noticeably better.

Quote

I don't know if anyone mentioned it already, I lost track since page 2, but there seems to be different elo rating for each weight class. I have heared it somewhere and can confirm it by my observations (I'm a heavy pilot and played mediums for the first time with project phoenix).

This is actually true.

It's in a command chair.

Edited by Ghogiel, 16 November 2013 - 08:11 AM.

[a little fluffy bunny]

Sug, on 15 November 2013 - 08:39 AM, said:

Another Elo thread? it's pretty much an accepted fact that the Elo system in MWO does not work.


Explain to me how I, a player from CB, should ever be placed on a team with someone asking how to target enemy mechs, use their jjets, or how to group weapons?

Because account age or number of matches =/= high skill or Elo rating, thus you might not be as good as you think you are. Don't feel bad, seems to happen a lot round here.




And as for my skill level? Take your high Elo number and shove it, I'd rather be bad than play with all you tryhards.

[C E Dwyer]

Wispsy, on 15 November 2013 - 06:28 AM, said:

Are you sure that is because you are not still in the same Elo bracket on your new account?

That made me laugh so much..

quick edit..to add..

I get teamed against these people so does that make me leet or does it make me baaadddd..


as I allways finnish in the top three

Except when I don't..

Edited by Cathy, 16 November 2013 - 09:06 AM.

[Sug]

a little fluffy bunny, on 16 November 2013 - 08:53 AM, said:

Because account age or number of matches =/= high skill or Elo rating, thus you might not be as good as you think you are. Don't feel bad, seems to happen a lot round here.

It doesn't matter how good I am because I only pug, no coms, and thus my win/loss ratio is 49/51.

Since wins and losses are the only thing that move your Elo score, and team Elos are averaged out, so your Elo can't move very far anyway, and I basically have a 50/50 wL ratio, so yeah it stands to reason that my Elo score is not very far from where new players start.

You can lead your team in damage and kills every time but it doesn't matter. Only wins and loses count. You can't raise your Elo significantly unless you get a large string of wins, and even that has diminishing returns.

Averaging things out is just a bad way to match players to teams because averages are meaningless.

So when I say

Quote

Explain to me how I, a player from CB, should ever be placed on a team with someone asking how to target enemy mechs, use their jjets, or how to group weapons?

I am not asking why a player with my experience is being matched with nubs, I know why and how that happens. I am asking for a justification of the continued use of their broken matchmaking system.

If I really wanted to win 50% of my games I'd just sit at my desk and flip a ******* coin for hours instead of playing MWO.

Edited by Sug, 16 November 2013 - 11:16 AM.

[LTGear]

@profiteer - i'm curious what's your kill/death ratio?

[Joseph Mallan]

Alistair Winter, on 15 November 2013 - 05:36 AM, said:

So many feels in this thread.

Hey Alistair, we dropped in 4 games together (3 as team mates an one as opponents) do you remember how those matches ended? I do remember I made the mistake of "big game hunting" while you were alive still but did we win or lose? I just know I had fun, even being bagged and tagged by you was fun!

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 18 November 2013 - 10:09 AM.

[Woozle]

I agree that the matchmaker is broken. I don't know or care what Elo bracket I'm in. I only ever solo PUG, and have done so since the first week of Closed Beta.

What I know is this: I am not having fun.

It's not about winning; I enjoy a good loss as much as a good win. Those of you who have played the kind of nail-biting edge of your seat games I'm talking about will understand. At it's best, despite all its warts, this game can be very fun.

But now, I can't find a good game. In the last week I have had exactly one good game out of about 50. The rest were stomps one way or the other. It's beyond frustrating.

People can (and do) argue ad infinitum about how they'd like the game to be in any and every respect. But the First Rule of Game Design is: Be Fun. If you break Rule #1, nothing else matters. And right now, MW:O breaks Rule #1.

[MadCat02]

Profiteer, on 15 November 2013 - 02:55 AM, said:

I play in a high ELO bracket. Don't give me ****, I just do.

Here's how it goes:

My team stomps the enemy 12-0, 12-1 for several games. The enemy team is basically nobodies +1-2 good players.

Then the match maker decides I have won too much so it puts me against 2 top level 4-mans while stacking my side with 1st day newbs who I could out damage by walking backwards at the enemy and shooting my weapons in the air.

Now don't get me wrong... I DO NOT WANT TO CLUB SEALS.

I have long since stop taking pleasure at destroying a bunch of nobodies.

What I'm asking for is a system that puts me up against the best players in the game WHILE PUTTING THE SAME LEVEL PLAYERS ON MY TEAM.

The current match maker/elo is so terrible I'm seeing more and more players I used to group with fade away or get frustrated like myself.

Please consider changing to a ranking system so that only players of a similar level play with each other. This would stop newbs being crushed, and higher level players getting p1ssed off with teams that haven't got a clue.

Cheers!

League of legends had ranked system for 3 years . Is it balanced? No

Will it ever be balanced ? No

Theres a huge variety of palyers and factors that go in every match . Theres no perfect solution for this

[hercules1981]

Profiteer, on 15 November 2013 - 02:55 AM, said:

I play in a high ELO bracket. Don't give me ****, I just do.

Here's how it goes:

My team stomps the enemy 12-0, 12-1 for several games. The enemy team is basically nobodies +1-2 good players.

Then the match maker decides I have won too much so it puts me against 2 top level 4-mans while stacking my side with 1st day newbs who I could out damage by walking backwards at the enemy and shooting my weapons in the air.

Now don't get me wrong... I DO NOT WANT TO CLUB SEALS.

I have long since stop taking pleasure at destroying a bunch of nobodies.

What I'm asking for is a system that puts me up against the best players in the game WHILE PUTTING THE SAME LEVEL PLAYERS ON MY TEAM.

The current match maker/elo is so terrible I'm seeing more and more players I used to group with fade away or get frustrated like myself.

Please consider changing to a ranking system so that only players of a similar level play with each other. This would stop newbs being crushed, and higher level players getting p1ssed off with teams that haven't got a clue.

Cheers!

The only way they can match correctly is by matching average damage done and kills in some manner because I know that the pinpoint damage will allow u kills at a lower damage amount as apposed to say some1 in a jagger with ac 2s spraying every1 getting 800 damage and 1 kill. The whole win lose thing just isn't the way to go at all because of the whole capture win situation. U could have a group of guys that suck at fighting and wait for the enemy to move far away from base then cap and only 1 dude goes back to save cap and gets his butt kicked even though the 4 man capping squad r scrubs. So come time that u get a bunch of guys that r like that on your team with a higher Elo then they should have because of there (cap wins) and they r forced to fight for whatever reason your whole team gets porked. So more or less I'm saying that the skill in each variant of a mech needs to b factored when matching not just the win lose ratio, weight needs to be in there as a balance factor as well

[focuspark]

Solis Obscuri, on 15 November 2013 - 04:04 AM, said:

Then why are you surrounded by so many n00bs?

Because MM needs to scrap bottom to fill in empty slots?

Maybe they're not newbs. We all have bad days. I've had days when I'm just "not with it" and completely fumbled matches. Get one or two of those and your entire team suffers badly.

[focuspark]

LTGear, on 17 November 2013 - 08:11 AM, said:

@profiteer - i'm curious what's your kill/death ratio?

Fairly certain ELO isn't calculated on KDR alone... possibly without KDR as part of the equation.

If I were writing ELO algo, it'd be something like

foreach (match in matches) => eloscore += match.xp_vaue * match.weight

elsoscore / matches.count;

where weight = 1 - (avg(your_team_elo) - avg(their_team_elo))

Edited by focuspark, 18 November 2013 - 12:35 PM.

[Alistair Winter]

Joseph Mallan, on 18 November 2013 - 10:08 AM, said:

Hey Alistair, we dropped in 4 games together (3 as team mates an one as opponents) do you remember how those matches ended? I do remember I made the mistake of "big game hunting" while you were alive still but did we win or lose? I just know I had fun, even being bagged and tagged by you was fun!

Definitely remember that. It's always nice to see familiar faces from the forum and then shoot at them with lasers! Even the ones I occassionally disagree with. Or maybe especially those

I believe I died very shortly after ambushing you with an AC20 in my Yen Lo Wang. You had a bunch of friends coming up behind you, but I couldn't pass on the opportunity to go after you in a blaze of glory. Looking forward to Alistair vs Joseph part deux

[Jonathan Paine]

I hope that PGI takes a good, long look at the current matchmaker code since there are a lot bad match-ups both in total tonnage and (perceived) skill. Personally, I think there are couple of big problems with the current state:

1. Elo does not scale like a real number. Two cadets with a starting Elo of 1100 are not half as good as a 2200 veteran.

2. The matchmaker appears to get confused and put the wrong lances together. Sometimes this is to my benefit, my lance of 2-4 good players gets grouped with at least one of the top notch 4 man groups while the opposition consists of people whose names I don't recognize. The result tends to be a 12 vs 1 stomp. This also happens by WEIGHT, where you get 8 assaults + 4 random on one side, and 8 lights + 4 random on the other. This should NEVER HAPPEN.

So you look at the scores and and go "wow, if only they had put that other four man on the other side, we would have had such a fight!"

So PGI, please, please, please have a good long look at your code, and also consider creating Elo brackets that do not mix and match try-hards and cadets. Pretty please!

[Solis Obscuri]

focuspark, on 18 November 2013 - 12:34 PM, said:

Fairly certain ELO isn't calculated on KDR alone... possibly without KDR as part of the equation.

So if a player is consistently losing matches while surrounded by inexperienced and disorganized teammates... wouldn't the resulting output be a low ELO?

[MadcatX]

As I scrolled down the page, I saw a graph.

Lovely, another statistics fight.

[focuspark]

Solis Obscuri, on 18 November 2013 - 04:00 PM, said:

So if a player is consistently losing matches while surrounded by inexperienced and disorganized teammates... wouldn't the resulting output be a low ELO?

No necessarily we use XP as a score proxy. Even when on a losing team you can do quite well with XP.

[Flying Judgement]

well some times 4 man groups are mekeing the whole team die by suicideing XD they have the tendency to think they are invincible because voice chat and charging in first or ignoring the rest of the teams positions or just want to show of and gets careless = death
not useing the in game chat telling the big plan or giveing intel to the rest i see this soo often i do many times better alone than with a others.

or you have the folks useing strategy the chat system and a harsh discipline boreinggggggg boring play style and absolutely rapeing the enemy team in 30 second without any challenge what is just worse than the other options.

i would rather have the option if i want to stay with the present team im playing with or change team something similar like the hawken loby system oh and the option to add friend in lobby with one click

[Drunk Canuck]

I have that problem quite often OP, and it's annoying. Yesterday I had 7 wins in a row in my Shadowhawk 2D2 where I racked up 1-2 kills per match (one I had 4) so my KDR was getting up there. All of a sudden I get thrown into 4 drops in a row where we got roflstomped by other teams and even dealing 600+ damage, I couldn't carry those teams to wins. After that I just stopped playing for the day. It's annoying as hell having that sort of {Scrap} happen, my back hurts from carrying too many scrub teams in a Mech running a freaking XL engine where I was the only one brawling on the front lines and risking getting killed. Thankfully I know how to play but dear god it was brutal, seeing people in assault Mech's doing less then 200 damage makes me want to smash their computers.

[SgtKinCaiD]

Alistair Winter, on 18 November 2013 - 12:52 PM, said:

Definitely remember that. It's always nice to see familiar faces from the forum and then shoot at them with lasers! Even the ones I occassionally disagree with. Or maybe especially those

That's why you added me as a friend ???

[Alistair Winter]

SgtKinCaiD, on 19 November 2013 - 02:21 AM, said:

That's why you added me as a friend ???

As much as I enjoyed getting killed by you and your friend(s?), I very occassionally do like to play on the same team as good players instead of leading some low ELO peasant army against them.