131 replies to this topic

[MonkeyCheese]

Kaeb Odellas, on 19 November 2013 - 11:47 PM, said:

No ballistics? Check.

I dont really see this as a problem, it is purely personal preference.

To something I read in the Blazer Thread

627, on 19 November 2013 - 01:10 AM, said:

And more weapons are always good, especially on the heavy end of energy. biggest damage dealer is PPC and LPL and that's max an AC10 in comparison. So you'd get a "bigger" weapon which comes near gauss/AC20.

It is true energy weapons have nothing past an ac10 when comparing to ballistic weapons

That is one idea of what the Awesome really needs when competing with the other assault mechs a big FAT energy weapon.
Heavy_PPC
Binary_Laser_Cannon
Bombast_Laser

I think these kind of weapons would fit fine even if people think they are pointless or crazy, sure noone can boat crazy numbers of ppcs now but why cant an Awesome have a large energy weapon backed up by medium lasers/srms/ssrms/lrms??

It is likely we will only ever see the Heavy PPC and clan PPCs but I would love to strap any to the arm of my Awesome, and who knows it might make the Awesome more survivable if people do the "take the cannon arm off the wang" first.

Edit: or you know fix the LPL >.>

Edited by MonkeyCheese, 20 November 2013 - 12:25 AM.

[Roland]

Khobai, on 19 November 2013 - 01:55 PM, said:

All assault mechs have giant center torsos. The Awesome seems pretty on par with the other assaults now, the main issue before was how easy it was to headshot.

Er.. I have to disagree. I've never been killed through the head in my Awesome, ever.
Way back in closed beta, when it first showed up, THEN it was easy to headshot. But they shrunk the head down back then, and ever since it was fine.

The problem with the Awesome is that his front profile is GIGANTIC.

The fix, as many have pointed out many, many times, is to turn the "shoulder pads" into hitboxes for the ARMS, rather than the side torsos. This will dramatically increase the durability of the mech.

The problem with the awesome is that the only thing it really has going for it compared to other assault mechs, is the potential for agility... but since its sides are so huge, mounting an XL makes it dangerous. If they fixed the hit boxes as I suggest (to match what is seen in the mechlab when you select an arm), the Awesome might actually start being used more often.

Certainly, it's hurt by ghost heat, since it's freaking STOCK configuration can't alphastrike, but even with that gimp it could potentially be useful if it had better hit geometry.

Also, the engine cap on all of the variants really should be removed, so that all of the awesome variants can move quickly if someone chooses to configure them that way. The engine cap was a nerf that hit the Awesome harder than other assaults, and was totally unnecessary.

[John MatriX82]

Carrioncrows, on 19 November 2013 - 06:00 PM, said:

I know I told everyone not to get their hopes up but at this point feeling pretty betrayed.

Will be years before we can talk PGI into spending the time and money to do it right. At that point who cares.

Probably my fault for not doing a better job of explaining what it means to have intelligent hitboxes.

+500000. I opened up a thread in the patch feedback about this here: http://mwomercs.com/...on-the-awesome/

As usual, PGI didn't delivered the only worth change to the chassis that they could do. We're just venting air our of our mouths for more than 1 year.

[Tahribator]

The shoulders should have been a part of the arms, not the ST's. This solution has widely been circulating around the forums that I thought the devs could pick it up.

For the love of god, please open a "feedback thread" on forums before making changes to the "flawed" mechs so you can get the best solution to salvage these mechs from bottom of the pit.

[Carrioncrows]

Tahribator, on 20 November 2013 - 03:05 AM, said:

The shoulders should have been a part of the arms, not the ST's. This solution has widely been circulating around the forums that I thought the devs could pick it up.

For the love of god, please open a "feedback thread" on forums before making changes to the "flawed" mechs so you can get the best solution to salvage these mechs from bottom of the pit.

You know, I THOUGHT when they mentioned they would keep us up todate on what changes were being made to "what" mech's hitboxes for the soul purpose of opening that line of communication.

So the devs could post what they plan on changing and we the players could direct their attention to the problem areas in regards to said mech's hitboxes.

[Tahribator]

Carrioncrows, on 20 November 2013 - 03:07 AM, said:

You know, I THOUGHT when they mentioned they would keep us up todate on what changes were being made to "what" mech's hitboxes for the soul purpose of opening that line of communication.

So the devs could post what they plan on changing and we the players could direct their attention to the problem areas in regards to said mech's hitboxes.

This is what I love about EVE Online devs. They always open a thread on forums with proposed changes to the game balance/mechanics. After a while, they collect the feedback and open another thread with updated changes. So they keep the players who probably have more experience in things they're changing in loop.

Everybody's happy in the end. Not that it doesn't happen in MWO, but it's very inconsistent and sometimes leads to "missed chances" like this.

[GalaxyBluestar]

MonkeyCheese, on 19 November 2013 - 10:59 PM, said:

Still works wonders depending on pilot skill, heat control, situational awareness and of course what map you are on for things like cover and temperature. Oh and pick your fights well never fight other healthy assaults unless its lrms or the slowest stalker/atlas possible.

not denying your skills or anything but if an equal player using those same equal tactics came against you in any other mech, then say goodbye to your CT cause it's still a bit fat. if the shoulders became arms and more of the ST took up the CT space reducing the CT a little further the mech would be viably balanced against battlemasters and victors.

[627]

Davers, on 19 November 2013 - 08:03 PM, said:

When I fist see an Awesome in game my initial response is, "Why is that building shooting at me?"

LOL

If I didn't had a signature already I'd have one now

[GizmoGecko]

Nevermind this, I'm dreading the geometry changes.

Firstly, look at what they did to the K2. Say goodbye to the Awesome's manhood!

And secondly, if they limit the 3 missile slots on the 8V so that 3 SRM6s no longer fire all at once (my arty AC/36), I'll only have my Dragon left to pray for.

Edited by GizmoGecko, 20 November 2013 - 04:06 AM.

[MonkeyCheese]

GalaxyBluestar, on 20 November 2013 - 03:21 AM, said:

not denying your skills or anything but if an equal player using those same equal tactics came against you in any other mech, then say goodbye to your CT cause it's still a bit fat. if the shoulders became arms and more of the ST took up the CT space reducing the CT a little further the mech would be viably balanced against battlemasters and victors.

Everyone is for the shoulder change. I would love to lose my arm or arms in my awesome for once, even with crazy torso twisting it is rare.

[MustrumRidcully]

Khobai, on 19 November 2013 - 04:06 PM, said:

Shoot it in the crotch. Counts as CT.

Now, but don't the upcoming changes including changing the crotch to be left and right leg? Of course, one could make an exception for the Stalker if it is deemed necessary.

[Kaeb Odellas]

MonkeyCheese, on 20 November 2013 - 12:16 AM, said:

I dont really see this as a problem, it is purely personal preference.

To something I read in the Blazer Thread



It is true energy weapons have nothing past an ac10 when comparing to ballistic weapons

That is one idea of what the Awesome really needs when competing with the other assault mechs a big FAT energy weapon.
Heavy_PPC
Binary_Laser_Cannon
Bombast_Laser

I think these kind of weapons would fit fine even if people think they are pointless or crazy, sure noone can boat crazy numbers of ppcs now but why cant an Awesome have a large energy weapon backed up by medium lasers/srms/ssrms/lrms??

It is likely we will only ever see the Heavy PPC and clan PPCs but I would love to strap any to the arm of my Awesome, and who knows it might make the Awesome more survivable if people do the "take the cannon arm off the wang" first.

Edit: or you know fix the LPL >.>

The lack of ballistic options is certainly a disadvantage for the Awesome. Ballistics combine low heat, relatively high fire rate, and pinpoint accuracy that allows that other chassis to sustain pinpoint fire far longer than the Awesome can. Sure, the Stalker doesn't have ballistics either, but they have the advantage of multiple high-mounted energy hardpoints on the arms that allow them to shoot without exposing too much of their bodies.

This is not to say that giving the Awesome ballistic hardpoints is a real option, since it would still be inferior to the Victor in every other way, but the lack of that option is definitely

Adding big, hard-hitting energy weapons or buffing the LPL wouldn't provide any advantage to the Awesome at all, as other mechs can still easily carry those weapons and large energy weapons tend to generate lots of heat.

[Koniving]

Carrioncrows, on 19 November 2013 - 06:00 PM, said:

With your version I see a merit and an issue.

We'll go with the issue first. They can't "remove" the 'shoulders' when the arms go, and the arms are really easy to destroy as it is. In fact even if they remove the 'ghost' hitbox that always lingers after the arm is gone (see Centurion 'ghost arm' issue), there's still 25% of the arm left over to cut damage by 50%. But who actually aims that high?

Now here's where that becomes a merit. LRM strikes from any real distance (where an Awesome should be instead of the front line) will come straight down. That means the arms would take a lot of the damage, and later on, reduce a lot of the damage. What this means is that much like a Stalker is actually highly vulnerable to LRMs at long range and not so much to direct fire, the Awesome with Carrion Crow's changes would be highly resistant to LRMs at long range. The downfall to this is that with either design, the CT will take lots more LRM damage than the STs due to the fact that the front CT encompasses the head on all sides.

Both styles leave one core problem. You can kill the Awesome's front CT from behind by hitting the top or back of the head with the slightest upward angle. Much like you can fry the Hunchback's left rear torso by shooting the cylinder from in front or its front CT by hitting the back of its head.

I just hope they don't change the Hunchback's right torso. Right now with about 85 to 90% of the RT covered by right front armor, putting 46 front and 2 rear makes an XL engine and just protecting that hunch so perfectly viable that I can brawl against AC/20 Jagers with a shotgun, 2 MGs and 3 SPL and come out on top. If they start splitting that side torso... I'll be screwed.

[BlackIronTarkus]

Someone with elite awesome try this build and tells me if its survivability is high.

Thanks: AWS-9M zombie

[Carrioncrows]

Koniving, on 20 November 2013 - 06:30 AM, said:

With your version I see a merit and an issue.

We'll go with the issue first. They can't "remove" the 'shoulders' when the arms go, and the arms are really easy to destroy as it is. In fact even if they remove the 'ghost' hitbox that always lingers after the arm is gone (see Centurion 'ghost arm' issue), there's still 25% of the arm left over to cut damage by 50%. But who actually aims that high?

That's the idea.

The arms themselves do not have a lot of hardpoints in them. The one verson that does, the 8T has 2 energy in each arm and besides that the only other mech is the Pretty baby with 3 hardpoints in the arms.

The arms are there to be used and need to be used.

Where this is going to come into play is for hill humping, cresting a hill and firing and then back down again.

The Awesome is renown for being a mid to long range sniper so having those hit boxs up high will help alleviate some of the damage and though the Awesome has some lower mounted hardpoints it can still be effective by taking the hit on the shoulders and returning fire.

This lines up with the lore of the awesome. Because it has those massive shoulder blades and pauldrons in just about every render or picture ever made. So anything that makes the awesome more unique and tougher is a good thing.

I am all about making assault mechs tougher.

This doesn't mean adding more armor, it means that you have to peel it: Arms, ST, CT.

And yes if it means you have to go through the arm to get to the CT because you have a poor angle or are a bad shot. Well that's just rewarding the pilot for doing a good job of protecting himself. That is what skill is on both sides of the engagement.

[Koniving]

I'll have to look at your thread again later on to analyze the results that would come of each rig. I can't recall, did you do back views as well?

[M4NTiC0R3X]

Oh, and 5 tons aside.... the battlemaster can do damn near anything the Awesome 9M can do.. only better.

Can you believe it? What... I can take almost the exact same loadout as my 9M AND PUT an AC/2 in the other arm...... {scrap} yes!

[CDLord HHGD]

Khobai, on 19 November 2013 - 04:06 PM, said:

Shoot it in the crotch. Counts as CT.

SHOOT IT IN IT'S CYLON FACE!

[Voivode]

It feels like an assault now. Damage doesn't all fall on center torso. I've run quite a few matches and I've lost at least one side torso each time I died. Usually both. Just like dying in an Atlas or a Highlander or a Stalker. It's.....an actual assault mech now.

[HammerSwarm]

Carrioncrows, on 19 November 2013 - 06:13 PM, said:

With the exception of the head hitbox change, Still a POS and not fit for play.

I don't always agree with Carrion Crows but when he's right he's right. When I was looking at the model for this thing I kept thinking, why isn't that beveled area considered a ST then I saw his thing and boom, truthshot.

The rabble appears to be in favor of additional changes. Keep working on it PGI you made these changes in a few weeks, in the next few weeks you should be able to get it right on this model and make the Awesome awesome.