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Dealing With Those Ac40 Mechs...


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#21 JigglyMoobs

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Posted 15 December 2013 - 03:39 PM

I do different things to counter them depending on what build I have.

Dual gauss - back up to 500 m or more. Take them apart with impunity.

Atlas-brawling config - Direct advance on their position. Arty strike followed by air strike if available. Use terrain cover if not. Use arms as shields. Close to point blank and use the >60 pt alpha repeatedly (usually only 2x to center torso)

Atlas-dual LL + 2xUAC5 - maneuver at 400 m and dakka to the face with strikes added as necessary/available. Torso twist or side step as necessary to avoid incoming shots.

Dual AC/10 jager - back up past 400 m or hide behind the nearest hill/Atlas. Use speed to flank or dodge shots.

Victor - find a hill and poptart from more than 300 m away.

If all else fails I can make some smug comments implying my own superiority for not using a dual AC/20 setup. ;)

Edited by JigglyMoobs, 15 December 2013 - 04:19 PM.


#22 Oogalook

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Posted 07 January 2014 - 08:18 AM

One thing I've certainly noticed is that the AC40 build is wasted if an Atlas decides to swat it down. No part of an atlas is vulnerable to less than three AC20 hits, and he's got the firepower to silence the sucker before it gets those off. In a full-on multi-mech brawl, if you run a brawler atlas, try to target and kill off the boomjager or boomcat before he hurts your weaker teammates.

#23 Geist Null

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Posted 07 January 2014 - 08:37 AM

90% of them rely on the zoom function far too heavily, and are easily flanked because they sacrifice their peripheral vision while lining up their shot or preparing to hump the top of the hill. come in fast from the side and tear into a torso, only takes 30-40 damage in one location to set a veteran pilot on edge and a bad pilot will outright panic and begin to flail about.

#24 Doctor Proctor

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Posted 07 January 2014 - 08:52 AM

View PostJigglyMoobs, on 15 December 2013 - 03:39 PM, said:

I do different things to counter them depending on what build I have.

Dual gauss - back up to 500 m or more. Take them apart with impunity.

Atlas-brawling config - Direct advance on their position. Arty strike followed by air strike if available. Use terrain cover if not. Use arms as shields. Close to point blank and use the >60 pt alpha repeatedly (usually only 2x to center torso)

Atlas-dual LL + 2xUAC5 - maneuver at 400 m and dakka to the face with strikes added as necessary/available. Torso twist or side step as necessary to avoid incoming shots.

Dual AC/10 jager - back up past 400 m or hide behind the nearest hill/Atlas. Use speed to flank or dodge shots.

Victor - find a hill and poptart from more than 300 m away.

If all else fails I can make some smug comments implying my own superiority for not using a dual AC/20 setup. ;)


See, the problem is that every strategy for dealing with them involves something like the above. Which, when boiled down to it's basics is "Bring another mech capable of mounting two huge ballistis (ie- Jager or K2) or an Assault". Mediums basically just get screwed by these guys because their weapon ranges are well within the threat zone of the AC/40 Jager or K2 with only a fraction of the damage output.

#25 Amsro

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Posted 10 January 2014 - 05:53 PM

Single Gauss headshots work nice! Such a large CT cockpit, much like my trusty Catapult.

I've never really had any issues with AC40 mechs 1vs1. Even in my Mediums I can take em out. ^_^

I still wouldn't recommend a staring contest with AC40. :P

#26 Kingdok

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 11:38 AM

View PostPiney, on 09 December 2013 - 10:32 AM, said:


Good post. As a sometimes AC40 Jager driver, I'll add:

1. Not all AC40 Jagers are slow.

3. Don't take that 4 second reload / cool down time as the norm. The mech can be chain firing those AC20s. As far as very light armor goes, not necessarily true. I have run AC40 Jagers with the armor almost maxxed out, but even with max armor, Jagers are still a little squishy. I agree with the XL engine - just pop the side torso.

The best counter to AC40 Jagers is to avoid close-in encounters with them - thats's playing the Jager's rules. Work those side torsos over from distance and pop that XL engine.


This -- hard counter for the AC40 Jager is as AC2 Jager driven by someone with a steady trigger hand. Kill it at 1000 meters.

#27 BadFortune

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 12:10 PM

I never had the K2 and I don't really see it that often on the battlefield. The Jager AC40 on the other hand is fairly common sight. After all it is the hot rod of the mech universe. Just slam in two AC20s and open the gates of hell.
I have one for a very long time now, and after reaching elite had some 100K xp more with the chassis just for fun. So I practically did all the mistakes that can be done with the chassis :rolleyes:

1. For starters, Jagers have a reputation packing AC40, so they also get extra attention on the battlefield. I got mobbed a couple of times myself. If you want to bring it down, separate it from the rest of it's team.

2. it does not go well with open air spaces. LRMs can shred it's armor in no time. I did most of my top damages in tunnels, where space for movement is limited, and the enemy can't hide from the terror.

3. Side torsos are obvious targets, as they have XL. However, there are more annoying things to lose. The AC20 takes up ALL the space in the arm. Once the armor is gone, the cannon will fail shortly. The other problem is ammunition, which is around 6 tons, spread around the body, with the bulk in the leg, which is by the way usually lightly armored. If the leg is gone, it slows down, and ammo is lost. Dead man walking.

4. AC20 is devastating on short range, so keep your distance. LRMs and dakka mechs can make an AC40 pilot's day a complete misery.

#28 Kjudoon

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 12:42 PM

My LRMs love them glass cannons. Repeat after me "Side Torso kills due to XL engines". Mmmmmmmmm. AC40/Dual Gauss cannot kill the mountain/building I'm behind.

If they're fast, XL. If they're slow, Std.

Edited by Kjudoon, 21 January 2014 - 12:42 PM.


#29 kesuga7

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 12:47 PM

has anyone been ingame to see how the jagger mech Side torso hitboxes have been adjusted?

according to the patch notes their now bigger?!

#30 Damon Howe

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 01:02 PM

View PostMcchuggernaut, on 09 December 2013 - 04:21 AM, said:

Hope these pointers help someone, and if anyone thinks of something I didn't, please share!


If you are a light mech, do not simply stand still when you're capping a base.

A dual Ac20 Cicada is easily hidden and just as deadly.

#31 Barkem Squirrel

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 01:10 PM

On some of the maps it is easy to deal with them, LRM's.

That's right sit back at 900 meters and just start unloading, but moving side to side. We do not want to present a nice fat LRM boat target for his buddies that can hit us.

I agree that stinking AC 40 Cicada does a job. I even saw it once in a match nail a mech on cap. Then on one Twitch stream to an atlas
.

#32 990Dreams

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 01:17 PM

From an AC/40 pilot:
  • Fire during their reloading time (4 seconds).
  • Aim for the Side Torsi. Even without an XL you could trigger an ammo explosion, and even without that you lower their weapon efficiency by 50% or more.
  • The back armor is often the least armored.
  • Never ever ever ever put yourself in front of it if possible.
  • If you see one and it doesn't see you, get backup before attacking.
  • Lights are hard to hit.
  • If he doesn't know how to lead (which if he is piloting it he should, but still) then moving at 81+ is OK (risky but OK).
  • If it isn't firing, it is OOA or saving it's last ammo for a critical shot.
  • Never give it a good shot. Always keep moving, regardless of how slow you are.
  • Jump Jetting makes hitting you harder. Randomly trigger your JJs (this puts your legs at risk).
  • AC/40 vs AC/40: May the best pilot win.
  • Make it overheat itself if possible (flamers are a big help!)
  • Always fight in an open area (lakes) or a closed area (where you can get behind cover but still maneuver).


#33 Kjudoon

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 01:25 PM

Quote

If he doesn't know how to lead (which if he is piloting it he should, but still) then moving at 81+ is OK (risky but OK).


What I've been hearing from those who pay attention to top tier play and teams, any mech moving under 150kph is just the same as all the rest. So YMMV.

Good advice none the less. I still recommend learning to poptart better, LRMs and keeping cover between you and them.

#34 Shar Wolf

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 01:38 PM

View PostDavidHurricane, on 21 January 2014 - 01:17 PM, said:

  • Make it overheat itself if possible (flamers are a big help!)



:lol: :)

Edit: weird rows of smileys.... out of nowhere.

Edited by Shar Wolf, 21 January 2014 - 01:39 PM.


#35 Karl Carver

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 02:25 PM

View Postkesuga7, on 21 January 2014 - 12:47 PM, said:

has anyone been ingame to see how the jagger mech Side torso hitboxes have been adjusted?

according to the patch notes their now bigger?!


Yes, the mech seems a little more fragile since the patch.

As to the negative sentiments regarding these builds, they have their limiters too. Namely ammo limits and range limits. Its a fair trade off for the damage imo.

And these builds have been around a long time, i ran a Victor with dual UAC20's in mercs, and also a Hauptmann with three LBX 20's in mercs.

Same trade off, lots of damage, but limited range and ammo.

Slighty different dynamic between Mercs and MWO, with the respawn feature in Mercs, you had to balance your ammo to armour ratio just right. ie: when your ammo ran out, your armour should too, so you get killed and respawn. Nothing worse than running around with no ammo and lots of armour.

#36 Just wanna play

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 02:46 PM

View PostDoctor Proctor, on 07 January 2014 - 08:52 AM, said:


See, the problem is that every strategy for dealing with them involves something like the above. Which, when boiled down to it's basics is "Bring another mech capable of mounting two huge ballistis (ie- Jager or K2) or an Assault". Mediums basically just get screwed by these guys because their weapon ranges are well within the threat zone of the AC/40 Jager or K2 with only a fraction of the damage output.

i have three ac 5s on my medium, same average dps, slightly less alpha damage, and i have a stronger ct then he has side, he takes 8 seconds to kill me, i will kill him in 7.5 seconds, which would stop him from even getting off the last shot, as well i more range, so you sure it needs to be two huge ballistics? :lol: the big problem with huge ballistics is after a certain amount of shots, the target is already low on health, but your big, over kill weapon still needs to reload for a long time, if you have a BIG problem with dual ac40 things, lower your armor but still make sure it will take as many shots to kill you from them still granted, a medium shouldn't be taking on something with dual 20s in the first place and be expecting to win anyway... unless its an lrm medium ex: Treb

and for dual guass, just out dps them, they have pretty terrible dmg out put, but good range

#37 Just wanna play

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 03:01 PM

and if you HAVE to let it hit you, don't run after it actually hits you, then its just getting time to reload

#38 Al Bert

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 03:04 PM

View PostMcchuggernaut, on 09 December 2013 - 04:21 AM, said:

...
Hope these pointers help someone, and if anyone thinks of something I didn't, please share!


Definitely one of the much better posts i have sern lately. +1 from me & t!hx for the effort

Edited by Al Bert, 21 January 2014 - 03:05 PM.


#39 bowlie

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 08:57 AM

I just go straight at them. Probably not smart, but I adopt the same mindset as the british army; to advance and destroy my enemy. At that moment in time, the ac40 is probably my biggest threat, so im going straight for it.

Edited by bowlie, 27 January 2014 - 08:57 AM.


#40 990Dreams

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 09:10 AM

You always hit it hard and don't give it a chance to fire back. Always.

When you have more than 2 people attacking it it becomes even deadlier.





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