1978 replies to this topic

[BluefireMW]

some ideas are not so bad... but if you start to change the tonnage of weapons compared to the Classic BattleTech and don't leave us to build the mechs intended to be the base variants. Like a Summoner Prime because of that the launcher is to heavy, then you are so far from that game, that you do not deserve any money from players for this game, or the players itself.
I know it's not the same game as the Tabletop, but you use the designs from that game, so don't break it up in that way...

How about limit the tonnage per trop and limit the tonnage for clanner more then Inner Sphere.
It's a easy way and you need to destroy all you live from ... People who like that game and support you and doing a good game

[Jess Hazen]

You IGP guys **** up everything by your constant balancing, since many things were already balanced with lots of wiggle room in grey areas. All of your efforts its all for nothing, a waste of time and resources.

[MisterPlanetarian]

Biggst concern by far is the light weight armor and low speed on some of the clan light mechs making them easy targets. Some heavies like the Summoner and Hellbringer suffer from this aswell, even though they can mount firepower and speed to kinda make up for it in TT, it will cause problems in MWO.

[Rigmoran]

Njal, on 14 December 2013 - 02:15 PM, said:

One of the things that helped the IS againt the clans was double tonnage and physical attacks which the clanners refused to use. So make a MadCat worth 150tons in matchmaking and allow us to kick it to pieces. In that case i would not care for weapons balancing.

I'd swear they used to fight with a star of clan mechs (5) vs two lances on IS mechs (8). Can we give that a try and see what happens without coming up with a bunch of extra rules and changes to canon to make it work in PGI's eyes?

[xhrit]

arden, on 14 December 2013 - 11:36 PM, said:

At this point I wish MW 3025 made it to stores, we would already have fan based CW leagues in full effect. I wonder what the MWLL team, or mektek could have done with the kind of money we stupid people have spent on the {Scrap} that MWO has become.

Mektek is trying to build Heavy Gear Online.

Sad, but I doubt they are going to reach their funding goal.

[CGB Behemoth]

Clan tech - is not clan tech!
Omni mechs - is not omni mechs!
Is it Mechwarrior game - no it is not!

[Hythos]

Clan Honor via Code of Ethics is the REAL intended spirit of the Clans!

[Selfish]

The weapons are still more powerful than the weapons we currently have. LRMs are a straight upgrade even when balanced by weapon sizing. Lasers are more economical and with better range. Those are the two most important factors to falloff fighting, which is the only niche lasers occupy when you go competitive. Its Mlas battery boats are going to be weaker due to duration, but the good news is that Clan Mplas have longer ranges than IS Mlas.

Autocannons should have been mentioned, as they're the most powerful weapon system currently in the game. How are you balancing UAC/20s, which are feasible on even the 30 ton JJ+ECM+3x AMS Kit Fox?

Clan XL Engines should've been one of the first topics. Clan XLs require both side torsos to be destroyed, and by extension make clan XLs more durable than IS STD engines. They're integral to the clan design process as they impact clan mitigation and survivability.

Armor + Engine locking is a bad approach. It creates an artificial heirarchy of mechs that are usable and those that aren't. TT made its stock mechs purposefully gimped in ways to balance them. That system of balance does not translate to this game, and abiding by it is the same mistake PGI has been trying to correct for the current trials with "champions".

[Taifune]

Rigmoran, on 15 December 2013 - 09:01 AM, said:

I'd swear they used to fight with a star of clan mechs (5) vs two lances on IS mechs (8). Can we give that a try and see what happens without coming up with a bunch of extra rules and changes to canon to make it work in PGI's eyes?

it's an easy way to balance clans in first place... other (minor) adjustments might come with it, but don't make clans to something completely different from what they are...

I also like the idea someone brought up for clans being able to do (minor) pre round modifications in the loading screen of a map, reflecting the versatility os Omni mechs...

[Hythos]

arkani, on 15 December 2013 - 07:14 AM, said:

two stars (10 mechs) against three lances (12 mechs), best freaking balance possible, instead of a moronic ghost heat and moronic nerfs on wepons.

KISS- KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID

Simply add to that, a restriction of not firing on someone else's target... You know, like their Code of Honor restricts them to?? You know, like the intended and actual spirit of the Clans????
If they fire on someone elses target, they forfeit the match - plain and simple.

Make Clan tech more powerful, but also make the pilot be more responsible... as intended.

[Hawk819]

I applaud this move. . . IMMENSELY. Sorry for the caps.

Allow me to elaborate. Let us say that is in a Thunderbolt, and one has only four UAC 2's and 2 UAC 5's. And one takes said Battlemech in to an Unlimited Ammo event for the Star Lance League. Now imagine everyone in Annihilators and Daishis and Sunders, and everyone of them is outfitted with nothing but Machine Guns and Clan Ultra AC 20's. Take a guess? Yep, you're out gunned by a factor of 200 to 1. Which means that scrawny Thunderbolt one thought would dominate the game is now nothing more than a walking bull's eye with paper thin armor.

That's MechWarrior 3 for ya. I know that MS dumbed it down, but that too was way better than what I faced with MW 3. Trust me, there was nothing more scarier than seeing a Daishi with five of those, count them, five, Ultra 20's coming after my ***. And me in a Thor no less. Now, here we are at MechWarrior Online. SO I ask the question: would any one here want to see a Daishi with five AC 20's coming after your *** on say Frozen City? I don't think so. Bad enough we've got mechs using more than one Gauss Rifles and AC 20, and it's a good thing they're limited to two only. Thank the Lord for that.

[Ryoken]

I think it is good that they face the challange to balance Clans.

I remind you - Battletech was never ballanced! And Clans VS Inner Sphere was never ballanced at all!

This is necesarry because else we would be all running around in the same mech with the same weapon loadout in no time. It is always a good thing to look at the competitive scene and what they are running to get an idea of the current balancing.

And then the next turn will start again with PGI seeing how the players use and abuse the current mechanics and they do the next step in balancing.

To some this might look like constant nerving of the optimal builds they have worked out.

Yet it is just the successive balancing of the game mechanics to avoid a monoculture where we all play the same mech with the same weapons. While there will be always an optimal build, it is PGI's task to keep the tip of this optimum as wide/broad as possible with all other mechs as close as good as possible.

This process is endless and will adapt to new mechs/weapons/game modes leading to ever finer balancing as it goes. We are still on the very beginning with so much more content on its way.

So think of this as it will save you a lot of nerves when you understand this spiral of development.

[Logan Bones]

StandingCow, on 14 December 2013 - 02:07 PM, said:

Seems to me like he totally missed the point of why people are angry. We don't care that the clans are here... we care about the grab deal so close to the last pack of mechs when basic things that have been promised as "right around the corner" multiple times STILL aren't out.

How about you wait to introduce this until UI 2.0 comes out and is good? Or how about until you have all your CW {Scrap} working and ready to go or all the details panned out?

You fix the stuff from this image, and I will MAYBE start to trust you all again:
Due to spam abuse. This image has been removed. Please provide feedback in written form.

You guys continue to make me ashamed of my Legendary and overlord tags... honestly you do.

PGI please read this cause this is how alot of the community feels including myself

[Jaguar Prime]

The big question for me is..... will Cross-tech be allowed?

[FupDup]

I took the time to create armor distributions for the whole Clan lineup in Smurfys (based off of TT armor layout), with engine included. Note that these "ghetto" versions below lack space-saving Clan tech and that IS Ferro Fibrous is heavier than the Clan version:

Kit Fox
Nova
Summoner (Supposed to be 350 XL but Cataphracts can't go that high)
Dire Wolf
Adder
Stormcrow
Timber Wolf (Supposed to be 375 XL but engine limit is too low on Orion)
Warhawk

Edited by FupDup, 15 December 2013 - 09:58 AM.

[Outlaw]

FupDup, on 15 December 2013 - 09:57 AM, said:

I took the time to create armor distributions for the whole Clan lineup in Smurfys (based off of TT armor layout), with engine included. Note that these "ghetto" versions below lack space-saving Clan tech and that IS Ferro Fibrous is heavier than the Clan version:

Kit Fox
Nova
Summoner (Supposed to be 350 XL but Cataphracts can't go that high)
Dire Wolf
Adder
Stormcrow
Timber Wolf (Supposed to be 375 XL but engine limit is too low on Orion)
Warhawk

Really just look at the TROs and double the armor points in each location, saves a lot more time lol. But it is nice to see that the Kit Fox isnt as under armored as i thought. The problem mechs are probably going to be the Mad Dog and most definitely the Hellbringer as it doesnt get any advantages of the weight saving tech. However if they are changing the weapon weights and what-not I hope they correct this as the only reasons the line developers gave for not giving the Hellbringer ES and FF was that they didnt want every mech having those technologies, so it was the "Token" Clan Omnimech in TRO 3050 to get this treatment

[Deadmeat313]

KhanHeir, on 14 December 2013 - 02:37 PM, said:

Oh yes the stagger fire is totally fine, we'll just load up our Streak 90 cats and melt you to death while focusing fire and jumping as hard as we can.


DO NOT LISTEN TO THIS FOOL.

I'LL LISTEN TO THE FOOL

The Inner Sphere won't have the Streak SRM6 in production until 3058, so you'll have to wait a while before you can run your souped-up Catapult.

On the other hand, an agile, mobile, missile spewing streak boat sounds like just the sort of thing the Clans would be all about! Clan Omnis should be terrifying to behold, even after a balance pass.

PS: The Omni you want is the Timber Wolf D: 2 x ERPPC, 4 x SSRM6 It will indeed make your Kintaro cry.

[FupDup]

Outlaw, on 15 December 2013 - 10:03 AM, said:

Really just look at the TROs and double the armor points in each location, saves a lot more time lol.

That's exactly what I did, most of the time consumed came from copying them into Smurfys. And the Kit Fox is still pretty horrible; it has the same leg armor as a Locust and only half the speed.

Edited by FupDup, 15 December 2013 - 10:10 AM.

[NyxOOX]

Ghogiel, on 14 December 2013 - 10:03 PM, said:

Um... you need to reread the the post.

I think you can make a hex UAC2 daishi.

You use config C for the 4 AC2s in the side torsos, swap the LBX10 for another UAC2, that's 5, and if I understand correctly you can swap the left arm hardpoint pod with the prime variant so you can now add ballistics there too.

While you are correct, and I thank you for bringing my hopes back up, you're wrong about the variants. You're thinking of config B for the UAC/2s, not config C, which carries ATMs and thus doesn't exist yet.

[Talrich]

Just give clan LRMs a minimum. I don't think that adding another mostly-invisible (a.k.a. ghost range) game mechanic is a good idea. I already see enough new players firing LRMs under the minimum.

Partial damage at short range also doesn't make sense story-wise to me. I took the minimum ranges on missiles as pertains to the missiles' warheads arming after they leave the tubes. Clan tech was so reliable that they didn't need those safeties.