121 replies to this topic

[colsan]

Varent, on 02 January 2014 - 12:56 PM, said:

I wasnt being humorous at all... if you dont think it will work try it first. You will have a blast, trust me.

Not humorous? Streaks?! Why is carrying a bunch of weapons that I can't even fire "a blast," exactly?

And yes, lasers are the only things that can actually hit them, but again, against more than one, it takes so long because the damage spreads out that his buddies will have cored you from behind while you are trying to leg one of them.

YueFei, on 02 January 2014 - 01:01 PM, said:

I hope you enjoy never getting any better at anything in life with that attitude you give to people who try to teach you things after you specifically asked for advice. LOL.

He told me to carry a heavy streak load against multiple ECM light mechs! I don't imagine I will learn much of anything with teachers like that.

DanNashe, on 02 January 2014 - 01:12 PM, said:

Light killing mediums are legit though.

It's the lights killing heavies and assaults that bothers me.

[Mister Blastman]

SirLANsalot, on 01 January 2014 - 10:25 PM, said:

Weapons are just tools, how you use them is up to you and your opponents, just because it seems like PPC/Gauss are "OP" or are "overused" doesn't mean there is something wrong with them. Just means you need to think differently from them, to break away, maybe use an AC20 to get up close to those people. Use cover till such a time that presents itself for you to walk in and pour our hot death with MPL's or AC20's. This game IS a thinking mans shooter, and the thinking STARTS in the mechlab.

Umm. No. There are significant balance issues with PPCs + Autocannons right now. I guarantee it.

[Dock Steward]

colsan, on 02 January 2014 - 01:19 PM, said:

Not humorous? Streaks?! Why is carrying a bunch of weapons that I can't even fire "a blast," exactly?

Serious question: Do you know what BAP is and what it does?

Edited by Dock Steward, 02 January 2014 - 01:22 PM.

[Varent]

Dock Steward, on 02 January 2014 - 01:22 PM, said:

Serious question: Do you know what BAP is and what it does?

Kinda.. wondering that myself.... I did mention that you carry a bap in all those medium mechs right? o.O

[Mcgral18]

colsan, on 02 January 2014 - 01:19 PM, said:

Not humorous? Streaks?! Why is carrying a bunch of weapons that I can't even fire "a blast," exactly?

And yes, lasers are the only things that can actually hit them, but again, against more than one, it takes so long because the damage spreads out that his buddies will have cored you from behind while you are trying to leg one of them.



He told me to carry a heavy streak load against multiple ECM light mechs! I don't imagine I will learn much of anything with teachers like that.



It's the lights killing heavies and assaults that bothers me.

Seems to me PGI doesn't do a good job of teaching the new players how equipment functions.

And that new players can be very rude and thick headed.

BAP stop a single ECM within around 150M, longer with Adv sensor range.

[YueFei]

colsan, on 02 January 2014 - 01:19 PM, said:

Not humorous? Streaks?! Why is carrying a bunch of weapons that I can't even fire "a blast," exactly?

And yes, lasers are the only things that can actually hit them, but again, against more than one, it takes so long because the damage spreads out that his buddies will have cored you from behind while you are trying to leg one of them.



He told me to carry a heavy streak load against multiple ECM light mechs! I don't imagine I will learn much of anything with teachers like that.

He told you to bring friends, you *****. Since when is expecting to win a 4v1 reasonable?? Bring 4 Shadowhawks, run 116 kph, each with BAP and Streaks, use proper pursuit angles to coral the enemy light mechs into the edge of the map and faceroll them with streak missiles.

Next you'll complain that Shadowhawks equipped that way are at a disadvantage against enemy Heavies and Assaults. No really? You mean a mech loadout has trade-offs and advantages and disadvantages? Who would've thought?

[colsan]

Dock Steward, on 02 January 2014 - 01:01 PM, said:

Some players complain that Veteran MWO players do nothing to help newer players. Then they try to, and get this^^. No wonder so many Vets don't care to try anymore.

After 1500 matches, I no longer consider myself a newer player; my k/d is nothing to write home about, but my win/loss is pretty good.

My question was a legitimate criticism of the current state of balance (or rather, monstrous lack thereof) in the game.

Then I have some guy come and tell me to load a bunch of weapons that I can't even fire in the situation I'm complaining about, and it's somehow insulting that I thought it was a joke?

Again, I must be on the wrong forum, because in the game I play, about 2/3 of games have significant ECM presence, and about half of that, there are 2 or more light mechs with multiple ECM that BAP will not counter. In reality, I suspect that it is a radical difference in ELO.

My most successful killer is an A1 catapult with 6/SRM6, just because it does enough damage that the odd lucky hit will at least cripple them. Even then, though, I will be lucky to kill one before his 3 friends core me from behind, or at least carve off my ears (where all the weapons are).

Dock Steward, on 02 January 2014 - 01:22 PM, said:

Serious question: Do you know what BAP is and what it does?

Serious question: Do you actually play the frigging game?!

Yes, I know what BAP is; do you know what 2 ECM mechs do to BAP?

Mcgral18, on 02 January 2014 - 01:26 PM, said:

BAP stop a single ECM within around 150M, longer with Adv sensor range.

2! Two! More than one! How is this not clear?

YueFei, on 02 January 2014 - 01:27 PM, said:

He told you to bring friends, you *****. Since when is expecting to win a 4v1 reasonable?? Bring 4 Shadowhawks, run 116 kph, each with BAP and Streaks, use proper pursuit angles to coral the enemy light mechs into the edge of the map and faceroll them with streak missiles.

So, I need 3 friends with medium mechs fully customized to fight light ECM mechs in order to be able to kill a pair of them, and even then ALL THOSE STREAKS WON'T WORK.

Does anyone actually play the game?!

YueFei, on 02 January 2014 - 01:27 PM, said:

Next you'll complain that Shadowhawks equipped that way are at a disadvantage against enemy Heavies and Assaults. No really? You mean a mech loadout has trade-offs and advantages and disadvantages? Who would've thought?

When 2 lights can cut off and destroy an assault without taking any serious damage in return more often than not, yes, there is a problem.

[Mcgral18]

colsan, on 02 January 2014 - 01:31 PM, said:

After 1500 matches, I no longer consider myself a newer player; my k/d is nothing to write home about, but my win/loss is pretty good.

My question was a legitimate criticism of the current state of balance (or rather, monstrous lack thereof) in the game.

Then I have some guy come and tell me to load a bunch of weapons that I can't even fire in the situation I'm complaining about, and it's somehow insulting that I thought it was a joke?

Again, I must be on the wrong forum, because in the game I play, about 2/3 of games have significant ECM presence, and about half of that, there are 2 or more light mechs with multiple ECM that BAP will not counter. In reality, I suspect that it is a radical difference in ELO.

My most successful killer is an A1 catapult with 6/SRM6, just because it does enough damage that the odd lucky hit will at least cripple them. Even then, though, I will be lucky to kill one before his 3 friends core me from behind, or at least carve off my ears (where all the weapons are).



Serious question: Do you actually play the frigging game?!

Yes, I know what BAP is; do you know what 2 ECM mechs do to BAP?



2! Two! More than one! How is this not clear?

And we said bring a group, did you not read that?

2 VS 1 the two will normally win, bring a friend. Stop raging and blaming.

[Dock Steward]

colsan, on 02 January 2014 - 01:31 PM, said:

After 1500 matches, I no longer consider myself a newer player; my k/d is nothing to write home about, but my win/loss is pretty good.

My question was a legitimate criticism of the current state of balance (or rather, monstrous lack thereof) in the game.

Then I have some guy come and tell me to load a bunch of weapons that I can't even fire in the situation I'm complaining about, and it's somehow insulting that I thought it was a joke?

Again, I must be on the wrong forum, because in the game I play, about 2/3 of games have significant ECM presence, and about half of that, there are 2 or more light mechs with multiple ECM that BAP will not counter. In reality, I suspect that it is a radical difference in ELO.

My most successful killer is an A1 catapult with 6/SRM6, just because it does enough damage that the odd lucky hit will at least cripple them. Even then, though, I will be lucky to kill one before his 3 friends core me from behind, or at least carve off my ears (where all the weapons are).



Serious question: Do you actually play the frigging game?!

Yes, I know what BAP is; do you know what 2 ECM mechs do to BAP?



2! Two! More than one! How is this not clear?

Literally everything in this post (from your choice of A1, to your misunderstanding of how Elo works, to your Rambo attitude) screams new player. My mistake I suppose.

[Varent]

colsan, on 02 January 2014 - 01:33 PM, said:

After 1500 matches, I no longer consider myself a newer player; my k/d is nothing to write home about, but my win/loss is pretty good.

My question was a legitimate criticism of the current state of balance (or rather, monstrous lack thereof) in the game.

Then I have some guy come and tell me to load a bunch of weapons that I can't even fire in the situation I'm complaining about, and it's somehow insulting that I thought it was a joke?

Again, I must be on the wrong forum, because in the game I play, about 2/3 of games have significant ECM presence, and about half of that, there are 2 or more light mechs with multiple ECM that BAP will not counter. In reality, I suspect that it is a radical difference in ELO.

My most successful killer is an A1 catapult with 6/SRM6, just because it does enough damage that the odd lucky hit will at least cripple them. Even then, though, I will be lucky to kill one before his 3 friends core me from behind, or at least carve off my ears (where all the weapons are).



Serious question: Do you actually play the frigging game?!

Yes, I know what BAP is; do you know what 2 ECM mechs do to BAP?



2! Two! More than one! How is this not clear?



So, I need 3 friends with medium mechs fully customized to fight light ECM mechs in order to be able to kill a pair of them, and even then ALL THOSE STREAKS WON'T WORK.

Does anyone actually play the game?!





When 2 lights can cut off and destroy an assault without taking any serious damage in return more often than not, yes, there is a problem.

Ok im humorous so I apologize a head of time but I ant help myself... so..

4 light ecm mechs walk into a bar....

4 medium BAP mechs meet them...

Light mechs die!

TA DA!



Truly though dude.... if you dont believe us just try it out. Its a pretty common thing. Most High Elo groups usually have one or two of these builds hanging out for the specific reason of eating light mechs alive. That said then function well even against non light mechs too. Give it a shot before you shoot it down. I wouldbe more then happy to run one with ya or help ya build one, just shoot me a message

[YueFei]

colsan, on 02 January 2014 - 01:33 PM, said:

So, I need 3 friends with medium mechs fully customized to fight light ECM mechs in order to be able to kill a pair of them, and even then ALL THOSE STREAKS WON'T WORK.

Does anyone actually play the game?!

LOL, yah, I see arithmetic isn't being taught in schools anymore. Did you know that 4 > 2? Thus 4 Medium mechs with BAP will absolutely cancel out 2 Lights with ECM? Thus your STREAKS WILL WORK?

Did you realize 4 > 1? Can you see how it MAKES PERFECT SENSE TO LOSE IN A SITUATION LIKE THAT?

You're so damn dense that they should use your flesh as radiation shielding for the nuclear reactors. I really hope you take this attitude with you into the workplace, I am sure it will lead to a promotion when your boss asks you why you aren't getting results and all you have for him are excuses.

[Varent]

well he does have a point that when two light mechs can take on an assault easily there is a problem. But really there isnt much that can be done about that other then. MAKE SURE LASER WEAPONS DONT GET BUFFED AND MAKE SURE BALISTICS STAY AS THEY ARE. But then again who knows. I suppose I can just run a light mech if they change it and make people cry until they change it back :3

[SirLANsalot]

Mister Blastman, on 02 January 2014 - 01:20 PM, said:

Umm. No. There are significant balance issues with PPCs + Autocannons right now. I guarantee it.

PPC had "issues" when people cried foul back in CB of them being too hot (pre DHS) and as such were rarely used. PPC heat was reduced and DHS came shortly after. Now back then we had very few mech chassis to work with and on, so it was justified and fine. Now we have 113 mechs, and they had to go back and put PPC heat back to its original level, and people are crying again about there "too hot".


AC's have never changed, even the "issue" mechs people talk about were ones that were around just after CB ended and have been around for a long time. The builds for them have changed over time, but that doesn't mean its all "stale" it just means you need to think harder of what mech to use with XX build to beat YY mech with ZZ build. Contingency plans, build your mech with X situation in mind and try and play TO your mechs strengths, not your enemy's and you will find that you will do 10x better REGARDLESS of what the enemy brings. EvE online is a PRIME example of this, many different ships/sizes each one with strengths and weaknesses and a fleet commander has to think what to bring to a fight. Same thing applies here, in both the trench's (your mech and build) and from the commanders perspective (what class and tonnages to bring).

That statement I made about the PPC/Gauss was an example of what to do when you come across some so called "meta". Think of WHY people are using that, and then think of ways to BEAT that way of thinking. You will become a better player for it.

[YueFei]

Varent, on 02 January 2014 - 02:07 PM, said:

well he does have a point that when two light mechs can take on an assault easily there is a problem. But really there isnt much that can be done about that other then. MAKE SURE LASER WEAPONS DONT GET BUFFED AND MAKE SURE BALISTICS STAY AS THEY ARE. But then again who knows. I suppose I can just run a light mech if they change it and make people cry until they change it back :3

2v1 is supposed to be hard, though. Simply because of angles. You will always have 1 guy shooting you in the back. I don't see this as a problem because I think it's perfectly fine that 2 guys working together can take down 1 guy.

[colsan]

Mcgral18, on 02 January 2014 - 01:33 PM, said:

And we said bring a group, did you not read that? 2 VS 1 the two will normally win, bring a friend. Stop raging and blaming.

None of my friends play; all due respect to teamspeak, but I would rather have burning toothpicks shoved under my toenails than put up with random strangers yelling obscenities through my speakers. Fixing the inherent imbalance in the game might encourage more people to play, then maybe someone in my circle of friends would be on to run with.

Beyond that, if I get a friend and we 2-man, what do we do against a 4-man wolfpack? Find 2 more friends to play, just to be able to swat the little ****ers? Then they get another 4-man wolfpack, so we need another 4.... this is starting to sound like a pyramid scheme.

This is not "rage and blame," this is 6 months of playing this stupid game and getting fed up with seeing heavy/assault lances getting chopped up by 4 light mechs, just because you can't effectively shoot back at them.

Let me put it this way: I have no problem fighting assault mechs in a light; I have serious problems fighting light mechs in an assault. Even the best heavy, the catapult, gets overwhelmed by more than one ECM; BAP just doesn't work, so no streaks, SRMs are bugged and ridiculously hard to aim in any case, ballistics are slightly better but slow, smoke blurs your vision, etc, lasers are hot and spread out damage.

Yes, I can see where having a group helps, but only if you have equal or greater numbers, and in any case, medium mechs are the worst choice: Not fast enough to avoid getting hit, not tough enough to take the damage and not big enough to carry enough weapons to worry about.

To be fair, on the other side, assaults suck compared to heavies, so at least they are consistent about.... whatever you call this.

YueFei, on 02 January 2014 - 01:51 PM, said:

LOL, yah, I see arithmetic isn't being taught in schools anymore. Did you know that 4 > 2? Thus 4 Medium mechs with BAP will absolutely cancel out 2 Lights with ECM? Thus your STREAKS WILL WORK? Did you realize 4 > 1? Can you see how it MAKES PERFECT SENSE TO LOSE IN A SITUATION LIKE THAT? You're so damn dense that they should use your flesh as radiation shielding for the nuclear reactors. I really hope you take this attitude with you into the workplace, I am sure it will lead to a promotion when your boss asks you why you aren't getting results and all you have for him are excuses.

Again, I need 4 MEDIUM mechs to fight off 2 LIGHT mechs; this isn't screwed up to you?

As for BAP canceling out ECM, no, I have never had that experience. I do not believe that I have ever been in a match teamed with more than one other person who ever had BAP.

Everyone solution here seems to reduce to the same argument: "Get a bunch of your friends to play or leave." My friends don't like the game; does that really only leave me one option?

[Dock Steward]

colsan, on 02 January 2014 - 03:03 PM, said:

Everyone solution here seems to reduce to the same argument: "Get a bunch of your friends to play or leave." My friends don't like the game; does that really only leave me one option?

There was this suggestion:

Mcgral18, on 02 January 2014 - 12:39 PM, said:

Streaks work wonders since they are pretty much auto hit and do 2.5 compared to SRMs 2.0.

Lasers and ballistics for the most part work fine, just have to aim them correctly. Bring an LB10 if that doesn't work for you, you're bound to hit something.

But your reply was basically, none of those weapons work. I'm sorry, I'm never one to lower myself to the "L2P" response, but practice might be what you need in this situation. I mean that with absolutely no snark.

Do you know the trick with walking backwards to screw up their circle of death? Quite an effective counter-tactic...

[Lostdragon]

Varent, on 02 January 2014 - 02:07 PM, said:

well he does have a point that when two light mechs can take on an assault easily there is a problem.

Why is that a problem? Two lights vs. one assault should favor the lights, but depending on the loadout and pilot of the assault it could easily go very badly for the lights. I don't know why there is this perception that light mechs should be instantly killed by assaults if they dare to attack them. In a game where everyone gets one mech per round and combat is the primary focus lights need to be a threat to assaults.

[Varent]

Lostdragon, on 02 January 2014 - 03:17 PM, said:

Why is that a problem? Two lights vs. one assault should favor the lights, but depending on the loadout and pilot of the assault it could easily go very badly for the lights. I don't know why there is this perception that light mechs should be instantly killed by assaults if they dare to attack them. In a game where everyone gets one mech per round and combat is the primary focus lights need to be a threat to assaults.

I was using that as an example because of what was posted above.

TO be honest a decently played light mech can take down an assault as well.

Lostdragon, on 02 January 2014 - 03:17 PM, said:

Why is that a problem? Two lights vs. one assault should favor the lights, but depending on the loadout and pilot of the assault it could easily go very badly for the lights. I don't know why there is this perception that light mechs should be instantly killed by assaults if they dare to attack them. In a game where everyone gets one mech per round and combat is the primary focus lights need to be a threat to assaults.

*reason* Depends how much of a true to lore feel that you want and an actual return investment on what you payed for the mech.

[Mister Blastman]

SirLANsalot, on 02 January 2014 - 02:51 PM, said:

That statement I made about the PPC/Gauss was an example of what to do when you come across some so called "meta". Think of WHY people are using that, and then think of ways to BEAT that way of thinking. You will become a better player for it.

LoL

Get a load of this guy. He's telling me to be a better player. Hilarious.

Sorry, I forgot. How do I get out of 3rd person view again?

[SirLANsalot]

Mister Blastman, on 02 January 2014 - 05:08 PM, said:

LoL

Get a load of this guy. He's telling me to be a better player. Hilarious.

Sorry, I forgot. How do I get out of 3rd person view again?

watch the videos, and learn.