22 replies to this topic

[luigi256]

From my understanding when a part gets blown off with ammo in it such as an arm or a leg the ammo blows up and deals damage to the mech part it is in. (and adjacent parts too?)

What if the ammo is in the arm and the side torso gets destroyed? Does the ammo explode and then deal damage to the center torso but it is halved? (Or halved twice since it would deal damage to the arm then the side torso then the center torso?) Or will it deal no damage at all?

Or am I all wrong about ammo explosion?

[Nick Makiaveli]

luigi256, on 02 January 2014 - 08:40 PM, said:

From my understanding when a part gets blown off with ammo in it such as an arm or a leg the ammo blows up and deals damage to the mech part it is in. (and adjacent parts too?)

What if the ammo is in the arm and the side torso gets destroyed? Does the ammo explode and then deal damage to the center torso but it is halved? (Or halved twice since it would deal damage to the arm then the side torso then the center torso?) Or will it deal no damage at all?

Or am I all wrong about ammo explosion?

Unless I am mistaken, ammo has to be hit to have a chance to explode. So if your arm has all it's internal structure destroyed, the arm will be lost but the ammo stored there won't explode.

If it does explode, it will transfer, but I don't believe it's halved, just whatever is left over moves to the next section.

I'm sure an expert will be along shortly with more details, but wanted to give you at least a brief answer.

[Konril]

An ammo explosion has a 10% chance of happening when an ammo location is destroyed by a critical hit, but 0% chance of happening when everything in the location is destroyed by reaching 0 structure. Ammo explosions are applied directly to the internal structure, but otherwise follow the same rules as normal damage.

Ammo exploding in a side torso will do its damage first to the structure of the side torso, and transfer half the remaining damage to the internal structure of the center torso. The arm will simply fall off once the side torso is destroyed without absorbing any of that damage.

If the ammo was instead in the arm or leg, first the damage would be applied to the limb, then half the remaining damage applied to the internal structure of the side torso, and finally half of that remaining damage applied to the center torso.

Keep in mind two things. First, armor will not absorb any damage from an ammo explosion. Second, the actual damage is determined by the remaining ammo left in the location. AMS or Narc ammo will explode for a mere 24 points, and the Gauss Rifle (the cannon itself and not the ammo) will explode for 20. But from there damage starts to get into the ridiculous range. Machine gun ammo will explode for 80 points per ton, any autocannon ammo will explode for 140 or 150 per ton, and streak SRM ammo appears to do a whopping 250 per ton. As a reference, an Atlas, being the largest mech available, has 34 structure in the arm, 42 in each side torso and leg, and 62 in the center torso. While it is possible to survive a small ammo explosion, it is not uncommon for a large explosion to simply core even the largest mech, unless stopped by a CASE (and standard engine).

While a lot of the stock designs love storing the ammo in the torsos, it is in fact the worst place to put that ammo. It's much better off in the legs and arms as long as you armor them properly.

[Rascula]

CASE exists for a good reason.. If your running an ammo hungry mech its well worth investing in some.

[Arnold J Rimmer]

Also worth mentioning that if ammo in your arms take an explodey-crit (technical term), but that same hit also destroys the arm, the explosion will not transfer to your torso. The arm's gone and is just super-obliterated on its own I guess.

[sneeking]

iv lost lrm amo from side torso while running xl engine and survived it somehow....

the build had all ammo in torso so go figure....

[Arnold J Rimmer]

You can take hits to ammo bins that don't detonate them - there's only a 10% chance of explosion in case of hit. Also, empty ammo bins can still be destroyed and 'explode' for zero damage. The explosion is always the number of rounds left in the bin multiplied by individual shell/missile damage.

[sneeking]

which is why I would like some transparency in ammo allocation and weapon placement for battlefield longevity. ...

which ammo gets consumed first matters a lot in a battle plan...

[Arnold J Rimmer]

Head>CT>LT>RT>LA>RA>LL>RL

Top-to-bottom and left-to-right.

Edited by Arnold J Rimmer, 03 January 2014 - 04:57 AM.

[sneeking]

realy ?

[Arnold J Rimmer]

Really.

EDIT: Oops, ha. Left-right, not right-left. Edited previous post.

Edited by Arnold J Rimmer, 03 January 2014 - 04:58 AM.

[sneeking]

shouldn't it go in order to allocation during the build like the weapon groupings do when you put them in ?

[sneeking]

id like to place a weapon then add the ammo to be paired with it I an order of sequence.

[Arnold J Rimmer]

For the love of God, stop double posting.

I'm not sure that it 'should'. I see the reasoning behind using ammo from your head and centre torso first, as that's where all the critical stuff is. Don't want an explosion there. Then the torsos are the next most important, as they transfer damage to the CT. Then arms, because damage transfer and other weapons. Legs last, because something has to come last.

I agree that maybe down the line it might be worth adding the option for players to set their ammo use order. In my Centurions, for instance, I'd want the legs to empty first rather than last.

[cleghorn6]

That would be neat, but complicated to implement.

EDIT: I was replying to sneeking. AJ just ninja'd me.

Edited by cleghorn6, 03 January 2014 - 05:11 AM.

[sneeking]

wait till your on the other end of the field rimmer, you're gonna say for the love of god stop double firing

[Arnold J Rimmer]

In your Yen Lo? I'll take your arm off and leave you

[sneeking]

people say I talk to much but realy they all just think too slow....

[luigi256]

Thank you very much for the information everyone. Now that i'm educated in the ways of ammo I can rest easy knowing my arm ammo will only destroy my arm if it gets critted and won't magically transfer damage to my center torso if my side torso gets blown off.

[Arnold J Rimmer]

luigi256, on 03 January 2014 - 11:44 AM, said:

Thank you very much for the information everyone. Now that i'm educated in the ways of ammo I can rest easy knowing my arm ammo will only destroy my arm if it gets critted and won't magically transfer damage to my center torso if my side torso gets blown off.

Not quite. If the first shot to penetrate your arm armour critically hits your ammo, it might still explode and transfer damage to your side torsos. It's only if the arm was going to come off anyway that the damage wouldn't transfer.