41 replies to this topic

[CB Pilot]

Sorry I mean CAT C4 advice.

Hello my friend had a A1 with the 5 x LRM 5's build and it seemed limited in use so the C4 looks like a better all around build.

I mainly pilot light mechs so speed and Jump Jet's are a must and I would like to try LRM 5's or Sreak 2's.

So what do you think about this build CPLT-C4 ?

I chose the C4 because I like the idea of having a TAG and a back up weapon in the center torso.

I can swap out Streaks easy but I am not sure about a XL engine with this mech's current hit boxes. That and will 2 X LRM5's or 2 x Streak2's add those ugly additional missle tube boxes?

Any advice?

Thanks.

Edited by InsectMech, 16 January 2014 - 06:24 PM.

[KokaneKrazie]

i think there are better mechs for lrm 5s.

XL engine is not a big problem in a catapult but your build got way to many heatsinks and very little fire power. with cat you should go for the big lrms in my opinion.

[Orbit Rain]

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...b37c728934b9ba8

[CB Pilot]

Orbit your build has a XL engine with Ammo in the side torso? I thought this was a big no no due to ammo explosion, even with CASE?

As a update, I spent the last of my CB on the CAT C4 and to my dismay it seems there are some issues.

First even though ghost heat does not affect LRM 5's, only having 4 of them does pathetic damage both chained or not to large mechs. It does not even seem to be effective vs lights due to the speed that hey can get to cover in vs the stream of missiles slow flight time, let alone AMS.

Second is honestly WTH is with the ugly add on missile tubes, this whole graphic and I suppose hit box re work is horrid. The stock boxes can take 1 x LRM20, or 20 full missile tubes without adding extra ugly tube boxes to an already HUGE target. But if I only have 2 x LRM 5's for a total of half the stock enclosed tubes, it will add a ugly external LRM outside the box as a exposed larger target, WTH?

I will now stick to LRM20's just due to the above issues, so if you have any good build advice for a pair or LRM20's please let me know.

I think I made a mistake buying this mech but I will try some builds to see if I can justify its use.

Thank you.

[Buckminster]

The add-on tubes for the Cats are terrible. All we can do is hope they revisit and fix them.

What you may want to do is put on a pair of LRM15s and a pair of LRM5s. It gives a lot of flexibility with your firing - dump them all to rain missiles, chain fire to shake people up, or just pop a single LRM5 to make someone scoot.

Maybe try this:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...57d892a7e7d64ad

[Kjudoon]

All LRM5's on a CPLT? Not my favorite combination. They work far FAR better on KTOs and SDH where speed and size is your far greater advantage. Essentially, when missiles are the major damaging componant on a CPLT, using LRMs means 30 tubes minimum in most cases to make it more functional. Good luck if you do find something that works though.

Buckminster, on 17 January 2014 - 12:16 PM, said:

The add-on tubes for the Cats are terrible. All we can do is hope they revisit and fix them.

What you may want to do is put on a pair of LRM15s and a pair of LRM5s. It gives a lot of flexibility with your firing - dump them all to rain missiles, chain fire to shake people up, or just pop a single LRM5 to make someone scoot.

Maybe try this:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...57d892a7e7d64ad

Nice build but too little ammo to function in a sustained fight. 2-4 more tons of LRMs and that is a fantastic little killer.

[Buckminster]

Yeah, I skimped a little too much trying to fit the 300XL in. Maybe drop it to a 275 to make some room for ammo.

[luigi256]

Here is a build using 2 lrm 20's. Pretty similar to one of the above builds but with more ammo and a bap added and a smaller engine. On the plus side if you ever decide to use a spider 5D that is the max engine size for one so you could use it there too.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...b728f81402b956b

Edited by luigi256, 17 January 2014 - 12:30 PM.

[CB Pilot]

I came up with this build for a pair or LRM 20's CPLT-C4, I just can not stand the ugly add on launcher. I wonder if since they are added outside the armored box as well as being a bigger target that is the reason they get destroyed so fast?

Is BAP really a must have if you use TAG and don't fire at indirect targets past 700m or so? Seems like I could use more ammo due to the LRM 20's ?

I liked the idea of a tighter spread, no ghost heat and less ammo usage of the LRM5's but I don't think it works in this mech.

Thank you for the build links.

[Buckminster]

ALRM15+5s weigh as much as ALRM20s. The goofy weapon mount thing is annoying, but you might want to give it a try. I've really found that mixed launcher sizes is a lot more effective.

BAP isn't about being able to target someone, it's to prevent someone, it's more about countering ECM if an enemy scout mech gets close. If you're shooting at the front line, and an enemy ECM gets near you, then you lose the ability to shoot the front line. It's apparently more of an issue in more competitive play - since I PUG all the time I've rarely seen it.

[Modo44]

If anything with ECM hugs you, you will not be able to get a lock with just TAG. BAP is actually the more important equipment.

[ShadowbaneX]

CPLT-C4. Enough missiles (barely) to still be considered an LRM boat, but enough defence to deal with lights that harass you.

[Barkem Squirrel]

Look at the XL 275 or 280 for engine size, but have at least one jumpjet.

Another decision is, Do I want AMS.

BAP is a must and TAG solves those pesky Atlas D-DC problems.

Now Artemis is a good thing to have, but due you plan on always being visible to your target or just behind the hill. This will make a difference on how many missiles will hit.

Mixing the size of launchers is also a good Idea. Either go LRM 15 + LRM20 or 2xLRM 15 + 2x LRM 5. Why, you will have more time when your missiles are impacting the target. Also look at the cooldown rates for some more information. this will also make a difference on the number of kills you receive.

remember that you are a missile boat and staying with friendly mechs will allow you to survive longer so a very small engine or no jumpjets may get you killed. Then there are the times that you have only one laser left after going Winchester on Missiles. Don't worry if you did your job right they have at least one spot that is cored that you can fire that one laser and get a kill.

Try to have at least 8 tons of missiles, but seven is acceptable. Even at 8 Tons I can run out in some matches.


Finally, have fun

[Kjudoon]

Modo44, on 17 January 2014 - 01:01 PM, said:

If anything with ECM hugs you, you will not be able to get a lock with just TAG. BAP is actually the more important equipment.

Yes, but since that only happens on about 10% of my games, it's still not as useful as 198 extra points of potential damage in a ton of extra ammo and half ton of armor.

[Kjudoon]

Buckminster, on 17 January 2014 - 01:01 PM, said:

ALRM15+5s weigh as much as ALRM20s. The goofy weapon mount thing is annoying, but you might want to give it a try. I've really found that mixed launcher sizes is a lot more effective.

BAP isn't about being able to target someone, it's to prevent someone, it's more about countering ECM if an enemy scout mech gets close. If you're shooting at the front line, and an enemy ECM gets near you, then you lose the ability to shoot the front line. It's apparently more of an issue in more competitive play - since I PUG all the time I've rarely seen it.

Usually in 12 mans, if you get low signal as a missile boat, you're dead anyway, so BAP is useless. Trust me. I've experienced it way too many times. You're not getting away if you move under 100kph, and even then, it's doubtful. If you pilot well, they only get back to you if the rest of the team is dead, or you got wolfpacked by a group of ECM lights or CDAs and you have no way of stopping the kill. They're just that good. Get an extra ton of ammo, or tag, or another ML and half ton of armor at least. It probably won't save you if this eventuality happens, but you can try.

[CB Pilot]

So let me clarify something if I have say a ECM Atlas targeted say 500m away and lit up with TAG and I do not have BAP. Then lets say a ECM spider comes within 150m or so (what ever the ECM bubble range is). I can no longer target the Atlas even though it is painted with TAG or is outside the Spiders ECM bubble?

So you loose ALL target lock ability when a ECM mech is within its bubble range of you?

And what happens to the missiles already in the air from when you had a lock, do they just loose the lock and hit the ground?

Seems odd, like the ECM should only "Protect" mechs within its bubble and not "Disrupt all enemy locks as well as protect".

Can someone please clarify this for me?

Thank you again.

[Kjudoon]

InsectMech, on 17 January 2014 - 03:30 PM, said:

So let me clarify something if I have say a ECM Atlas targeted say 500m away and lit up with TAG and I do not have BAP. Then lets say a ECM spider comes within 150m or so (what ever the ECM bubble range is). I can no longer target the Atlas even though it is painted with TAG or is outside the Spiders ECM bubble?

So you loose ALL target lock ability when a ECM mech is within its bubble range of you?

And what happens to the missiles already in the air from when you had a lock, do they just loose the lock and hit the ground?

Seems odd, like the ECM should only "Protect" mechs within its bubble and not "Disrupt all enemy locks as well as protect".

Can someone please clarify this for me?

Thank you again.

And now you know why ECM is so OP. It even shorts out a targetting laser at point blank range, or if two are present, ALL targeting, with or without BAP. ECM should not be able to affect TAG targetting at any range.

End of story. Also, if it's going to be the size of a medium laser, Tag should also have a range of LOS but that's me being captain obvious.

Edited by Kjudoon, 17 January 2014 - 03:41 PM.

[CB Pilot]

Wow, just F'ing wow. I will add BAP and will play with it a bit more but seems like a waste now.

Now I know why no one seems to use LRM boats, ECM beats rock, paper and scissors : (

Would be nice if PGI could write this down one afternoon so people do not feel like they wasted hard earned CB.

Edited by InsectMech, 17 January 2014 - 03:57 PM.

[Kjudoon]

InsectMech, on 17 January 2014 - 03:57 PM, said:

Wow, just F'ing wow. I will add BAP and will play with it a bit more but seems like a waste now.

Now I know why no one seems to use LRM boats, ECM beats rock, paper and scissors : (

Would be nice if PGI could write this down one afternoon so people do not feel like they wasted hard earned CB.

Now now, not totally true. ECM makes my day as an LRM pilot much more difficult requiring a whole new skill set that most twitchmunchies can't handle. They can't handle the patience it takes to get that lock, nurture it and then blow it apart. They don't remember that an LRM 40 at 400 meters is more powerful than their AC40, even though it doesn't have pinpoint damage, often, it's far harder to miss, and the damage dealt may not kill them instantly, but will leave them wide open for others OR kill them on the next shot that should be in the air if you have LOS on them that close.

Develop a new skill set and way to view the game as that LRM pilot. It is rewarding and let's face it, the gratitude from your teammates for softening up hard targets by blowing componants off and saving their bacon when all hope is lost for them on their own makes up for it.

[Modo44]

Kjudoon, on 17 January 2014 - 02:39 PM, said:

Yes, but since that only happens on about 10% of my games, it's still not as useful as 198 extra points of potential damage in a ton of extra ammo and half ton of armor.

Correct. If the enemy is bad, BAP is not necessary. Neither is TAG, for that matter.