91 replies to this topic

[PASHA]

As promised in a previous post, I said I would continue to document proof of this broken hit registry that needs to be prioritized by PGI instead of shooting off the nerf guns.

http://youtu.be/SP3Y3cQGFPg

[F lan Ker]

S!

The hit detection is crap. Infuriating to shoot a Mech and see you did hit but no damage. My ping is around 145ms and that is still acceptable. SRM and PPC seem to be quite bad in the hit detection. Lasers work mostly fine. MWO is stale anyway and gaming time in it has dropped to almost zero. UI 2.0 did not add anything and other content is months away. Having more fun in other games now. So completely understand the frustration of the better players when they know they would hit and deal damage but nothing happens.

[PhoenixFire55]

Dymlos2003, on 01 February 2014 - 01:36 PM, said:

Oh my, I sniped a Spider 700 meters away. I thought that Mech was broken.

So how does a fact that you managed to find one spider that actually isn't broken denies the fact others are? Nobody is saying damage never registers. What people are saying that sometimes it does not, and that it happens way too often and is unacceptable for a competitive MMO game.

Edit:grammer

Edited by PhoenixFire55, 11 February 2014 - 03:09 AM.

[PhoenixFire55]

Dymlos2003, on 01 February 2014 - 03:36 PM, said:

Oh I know, it's like mw4. I'm just making a hyperbole like the people saying it's completely broken also whining about hit register when they have 300+ ping. That's just a face palm moment.
It happens but not as bad as people think. It's mostly do to peoples ping and lag.

If I get to my old PC anywhere in the near future I'll post footage of powered down absolutely stationary lights and mediums taking no damage from AC/PPC/SRM fire at 100-150m range. That has nothing to do with ping and/or lag.

[PhoenixFire55]

Noesis, on 02 February 2014 - 08:29 AM, said:

Hardly suprising when you consider that probably 3/4 of the MWO pilots live on the American continent.

And you base this statement on what data?

Noesis, on 02 February 2014 - 08:29 AM, said:

TBH, living in the UK I would still elect to play on the US servers due to this apparent population. More so with the idea of keeping the community together as best possible even if it might mean a few fractional points to my KDR.

Same here just substitute UK for Russia. Thats why they HAVE TO fix HSR and make it packetloss protected or smth. Its not that hard to do, mech accelerations/decelerations/turns/jumps all have limited speeds. You can 'predict' mech movement with a very high accuracy and fill in missing packets if they occur too often thus leading to no damage registry.

[aniviron]

The only people I know who are okay with how the hit detection works in this game are the people who have never played any competitive or high-level shooters before. Everyone else I've played with who has any experience with playing a game to win has filled at least one TS room with vitriol and expletives.

It's exactly as Mr. Steele says in the OP; attempting to shoot another player has costs in the form of heat, time, positioning, and sometimes information (i.e. ambush). When you shoot you are trading all of these resources in exchange for the ability to do damage; and so it is essential that if the player gives up all of those things and correctly hits their shot, the shot needs to work as advertised. If it does not, the player runs the sudden and arbitrary risk of losing an engagement despite doing everything correctly. That's just not a good feeling. Players should never be punished for playing well (note that this is different than inducing negative feedback loops to prevent landslide games).

[Mordin Ashe]

I think there are two broken things in game, ECM and hit detection. I made peace with the first one, but the second drives me to tears sometimes. When I launch my whole alpha into back of enemy CT only to witness 0 damage done, something's wrong.

Could we please get some better hit registration, pretty please?

[Thorn Hallis]

I completly agree, hit detection isn't working as intended (or at least I hope it's not intended). I know that lag has a lot to do with hit registration, but I have seen to many non-registering AC20 hits on standing targets to KNOW that there is more in it then latency issues.

Jade Kitsune, on 02 February 2014 - 06:12 AM, said:

Ever think that, just maybe it SHOULD die? So that PGI looses the license and it get's put in the hands of a dev team that can actually...you know... devlop a game?

I don't see any other developer/publisher on the horizon that is interested in Mechwarrior.

Motroid, on 02 February 2014 - 07:38 AM, said:

ESO and SC will mop the floor with this game if IGP/PGI doesn't get their sh-- together...

I lol'ed. ESO is like modern day Warhammer Online, big hype, nothing else behind.

[Noesis]

PhoenixFire55, on 11 February 2014 - 02:57 AM, said:

And you base this statement on what data?

Guesstimation based on perceived numbers. Hence use of the term probably. Don't have to take it as literal however, just that by perception there appears to be more people in the US TZ than elsewhere.

Which is hardly surprising when you remember that BT is an American game so it has more cultural roots there.

Substitute 3/4 with significant majority if you prefer which is the premise of my point anyhow.

[SgtKinCaiD]

And the sad thing is that hitreg was working way better before PGI updated the HSR for SRM ...

[PhoenixFire55]

Noesis, on 11 February 2014 - 03:29 AM, said:

Guesstimation based on perceived numbers. Hence use of the term probably. Don't have to take it as literal however, just that by perception there appears to be more people in the US TZ than elsewhere.

Which is hardly surprising when you remember that BT is an American game so it has more cultural roots there.

Substitute 3/4 with significant majority if you prefer which is the premise of my point anyhow.

I'd also consider this ... most of people in my unit are from North America. If I want to drop with them I am more or less forced to play during their time, thus adding to 'guesstimated' US TZ population. Personally I don't think that even 50% of playerbase are actually north american residents.

[Roland]

SgtKinCaiD, on 11 February 2014 - 04:01 AM, said:

And the sad thing is that hitreg was working way better before PGI updated the HSR for SRM ...

I don't know why people think this. It isn't even remotely true.

Earlier in the game's development, hit registration for SRM's was even WORSE than it is now.

The only change is that since SRM's don't do the totally ridiculous bugged damage that they used to do, they don't make up for misses with massive damage.

[SgtKinCaiD]

Roland, on 11 February 2014 - 06:16 AM, said:

I don't know why people think this. It isn't even remotely true.

Earlier in the game's development, hit registration for SRM's was even WORSE than it is now.

The only change is that since SRM's don't do the totally ridiculous bugged damage that they used to do, they don't make up for misses with massive damage.

Let me put the timeline back : when PGI introduced the HSR , they did it in 3 steps : the first two steps were laser/balistic weapons and the hitreg was gradually getting better (even for srm which was kind of silly). Then they put the step 3 for missile weapons and all hell broke loose : they had to make several hotfixes and eventually revert it back. And if i'm still correct, PGI didn't touch it since except for minor bugs.

[PhoenixFire55]

Roland, on 11 February 2014 - 06:16 AM, said:

Earlier in the game's development, hit registration for SRM's was even WORSE than it is now.

SRMs aside, prior to HSR it was consistent, now it isn't.

[Targaryen X]

Right there with you OP.
I haven't played in weeks. Before that I was sporadic at best the past months.
Sad part is I used to LOVE this game, couldnt wait to get home and get my log on, but familiarity breeds contempt, and now I view this game with something between frustration and disgust, for all the reasons described by the OP.

Truth is if I did not have 120 days of premium time sitting in the bank I would uninstall this mcguffin and never think about it again. I play games to have fun, not to slam my headphones on the desk and force myself up from the keyboard before I put my fist through my monitor. Which is all this game evokes from me at the moment.

I have never been so disappointed in the progress of a game in the history of EVER. I used to be optimistic, I used to be patient, I used to get annoyed at the constant complaints and gloom/doom comments from my own clanners. Well I've gone over to the dark side. And there is only the game and its devs to blame.

You HAD a loyal customer in me. Now all you have is someone with money in the game who refuses to use it until there is an ACTUAL GAME here, a game that not only works, but with ACTUAL CONTENT, not just grinding mech/pilot trees for no particular reason. And devs, accurate hitreg is most basic fundamental NECESSARY thing to hold it all together. Without accurate hitreg the Mechwarrior Online concept is nothing but a dream, wishful thinking, a mirage, a rainbow, a perfect woman... and any other thing that one can fantasize about but never reach.

G

[Gallowglas]

I have to say, I agree with Ryan. Yes, I'm upset with the delay to so many features and the last announced delay of CW and the handling of the Clan packs was a big deal to me. However, the hit registration issues are the single biggest issue with the game. When you can unload 3xLL and an AC/20 into the CT of a nearly stationary assault mech that's maybe 100m from you and the paper doll flashes and cursor turns red, but no (or very little) damage is applied, that's a pretty serious problem.

My ping is definitely not the problem either since it's usually 75 or less.

Edited by Gallowglas, 11 February 2014 - 09:14 AM.

[Shlkt]

I'd love to discover the common factor for all you guys with hit detection problems. I see complaints from both low-pingers and high-pingers (though admittedly a lot more complaints on the high side). Yet in my own experience hit detection has been reliable lately, with the possible exception of SRMs which I never use anyway.

My ping hovers around 40-60, and I have no trouble consistently hitting not just mechs but specific components as well. Short range, long range - everything seems to apply damage properly when my crosshair turns red. If there's an occasional hit detection failure then I don't seem to notice it. I score plenty of damage and kills.

Maybe your problems are related to inconsistent latency? Do you get low framerates? Just fishing here for ideas here.

I hear an awful lot of complaints about hit detection in any case. Some of them strain credulity.

Quote

3xLL and an AC/20 into the CT of a nearly stationary assault mech that's maybe 100m from you and the paper doll flashes and cursor turns red, but no (or very little) damage is applied, that's a pretty serious problem.

You realize that's less than 50% of the damage required to destroy the CT armor (not even counting internals) on common assault mech builds, right? I would expect the paper doll to turn slightly orange. You're definitely not going to see red after a strike like that to a healthy CT. Perhaps what you perceive as "hit detection problems" are just different mixes of front/rear armor. Some (crazy) guys with with 30+ armor on the back of their Atlas while others mount 95% of it on the front alone.

[Ryan Steel]

Gallowglas, on 11 February 2014 - 09:12 AM, said:

When you can unload 3xLL and an AC/20 into the CT of a nearly stationary assault mech that's maybe 100m from you and the paper doll flashes and cursor turns red, but no (or very little) damage is applied, that's a pretty serious problem.

Yeah I can very much relate. I'm going to get an ulcer soon, I can feel it. Shooting at a powered down Cicada with two 40 point alphas at that same 100 meter distance for the armor to turn light orange on Terra Therma is hilarious. Not only are you rewarded zilch, but you are penalized with 90% heat. That little Cicada is about to power up and circle strafe you, eating away at your armor when he should be dead. To add insult to inury, now his friendlies are shooting at you too, and you're at 90% heat. We're all gluttons for punishment. All of us.

[PhoenixFire55]

Shlkt, on 11 February 2014 - 11:45 AM, said:

Maybe your problems are related to inconsistent latency? Do you get low framerates? Just fishing here for ideas here.

40-50 FPS stable, 120-130 ping with 1% jitter tops.
5-10% shots on assaults and heavies that are slow/stationary never make it.
Lights, I'm happy if 30% of my shots that actually hit them (red crosshair + visual impact) do the full damage.
Stationary (most cases overheated) lights same story.

Have to mention reverse effect as well, sometimes I know I missed only to see damage done. Rare but it happens.

Not talking about lasers (spreaded damage) or SRMs (no damage).
Only taking PPCs / ACs / Gauss into account as they do pinpoint.

[Dymlos2003]

PhoenixFire55, on 11 February 2014 - 11:55 AM, said:

40-50 FPS stable, 120-130 ping with 1% jitter tops.
5-10% shots on assaults and heavies that are slow/stationary never make it.
Lights, I'm happy if 30% of my shots that actually hit them (red crosshair + visual impact) do the full damage.
Stationary (most cases overheated) lights same story.

Have to mention reverse effect as well, sometimes I know I missed only to see damage done. Rare but it happens.

Not talking about lasers (spreaded damage) or SRMs (no damage).
Only taking PPCs / ACs / Gauss into account as they do pinpoint.

Wonder how true this is, For me less than 5% of my shots don't register. Must be horrible if that does happen