1026 replies to this topic

[stkxie]

CapperDeluxe, on 07 February 2014 - 06:30 AM, said:

Yep! I have some old gameplay videos on my MWLL playlist in my channel: http://www.youtube.c...72C5951EB1D17E1

Here's one that I think portrays the jump jets well as a potential model for MWO. You'll see at about 1:20m mark where I "jump snipe" a Warhammer with my Heavy Gauss. But even though I boosted really quickly in the air I'm also much higher in the air and much more of a target than if I had slow floaty jets that would let me line up for the shot more as they do in MWO.

Jump Sniping vs Grounded play




Goofy Jester VS the world:




Stalker vs the world:




Notice how much more shooting you have to do in a stalker in order to crank up descent numbers, and then in higher elo brackets that build just doesn't work due to no locks.


Moral of the story, fix the damn convergence and make lasers competitive with PPC&AC's.

[dwwolf]

Most problems stem from shoe horning a random allocation damage system (tabletop) into a pinpoint application FPS. Fix that b4 you touch anything else.

[Mechteric]

dwwolf, on 07 February 2014 - 07:51 AM, said:

Most problems stem from shoe horning a random allocation damage system (tabletop) into a pinpoint application FPS. Fix that b4 you touch anything else.

I don't get why people keep bringing this up. All other Mechwarriors to this day have been exactly the same in this respect. Not saying that if it were feasible and fun it shouldn't be tried, but there's other means to balance than just the same old pinpoint argument.

[Mycrus]

Paul Inouye, on 05 February 2014 - 05:09 PM, said:

Sitting across from the studio from me is a board with all the 'Mechs on it. In my crosshairs... the Highlander. More info to follow along with intended implementation date. Just giving you all a heads up.

[wanderer]

Quote

I don't get why people keep bringing this up. All other Mechwarriors to this day have been exactly the same in this respect. Not saying that if it were feasible and fun it shouldn't be tried, but there's other means to balance than just the same old pinpoint argument.

That's correct. The same problem has existed in most MechWarrior content to date. This just happens to be the one where you could do better, much like MWLL has. A lot of the problems in MW4 got papered over not because they were fixed, but because you had people setting up private servers with a broad palette of things they could turn off if they didn't think it was fair.

MWO will not function if they did that, much Multiplayer BT wouldn't have. You can't have an all-online game designed around CW working if the rules change from fight to fight,where one group says "NO PPC's" and another "NO JJ, POPTARTING SUCKS!". The game has to work in it's entire content for all players the same way.

[Zyllos]

CapperDeluxe, on 07 February 2014 - 07:54 AM, said:

I don't get why people keep bringing this up. All other Mechwarriors to this day have been exactly the same in this respect. Not saying that if it were feasible and fun it shouldn't be tried, but there's other means to balance than just the same old pinpoint argument.

And every MW game that has followed suit has had the same issues.

Correlation?

[Amsro]

Dracol, on 06 February 2014 - 11:17 PM, said:

But, the long and short of it is, Highlander pilots utilize arm lock to ensure their arm and torso weapons are going to hit the same spot. With the inclusion of a key bind for it, they can quickly gain the benefits of perfect convergence for all weapons, then revert back to the quick reaction of an independent arm reticle.

I've never used "Arm Lock" in ANY capacity. Maybe I'm gimping myself by not using it. Meh.

[TygerLily]

Jman5, on 05 February 2014 - 05:43 PM, said:

I would say there are four major/meta jump snipers right now:

Highlanders (733C mostly, 733, 732)
Victors (dragon slayer)
Cataphract (3D)
Shadowhawks (2D2)

I would keep all these mechs in mind when you think about nerfing. If you weaken just one, then people will pile into the remaining three. Basically mechs with jump jets, and an asymetrical energy/ballistic hardpoint on one side (dual ppc + Autocannon(s)). The higher the guns the more powerful they are.

Shadow Hawks don't bother me as meta snipers. I hate the current meta but I don't want it not to be a valid playstyle...The Shadow Hawks lighter armor lets it benefit from the huge benefits poptarting grants.

Highlanders, Victors, and Cataphracts can just massively lean on the imbalances to create supermechs...I think requiring max or max-1 jumpjets to achieve current height would be a nice balance.

Also, let's pop the PPC crit space up to 7...to match the AC10...

[Amsro]

Mazzyplz, on 07 February 2014 - 12:46 AM, said:

whatever gave you the idea i was crying about the splatcat? you must be not understanding the current state of the game.
the splat cat is gone, and it is gone for the reasons i told you it should go, it happened.

i am just explaining it to you, doin u a favor. now you're a little more educated on the subject. run along




to the contrary, this exemplifies the short sightedness of many people, you completely fail to realize the game was a lot less diverse before ghost heat, half the builds were stalkers, where now you see almost every mech there is being run, if rock is OP in rock paper scissors, when it becomes ROCK/ROCK/ROCK regardless, paper and scissors need to have the same chance or you see an abundance of ROCK

The splat cat is not dead or gone, its just not the mainstream ZOMG easy button anymore, so people have moved on to Highlanders and Victors 2PPC + 2 AC/5, all day easy peasy. Guess what Ghost Heat does to those builds.

ZERO, ziltch, nadda. Now that you are "educated", run along.

Ghost Heat killed MORE builds that weren't OP and basically made it ONLY good to use 2 PPC + AC Best of Rest.

The 2.0 SRM buff coupled with 10/15 ER/PPC heat nerf is what killed the 4-6 PPC stalker. Ghost Heat just happened to come out at the SAME TIME.

Edited by Amsro, 07 February 2014 - 10:59 AM.

[TygerLily]

Ryan Steel, on 05 February 2014 - 05:35 PM, said:

lol. You terribads have been saying stuff like that since the beginning of closed beta. "I can't wait till they nerf ________ and for all the meta (wrong use of the word "meta") abusers to start crying!!11111" We're going to dominate you no matter what gets nerfed in this game. We've used brawlers, lasers, direct fire, and every single mech and weapon system in it. The irony is that the nerf puts a huge stick in the spokes of the terribads that use FOTM mechs as a crutch and not to their full potential.

To put my ac20 round where your cockpit is, I'll even throw this in. I, as are all the members of the House of Lords, am openly endorsing the abolition of poptarting from this game, as well as direct fire if the community sees fit. We are guaranteeing that you will either not see us in game because you're absolutely terrible at this game and have low Elo, or you will get steamrolled as hard as you always have.

LORD STEEL
ggclose

[FactorlanP]

The Splat Cat was the beneficiary of the bug that caused SRMs to do splash damage that caused total damage to be many many multiples of the total damage they should have been capable of doing.

I've seen a few Splat Cats lately... They aren't really scary... But I couldn't say how much damage they are losing right now due to the SRM hit registration issues.

Edited by FactorlanP, 07 February 2014 - 10:59 AM.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

FactorlanP, on 07 February 2014 - 10:59 AM, said:

The Splat Cat was the beneficiary of the bug that caused SRMs to do splash damage that caused total damage to be many many multiples of the total damage they should have been capable of doing.

I've seen a few Splat Cats lately... They aren't really scary... But I couldn't say how much damage they are losing right now due to the SRM hit registration issues.

Even in their heyday, Splat Cats had 2 very big disadvantages. One was it was easy as hell to shoot their ears off. And the other was they could do 0 damage outside of 270m.

One of the issues with the current meta, is even if you brawl with them, they can still hurt you. And oh by the way you are going to take damage getting to them.

I'd MUCH rather have Splat Cats back. Bugged and all.

Infact If it were up to me, SRM's would go back to exactly how they were, crazy damage and all.

[FactorlanP]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 07 February 2014 - 11:04 AM, said:

Even in their heyday, Splat Cats had 2 very big disadvantages. One was it was easy as hell to shoot their ears off. And the other was they could do 0 damage outside of 270m.

One of the issues with the current meta, is even if you brawl with them, they can still hurt you. And oh by the way you are going to take damage getting to them.

I'd MUCH rather have Splat Cats back. Bugged and all.

Infact If it were up to me, SRM's would go back to exactly how they were, crazy damage and all.

It was really easy to Cockpit them too...

[TygerLily]

kaffeangst, on 05 February 2014 - 06:09 PM, said:

I am the best Highlander pilot in the game, and I say - go ahead, nerf away. The people who rely on that specific chassis to be even slightly above-average will fall, not the naturally skilled. Brawling is more fun, anyhow.

Fix SRM's before adjusting... I agree with this notion.

LORD KAFFEANGST
ggclose™

deforce, on 05 February 2014 - 06:32 PM, said:

no matter what is nerfed, there will always be a "dominant" build that will bring out all the QQ and cheese cries.

top competitive players will always trend towards a dominant build + thier higher skill level= NERF NERF NERF

gauss cat, streak cat(ok this was dumb), splat cat, a/c 20 cat, ppc stalker, 3-D, highlanders.


if you plan to keep nerfing what the top players take, it will be a never ending nerf bat, because they will always be able to wreck 99% of the community in just about any build/mech.

So, why don't you "ultrapilots" dominate in Medium mechs all day, everyday NOW? All I see is the same ol'... I agree, let's get this brawl game going...I can respect that but a 90-ton mech shooting from 1000 meters away? It's a weak showing of your "skill".

Oh, your philosophy is "competitive"?? That argument is skin deep. If you meant it, you wouldn't be here. Being "competitive" in this fringe game is like being a competitive Yugioh player...If you want to be "competitive" why aren't you playing CoD or Starcraft, etc. and making thousands of dollars? Ya'll certainly try to reduce MWO to play it like a low TTK game...

You think the "terribads" cry...look at the "high ELO" players coming out of the f*kcing woodwork in this thread...

I'm all for the poptart tactic - I don't want it gone - but it's unbalanced.

You're the best there is? Let me see you out there in you're Awesome, or Wolverine, or Raven 2X...but I bet I can guess your loadout...

[Nicholas Carlyle]

FactorlanP, on 07 February 2014 - 11:06 AM, said:

It was really easy to Cockpit them too...

Yeah, and now we have a bunch of bigger maps too.

I dunno, I mean maybe rose tinted glasses and all that. But I liked SRM's in their overpowered state. And I don't really care that they killed Commando's better or whatever it was that caused PGI to change them.

And a big F U to the guys who pushed that. Thanks a bunch.

[deforce]

TygerLily, on 07 February 2014 - 11:23 AM, said:

So, why don't you "ultrapilots" dominate in Medium mechs all day, everyday NOW? All I see is the same ol'... I agree, let's get this brawl game going...I can respect that but a 90-ton mech shooting from 1000 meters away? It's a weak showing of your "skill".

Oh, your philosophy is "competitive"?? That argument is skin deep. If you meant it, you wouldn't be here. Being "competitive" in this fringe game is like being a competitive Yugioh player...If you want to be "competitive" why aren't you playing CoD or Starcraft, etc. and making thousands of dollars? Ya'll certainly try to reduce MWO to play it like a low TTK game...

You think the "terribads" cry...look at the "high ELO" players coming out of the f*kcing woodwork in this thread...

I'm all for the poptart tactic - I don't want it gone - but it's unbalanced.

You're the best there is? Let me see you out there in you're Awesome, or Wolverine, or Raven 2X...but I bet I can guess your loadout...

why dont i dominate in medium mechs???

HUNCHBACK HBK-4P 128 100 26 3.85 157 30 5.23 39,854 95,317 12:10:46
CICADA CDA-3M 155 116 38 3.05 142 57 2.49 58,345 120,065 14:40:44
BLACKJACK BJ-3 57 44 13 3.38 70 17 4.12 21,758 51,611 05:20:39
CENTURION CN9-A 200 153 47 3.26 194 78 2.49 73,850 135,642 15:52:01
YEN-LO-WANG 69 51 18 2.83 68 25 2.72 23,258 54,797 06:42:20



and why dont we brawl?!?! lol.... you clearly have never dropped against us. both kaffe and i have dropped in brawler mechs and wrecked.

http://www.twitch.tv...e#/kaos_deforce

go watch a stream on how brawling is done.


edit: here are my awesomes, since you think they are so terribad.

AWESOME AWS-8Q 33 23 10 2.30 38 14 2.71 11,568 20,939 02:36:09
AWESOME AWS-8R 258 190 68 2.79 422 85 4.96 125,766 203,924 23:04:57

Edited by deforce, 07 February 2014 - 11:51 AM.

[FactorlanP]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 07 February 2014 - 11:36 AM, said:

Yeah, and now we have a bunch of bigger maps too.

I dunno, I mean maybe rose tinted glasses and all that. But I liked SRM's in their overpowered state. And I don't really care that they killed Commando's better or whatever it was that caused PGI to change them.

And a big F U to the guys who pushed that. Thanks a bunch.

I'm not sure I want to go back to the splash damage problem... I am boggled by PGI's apparent disregard for actually fixing SRMs though.... SRMs are a core weapon system on sooo many many Mechs.

[Deathlike]

Morbid Jester, on 07 February 2014 - 03:30 AM, said:

Hey, cut him some slack. it's hard to hit anything across the room with those nerf guns in the first place. Including walls....

The only nerf guns in this game are LBX and SRMs... and more of the latter than the former.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

FactorlanP, on 07 February 2014 - 11:39 AM, said:

I'm not sure I want to go back to the splash damage problem... I am boggled by PGI's apparent disregard for actually fixing SRMs though.... SRMs are a core weapon system on sooo many many Mechs.

The splash damage only effected mech's when they had tiny hitboxes that were close together.

At this point, with the fact that Role Warfare never seems to be coming, I'm good with Light's getting obliterated.

[FactorlanP]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 07 February 2014 - 12:05 PM, said:

The splash damage only effected mech's when they had tiny hitboxes that were close together.

At this point, with the fact that Role Warfare never seems to be coming, I'm good with Light's getting obliterated.

Hehe, I'm not a light pilot... So, I might be able to live with that too...


Honestly, I expect that the eventual end result of balance attempts will be tying Ghost Heat to alpha output... Ghost heat for any attack within a 0.5second time frame that exceeds 20 damage points.

I'm not saying that this is what I want, or even a good idea... Just what I halfway expect to happen...