1026 replies to this topic

[FactorlanP]

IceSerpent, on 12 February 2014 - 12:49 PM, said:

How so? Those builds would have to wait for their weapons to converge instead of just taking snap shots. I am not saying that this would completely fix the problem - weapon balance itself is definitely in dire need of rework, but I think it would make the game more interesting.

Wait for their weapons to converge? There is no wait now... They are unlikely to bring the old convergence back, because it didn't work...

What you talkin' 'bout Willis?

[Nuclear Weapon]

Mark Brandhauber, on 12 February 2014 - 12:30 PM, said:

Wherever there is a subject on nerfing the current meta you will find dv8 or lords (i wonder how many will quit if they find this nerf not to their liking), shouldn't you guys be stomping around with the current meta whilst you can? it may take you as long as 2 days to create a new meta once this has come into play. Enjoy your victors and highlanders (as i'm sure you do).
Paul is going to nerf them; how has yet to be revealed (the tonnage limit on pre-mades would have done it). I welcome a fresh meta the current one is growing stale I found it too easy 2 months ago running ac5 and ppcs in my highlanders, Bring it on something new another challenge to overcome.

This is my final point. Videogames change and evolve constantly, don't like it or unwilling to learn new playstyles and tactics; your choice is simple quit, like so many "leet" players before you.

Sir, if we find a new meta everytime its because we can addapt and learn and this statement just exposes how contradictory your argument is... as long as skilled players are arround I'd say that your choice is simple; rage quit.

[IceSerpent]

FactorlanP, on 12 February 2014 - 12:50 PM, said:

Wait for their weapons to converge? There is no wait now... They are unlikely to bring the old convergence back, because it didn't work...

What you talkin' 'bout Willis?

Talking about what would happen if we get non-instantaneous weapon convergence on a selected target. What did you think I was talking about?

[Mark Brandhauber]

I have said nothing to the contrary, I don't understand why you guys are so up in arms about this. I don't expect it will take you very long to find the new meta.
Normally takes me less than a week, like I said you guys should have it in two days. You guys realize I'm baiting you right....

Edited by Mark Brandhauber, 12 February 2014 - 01:05 PM.

[FactorlanP]

How about giving the cross hair a lock-on type of function, similar to missiles... You have to hit r to select your target... Then wait for your target reticule to indicate that you are locked and converged. If you do that, your weapons will give you that pin point hit like now.

If you fire before locking/converging or without selecting a target, you experience a cone of fire effect.

Of course, there would have to be an ability to target and lock/converge on a mech covered by ECM...

[Khobai]

Quote

Ultimately, I expect that they will do exactly that.

They need to just remove ghost heat. It doesnt really work. All the meta builds are designed specifically to avoid ghost heat penalties.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with boating weapons. Its completely normal in Battletech and tons of stock mechs boat weapons.

What needs to be fixed is the 30+ pinpoint alphas. Weapons need to be given mechanics which spread damage around rather than delivering it all at once to the same location.

[FactorlanP]

IceSerpent, on 12 February 2014 - 12:52 PM, said:

Talking about what would happen if we get non-instantaneous weapon convergence on a selected target. What did you think I was talking about?

What happens if you pull the trigger before the convergence criteria are met? Where does the projectile/laser go? If firing multiple weapons, where will they hit?

[Villz]

FactorlanP, on 12 February 2014 - 12:54 PM, said:

How about giving the cross hair a lock-on type of function, similar to missiles... You have to hit r to select your target... Then wait for your target reticule to indicate that you are locked and converged. If you do that, your weapons will give you that pin point hit like now.

If you fire before locking/converging or without selecting a target, you experience a cone of fire effect.

Of course, there would have to be an ability to target and lock/converge on a mech covered by ECM...

Slowing down game play and reducing the skill cap in a game that already suffers from too low a skill cap and too slow of game play.

YOU'RE HIRED !!!!!!!

Nerf Mouse

Khobai, on 12 February 2014 - 12:55 PM, said:

They need to just remove ghost heat. It doesnt really work. All the meta builds are designed specifically to avoid ghost heat penalties.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with boating weapons. Its completely normal in Battletech and tons of stock mechs boat weapons.

What needs to be fixed is the 30+ pinpoint alphas. Weapons need to be given mechanics which spread damage around rather than delivering it all at once to the same location.

You don't see how this would only lead to ppl grouping the largest weapon possibles in the tightest possible grouping
?

Unless you are refering to some kind of RNG mechanic in which case i would advise you to just stop playing video games because you're just embaressing yourself ( I love you enough to tell you instead of allowing you to carry on making a fool of yourself).

Edited by Villz, 12 February 2014 - 01:00 PM.

[Corvus Antaka]

Villz, on 12 February 2014 - 12:45 PM, said:

Literally does nothing but make me play Heavy metals and victors.

Im a big fan of limiting diversity. JK its a r$#tar$&d idea

No doubt. players like you enjoy the easy mode pinpoint the full arm lock gives. I fully expect you to cry about this idea, because if your armlock is taken away your "mad skillz" take a big nurf

[Mcgral18]

Villz, on 12 February 2014 - 12:59 PM, said:

You don't see how this would only lead to ppl grouping the largest weapon possibles in the tightest possible grouping
?

Is that much different to what's currently happening?

[FactorlanP]

FactorlanP, on 12 February 2014 - 12:55 PM, said:

What happens if you pull the trigger before the convergence criteria are met? Where does the projectile/laser go? If firing multiple weapons, where will they hit?

^^^ Answer this question in regards to the "Must target mech" concept that somebody you know suggested and you think is possibly a good idea?

[Khobai]

Quote

You don't see how this would only lead to ppl grouping the largest weapon possibles in the tightest possible grouping

why would it? if its physically impossible to do 30+ damage alphas, then what possible benefit would there be to grouping large weapons together? the goal is to introduce a game mechanic which stops pinpoint and cannot be circumvented...

[Villz]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 12 February 2014 - 01:00 PM, said:

No doubt. players like you enjoy the easy mode pinpoint the full arm lock gives. I fully expect you to cry about this idea, because if your armlock is taken away your "mad skillz" take a big nurf

Sub 100 IQ's god bless em

Khobai, on 12 February 2014 - 01:04 PM, said:

why would it? if its physically impossible to do 30+ damage alphas, then what possible benefit would there be to grouping large weapons together? the goal is to introduce a game mechanic which stops pinpoint and cannot be circumvented...

How is ever hitting what u aimed @ a bad thing?

I bet your a real gun @ CS

Of the 117 ways you could accomplish what you are trying to do you literally picked the stupidest off the list.

Mind u its 8am and i haven't slept yet so i'm a bit tired but i'll just give u these 1's for free off the top of m head.

*Increase Internals

*Lower weapon damages

*Make more difference in projectile speeds (De synching them more)

Edited by Villz, 12 February 2014 - 01:10 PM.

[Corvus Antaka]

Villz, on 12 February 2014 - 01:06 PM, said:

Sub 100 IQ's god bless em

From the frothing at the mouth you are doing I can tell it's a good idea.

[Nuclear Weapon]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 12 February 2014 - 01:00 PM, said:

No doubt. players like you enjoy the easy mode pinpoint the full arm lock gives. I fully expect you to cry about this idea, because if your armlock is taken away your "mad skillz" take a big nurf

You are right.

We all should go out in Atlas with small lasers because weapons are OP... :'(

Edited by Nuclear Weapon, 12 February 2014 - 01:08 PM.

[SniperCon]

Villz, on 12 February 2014 - 12:43 PM, said:

I also really enjoy how jagermechs are atleast 60% of all the heavies i see in games. Yet no1 says s|-|!t about jagers with their high mount ballistic boat opness. I see 3x the diversity in mechs in the assault class vs the heavy class atm.

Discuss my infalible logic

When piloting my Centurion, Hunchback, Dragon, Battlemaster, etc I feel I have a fair chance of out fighting a Jagermech. I do not feel the same when there is a fresh Highlander or Victor around the corner.

[Villz]

FactorlanP, on 12 February 2014 - 01:02 PM, said:

^^^ Answer this question in regards to the "Must target mech" concept that somebody you know suggested and you think is possibly a good idea?

No Target = no convergence ? IE STRAIGHT AHEAD

HERP?

Did u really have to ask that ?

Wondering if you actually understand what convergence is at this point ....

Edited by Villz, 12 February 2014 - 01:18 PM.

[IceSerpent]

FactorlanP, on 12 February 2014 - 12:55 PM, said:

What happens if you pull the trigger before the convergence criteria are met? Where does the projectile/laser go? If firing multiple weapons, where will they hit?

When you select the target (or switch selection to a different target) the convergence distance of your weapons begins to change from the current value to where the newly selected target is. If you pull the trigger before weapons fully converge, they will fire at whatever the current convergence point is at that moment. Multiple weapons would all hit the same convergence point unless different weapons have different convergence speeds (which is also an interesting idea). Basically, it would work like this:

My weapons are converged at a point 1000m away, I switch to a target 100m away - the convergence point starts moving towards the target distance: 900...800...700...etc. If I pull the trigger when that point is still at 700, I'll bracket my target - either hit both arms or completely miss (have rounds pass to the left and to the right of the target).

[Khobai]

Quote

How is ever hitting what u aimed @ a bad thing?

Its not a bad thing

Whats bad is the fact were using armor ratios from a game which has random hit locations and doesnt let you aim at specific locations. That's created a fundamental imbalance in MWO, which has precise aiming, and as a result weapons do more damage than armor can effectively handle. Also equipment like XL engines are much weaker than they should be because side torsos can be directly targeted.

What that means is either pinpoint needs to be reduced and damage needs to spread out more (more like battletech) -OR- armor values need to be redistributed to account for players being able to aim exactly where they want to hit (less like battletech and more like other fps shooters). But its pretty clear something needs to be done to significantly reduce the effectiveness of pinpoint alphas.

Edited by Khobai, 12 February 2014 - 01:17 PM.

[Villz]

SniperCon, on 12 February 2014 - 01:08 PM, said:

When piloting my Centurion, Hunchback, Dragon, Battlemaster, etc I feel I have a fair chance of out fighting a Jagermech. I do not feel the same when there is a fresh Highlander or Victor around the corner.

That's probably related to the fact 1 is 20tons + heavier than the other.

U know what makes me crap it even more.

When i turn a corner and there is a boars head brawler.....

Nice logic though.

Khobai, on 12 February 2014 - 01:12 PM, said:

Its not a bad thing.

Whats bad is the fact were using armor values from a game which doesnt let you hit what you aimed at. That creates a fundamental imbalance between damage and armor values.

What that means is either pinpoint needs to be reduced and damage needs to spread out more (more like battletech) -OR- armor values need to be redistributed to account for players being able to aim where they want to hit.

Not argueing the other aspects. It was on the single point of nerfing mouse.

Which is regardless of the strength of your reasoning behind it or the general direction you are suggesting ,still always the wrong thing to do.

Personally i feel the ratio of ability to do damage vs ability to take damage is FK#$^D up aswell.

Edited by Villz, 12 February 2014 - 01:16 PM.