74 replies to this topic

[Khobai]

Quote

Having some FLD weapons allows for different play styles to emerge and be prevalent, completely taking them away does nothing but eliminate options and drive away players

If FLD is allowed it needs to have downsides to make it balanced. Gauss is an example of FLD being balanced by having downsides. AC/20s, AC/5s, and PPCs are examples of FLD being completely overpowered.

[Amsro]

remove minimum distance retain heat, scale the heat drop from ERPPC with a damage drop from ERPPC

ERPPC 15 heat 10 damage no minimum range 33% more heat for more range and damage
PPC 10 heat 7.75 damage no minimum range 33% less heat for less range and damage

In this way they scale correctly to each other.

Edited by Amsro, 06 March 2014 - 04:06 PM.

[Varent]

Khobai, on 06 March 2014 - 03:51 PM, said:

If FLD is allowed it needs to have downsides to make it balanced. Gauss is an example of FLD being balanced by having downsides. AC/20s, AC/5s, and PPCs are examples of FLD being completely overpowered.

the gause is not used... whatsoever and is basically considered a dead weapon. the gause is a horrible example of FLD being destroyed....

[Tw1stedMonkey]

Varent, on 06 March 2014 - 04:52 PM, said:

the gause is not used... whatsoever and is basically considered a dead weapon. the gause is a horrible example of FLD being destroyed....

It was arguably overnerfed but I still see it used more often than some weapons (like srms). I think it could use a shorter charge time and longer hold time maybe shorten the cooldown. What it is, is no longer one of the flat out best weapons out there (no heat, high pinpoint, max of 15 damage from "ammo explosion," looong range.). and burst fire is still mostly FLD but that can spread at further than brawling ranges. Basically it's to stop it ACs from being sniper rifles (that's supposed to be the gauss rifle and maybe er PPCS) and back to being short/mid/long range assault weapon (depending on caliber).

[Varent]

Tw1stedMonkey, on 06 March 2014 - 05:33 PM, said:

It was arguably overnerfed but I still see it used more often than some weapons (like srms). I think it could use a shorter charge time and longer hold time maybe shorten the cooldown. What it is, is no longer one of the flat out best weapons out there (no heat, high pinpoint, max of 15 damage from "ammo explosion," looong range.). and burst fire is still mostly FLD but that can spread at further than brawling ranges. Basically it's to stop it ACs from being sniper rifles (that's supposed to be the gauss rifle and maybe er PPCS) and back to being short/mid/long range assault weapon (depending on caliber).

thats an entirely different thread there on the gause...go argue on that section. I try to ignore them since there is two distinct sides that argue like cats and dogs on the threads and nothing gets resolved.

[Khobai]

Quote

the gause is not used... whatsoever and is basically considered a dead weapon. the gause is a horrible example of FLD being destroyed....

Of course Gauss isnt used. Would you rather use a balanced weapon or an overpowered weapon? Gauss isnt used because its the only balanced FLD weapon. All the other FLD weapons are blatantly overpowered.

[Kaeb Odellas]

Varent, on 06 March 2014 - 04:52 PM, said:

the gause is not used... whatsoever and is basically considered a dead weapon. the gause is a horrible example of FLD being destroyed....

I still see Gauss rifles. They're almost always used in pairs, though. It's extremely rare to see them used in mixed builds.

I actually use a Gauss on my BJ-1. I just couldn't get it working with an AC20. It's too brittle and slow to use up close.

[Varent]

Kaeb Odellas, on 06 March 2014 - 07:23 PM, said:

I still see Gauss rifles. They're almost always used in pairs, though. It's extremely rare to see them used in mixed builds.

I actually use a Gauss on my BJ-1. I just couldn't get it working with an AC20. It's too brittle and slow to use up close.

that's... quite unique...regarding the black jack and I kinda wanna try that now. That said they are very rare overall. I still see them but its like 1-10.... 1-20.... wich basically might as well them not being used.

Khobai, on 06 March 2014 - 05:56 PM, said:

Of course Gauss isnt used. Would you rather use a balanced weapon or an overpowered weapon? Gauss isnt used because its the only balanced FLD weapon. All the other FLD weapons are blatantly overpowered.

Im so tired of arguing with you khobai, none of your arguments make sense. Thus I will respond simply "Pie". Have a good day

[Khobai]

Quote

Im so tired of arguing with you khobai, none of your arguments make sense. Thus I will respond simply "Pie". Have a good day

It doesnt make sense that people use AC/5s instead of gauss because gauss has a downside and AC/5 dont? That makes perfect sense to me.

[Varent]

Khobai, on 06 March 2014 - 08:08 PM, said:

It doesnt make sense that people use AC/5s instead of gauss because gauss has a downside and AC/5 dont? That makes perfect sense to me.

If you don't realize they went to far with the gause, then there is nothing I can do for you.

[General Taskeen]

Can we count how many [direct fire] weapons in this game have a 0 damage Min Range?

1,

now that really don't make sense at all. My 3PPC AWS cries for many reasons in my Mech Bay, and that's one of them.

[Amsro]

Varent, on 06 March 2014 - 07:59 PM, said:

that's... quite unique...regarding the black jack and I kinda wanna try that now. That said they are very rare overall. I still see them but its like 1-10.... 1-20.... wich basically might as well them not being used.



Im so tired of arguing with you khobai, none of your arguments make sense. Thus I will respond simply "Pie". Have a good day

I also use Gauss, and find it quite useful, the speed it has makes in nearly the best weapon in the game.

I use AC/20 + Gauss on my 3D. Many single Gauss mechs (7+) with one Dual Gauss mech (Ilya).

The same people have been complaining about Gauss since the change. This means you likely have another weapon that works well for you. But Gauss is far from dead.

General Taskeen, on 06 March 2014 - 08:41 PM, said:

Can we count how many [direct fire] weapons in this game have a 0 damage Min Range?

1,

now that really don't make sense at all. My 3PPC AWS cries for many reasons in my Mech Bay, and that's one of them.

Yeah the minimum range on PPC is no longer needed. Maybe lower the overall maximum range to compensate.

[Roland]

Villz posted up a video of himself a little while back just running around and killing everything with Gauss, in response to folks who said it was no longer a viable weapon.

It's much harder to pair with other weapons now, but when used by itself its CRAZY easy to hit targets with it since they sped up its travel time.

It's not really my weapon of choice, but it's certainly functional.

[Varent]

Roland, on 06 March 2014 - 08:45 PM, said:

Villz posted up a video of himself a little while back just running around and killing everything with Gauss, in response to folks who said it was no longer a viable weapon.

It's much harder to pair with other weapons now, but when used by itself its CRAZY easy to hit targets with it since they sped up its travel time.

It's not really my weapon of choice, but it's certainly functional.

It was a gause prior to the nerf. Note he also was rolling erppc prior to the heat increase.

[Bobzilla]

The whole balancing issue with PPC's is the pinpoint damage which is the same with the gauss as well. The fact that they are light, energy hps, with good range and don't take many crits makes them boatable by many mechs and therefor popular. So spreading the damage of them would help with them.

It just makes sense that if all weapons are balanced, the advantage goes to the weapon you can pinpoint into one section (10 dps into one section is equal to 30 dps spread over 3 sections, the mech will go down at the same speed).

I don't see how it would hurt light/mediums if it spread, as i'd rather have 15 damage to my arm and 15 to my torso, rather than 30 damage to my torso, dur.

Also (not sure if for or against) the more weapons that cause splash damage, the more brawling and LRM use there is. Like the old days (pre ECM), LRM rain, untill both sides are close enough for it to break down into a big brawl.