20 replies to this topic

[Mighty Virtus]

I was told a while back when I was heavy into the CPLT-C4 and did nothing but throw LRM's around in every game that these two modules were the answer to my question then about how why would I be able to lock on a target and launch LRM's at it only to see that as soon as they left the tube I would loose lock. I since have gathered that the lock (which was non-line of sight) that my sensors picked up would disappear once the missiles took over the tracking due to the fact once the missiles launched, the team mate that was targeting that particular enemy I was aiming for would disband lock and/or the target moved behind an obstacle.
They said these modules would help with that. But as I recall, even though once I aquired them I never used them much, I dont think I seen much of a difference in using them.

I am looking to possibly re-purchase one or both modules to put on my C1...but I wanted to ask the community if these modules are worth the large price tag? And do I need both or would just one or the other? I have the same issue now as I did then...I am behind a ridge...sensors pick up a target in range...I fire and immediately the lock and contact totally disappears. I know keeping target at LOS would alleviate most of that, but as we all know, LRM Cats are very vulnerable, so Id like to stay out from LOS as much or as long as possible. Any input would be appreciated.

[sC4r]

target decay module helps a little bit for keeping lock but dont expect much from it rarely helps

target info gathering is worthless for LRM boat... you dont need info since you cant aim your missiles to exact location (would be different if you could focus missiles for specific section), this module is perfect for scouts and brawlers, for snipers it has little use and lrms are better without it

for lrm boat best modules are target decay, sensor range(for direct fire), and then consumables (air/arty)
you may also consider seismic sensor but it has minimal use for you

[Modo44]

Target Info Gathering has nothing to do with target locks -- it just lets you see what a target has quicker. Target Decay is the one you want for LRMs to shine. Apart from that, add BAP, TAG, and Artemis, preferably all together.

[Clydewinder]

I may be wrong, but I suspect Target Delay only helps with targets that you yourself can see. If you are firing indirectly, once your spotter loses lock, so will you. If your spotter has a Target Delay module that will help them, and in turn yourself keep lock a bit longer.

[Josef Koba]

I'm a huge proponent of Target Info Gathering (TIG), but as stated above, it's not very beneficial for LRM boats. I have the least success with LRMs, but as Modo44 says, you'll definitely want BAP, TAG, and Artemis if at all possible. Target Decay does make the job a bit easier too as it alleviates some of the frustration you're experiencing.

Now, if you're a brawler and are fairly accurate, TIG is the way to go. You'll be ripping off arms and torsos left and right (pun).

Clydewinder, on 11 February 2014 - 01:24 PM, said:

I may be wrong, but I suspect Target Delay only helps with targets that you yourself can see. If you are firing indirectly, once your spotter loses lock, so will you. If your spotter has a Target Delay module that will help them, and in turn yourself keep lock a bit longer.

I was under this impression as well, but perhaps someone has a better answer. I yearn for more information within the game so it's less of a mystery how certain things function. I've been playing for I think a year and a half or something and I still consider myself a novice about the inner workings. I can pilot, but I can't tell you if Adv Target Decay works best for your own lock or otherwise.

[DEMAX51]

Target decay will allow you to keep lock even after losing line of sight (AND if your spotter loses LoS!) for an extra few seconds.

Target Info Gathering only gives you details about your target (like loadout, and it's paperdoll to see where it's damaged) 25% faster - BAP does this too, and if you use them both it stacks.

For LRM boats you're going to want: Target Decay, Advanced Sensor Range, BAP (if you can fit it) and TAG - Artemis is also a pretty big bonus if you can use it (if you do use Artemis, BAP is less useful).

Edited by DEMAX51, 11 February 2014 - 01:34 PM.

[DONTOR]

Target decay is basically a must for serious LRM users, personally I hate LRMs. Decay will help you keep a lock when the enemy gets behind cover for an additional 3.5 seconds and it really does help alot. I use it for streaks, chasing lights that get behind cover for a second or 2, I dont have to relock them, because of target decay i can just fire when i see them again.

[Mighty Virtus]

So basically I should go with tgt decay, bap and tag...although with my particular role/strat I typically use while running a lrm boat, I would try to be well out of range to use Tag. I'd use it as a last resort.

[Victor Morson]

I wrote an LRM guide here that might help answer some of this.

However, to answer your question:

Target Info Gathering: No, it's not worth it. It does not speed lock, just the rate you get scan / damage data from the target. It's a luxury item, something to maybe throw in there if you don't want to waste money on a consumable. Otherwise skip it.

Adv. Target Decay: A must have for LRM 'mechs. It is NOT long enough of a lock holding to begin firing on an indirect target and have them hit the target before you lose lock; what it is very good for is allowing missiles you've already put into the air to land on the target even if they've jumped behind a rock. Thus it's a really, really good module to have as that will happen.. a lot.

----

Bonus on how missile locks work:

When you or an ally targets a 'mech, it becomes weapons lockable. If the person holding LOS with the target loses it, the target lock is lost until LOS is regained.


Advanced bit of missile info with limited application (but might help answer some of your questions):

Now, missiles will fire at whatever is locked when they leave the launcher. Missiles that are fired while unlocked will never re-acquire a target - they are dumbfire. Now this can happen during a single missile salvo, too.

Say you have 5 missile ports and an LRM/20. It will fire 5 missiles 4 times to complete firing the whole weapon. (Check Smurfy's for a list of ports.) This is generally undesirable as it hurts your ability to crack AMS, but that isn't the point. The point here is this: If you are firing that LRM/20 and have lock for the first 10 missiles, but lose lock for the last 10, then regain lock - the first 10 will bolt straight for the target and the last 10 will not. It counts them on a per-launch, not per-weapon, basis. Likewise if you fire before you get lock, but aquire it mid-fire, the reverse will happen and the first 10 missiles will dumbfire but the last 10 (after you got lock) will track normally.

One notable thing about this mechanic is that if you fire on a target you have lock on, lose lock, but then reaquire lock while your missiles are still in flight, they will no longer "arc" like before but rather dive in IMMEDIATELY at the target, in a straight line. This is actually devastating to light 'mechs but almost impossible to consistently pull off on purpose. I'm sure you've seen it happen, though.

Mighty Virtus, on 11 February 2014 - 02:56 PM, said:

So basically I should go with tgt decay, bap and tag...although with my particular role/strat I typically use while running a lrm boat, I would try to be well out of range to use Tag. I'd use it as a last resort.

A good call bringing them all, but do not underestimate how much single-location damage you can do with TAG+Artemis. The damage / track rate increase is insane.

DEMAX51, on 11 February 2014 - 01:34 PM, said:

For LRM boats you're going to want: Target Decay, Advanced Sensor Range, BAP (if you can fit it) and TAG - Artemis is also a pretty big bonus if you can use it (if you do use Artemis, BAP is less useful).

I find Adv. Sensor Range entirely unnecessary. With BAP you will be able to lock out to 1000, and you don't want to fire on people at that range generally anyway (waiting until they're close enough to not so easily evade the missiles.)

The space is better used for a UAV Module (which also has the flip side of being an XP farming tool!) or a Strike.

Edited by Victor Morson, 11 February 2014 - 05:13 PM.

[DEMAX51]

Victor Morson, on 11 February 2014 - 05:14 PM, said:

I find Adv. Sensor Range entirely unnecessary. With BAP you will be able to lock out to 1000, and you don't want to fire on people at that range generally anyway (waiting until they're close enough to not so easily evade the missiles.)

The space is better used for a UAV Module (which also has the flip side of being an XP farming tool!) or a Strike.

I usually forgo the BAP on LRM builds, as it's not nearly as necessary for LRM boats as it is for, say, a Streak boat. As such, I like to use Sensor Range to boost my sensors up to 1000m so it covers the entire range of my missiles (even though I rarely shoot at a target who's beyond 850m or so).

Also, UAVs aren't particularly great for LRM boats to carry themselves, because you have to get near enough to the enemies to drop it and use it (which kind of invalidates having a long-range weapons system). It's much better if you've got a spotter in a Light 'Mech that you can work with, who can drop the UAV for you.

[Modo44]

DEMAX51, on 12 February 2014 - 08:37 AM, said:

I usually forgo the BAP on LRM builds, as it's not nearly as necessary for LRM boats as it is for, say, a Streak boat.

Right until the moment an ECM light hugs you.

[Victor Morson]

DEMAX51, on 12 February 2014 - 08:37 AM, said:

I usually forgo the BAP on LRM builds, as it's not nearly as necessary for LRM boats as it is for, say, a Streak boat. As such, I like to use Sensor Range to boost my sensors up to 1000m so it covers the entire range of my missiles (even though I rarely shoot at a target who's beyond 850m or so).

That's a really bad idea. Not only will a single ECM 'mech that whizzes past you knock out missile lock straight out (and waste every missile in the air) without BAP and that's really terrible. Plus it's other advantages like the range boost we're talking about..

DEMAX51, on 12 February 2014 - 08:37 AM, said:

Also, UAVs aren't particularly great for LRM boats to carry themselves, because you have to get near enough to the enemies to drop it and use it (which kind of invalidates having a long-range weapons system). It's much better if you've got a spotter in a Light 'Mech that you can work with, who can drop the UAV for you.

Generally I run LRMs on a Skirmisher, so it's easy to get in position, but any LRM boat can benefit from having them; if their position is getting pushed on, dropping one right before falling back will give you all kinds of indirect shots, and also, counter ECM bubbles.

You are right that it's optional, but it would still be a better use of the module space. Really in a serious drop I run Adv. Target Decay, Airstrike and Artillery Strike on my missile 'mechs, and in casual I run Adv. Target Decay, Airstrike and UAV since I'm willing to take a little more risk, and usually don't have a full recon lance to UAV for me.

[1453 R]

WARNING: INCOMING WORDS

Based on my own experiences with a few different LRM ‘Mechs, and assuming a solo-dropper sort of player:

Absolutely Necessary Gear for a Successful LRM Platform

-LRM launchers: Preferably in tube counts of 30 or more, and with no more than two of any launcher above 10 so as to avoid getting Ghost Cooked. Personally, I’ve found 2xLRM-15 or 1xLRM-15, 1xLRM-10 to both be successful, with a few of the other factors in this post thrown in. No, you cannot be a successful LRM machine without LRMs. Yes, I’ve seen a few people try.

-Artemis FCS: Yes, this is essential. No, you cannot be consistently successful using indirect fire. If your launchers aren’t using Artemis, your missiles are spread out too wide to deal really powerful, concentrated damage, and you’re also probably firing from 800+ meters behind a cliff. Either of these factors alone kills your efficiency and/or consistency.

-TAG: The extra tracking strength of ensuring your own TAG designation is completely worth learning how to Lurm directly. You also pick up a lot of TAG/NARC assist bonuses, both from TAGging your own launches and from TAGging your idiot indirect teammates’ fire. Plus, it forces you to try and get within 750 meters for your launches, and that cuts off much of the temptation to hurl a load of ammunition at 950 meters just to watch the enemy backpedal out of it before they have a chance to get there.

Seriously. Max-range fire. Stop doing it.

Note: TAG is best mounted in a BattleMech’s arms when possible, as the extra arc and agility of the arm mount often allows you to keep your TAG-assisted lock on an enemy ‘Mech even while moving away from them, at the edge of your targeting arc. The TAG is also extremely useful for lighting up enemy D-DCs at a distance and letting you not only pummel it with LRMs, but also unveil the hoard of smaller nasties its ECM was hiding from your enemy’s sensors. Do NOT forego the TAG on your LRM machine. It is in no way optional.

Really Nice to Have, but Not Necessarily Essential

-Beagle Active Probe/Fuzzy Puppy Detector: Fuzzy Puppy Detectors make great additions to LRM ‘Mechs. Even beyond its anti-ECM capabilities, the extra sensor range and target data gathering speed helps you find your targets quicker and isolate the weakened victims on the enemy team more easily, allowing you to better direct your LRM fire. And, of course, it prevents enemy ECM lights from griefing your locks unless they do so en masse, and will often also get you C-ECM bonuses to boot. I would class Fuzzy Puppy Detectors as the highest priority item in the Nice to Have list – you can Lurm without them, and I have, but your performance, and most importantly your consistency, will definitely suffer for it.

-Anti-Missile System: LRMs invite LRMs. Your time is actually poorly spent in missile duels when playing LRMs – you’re much better off pounding enemy brawlers in order to weaken them for your own short-range guys while letting your snipers suppress enemy LRMs – but that doesn’t mean you won’t inevitably find yourself in LRM duels. AMS can give you the edge, while also providing a handy shield against the (S)SRM fire a lot of the smaller strikers who love to hunt for LRM platforms will bring to bear against you. It can be hard to find weight for an AMS system on a machine already as crammed for tonnage as an LRM ‘Mech, and I would generally go with a Fuzzy Puppy Detector over an AMS system if I could only take one, but finding room for AMS on your ‘Mech always rewards you.

-Target Decay Module: Honestly the least essential item I’ve used on my LRM ‘Mechs, but still a very useful bonus. As it comes at no cost to weight and critical slots, requiring only a module slot (and six million frickin’ C-bills, of course), it can be slotted into most any LRM platform freely. This item helps negate an enemy’s movements into cover and their attempts to break your line of sight, giving you those last few moments you need for the missiles you’ve already fired to find their mark. It’ll help your ammunition efficiency a decent bit, and if you can afford it there’s really no reason not to use it, but it’s also pretty easily the last piece of gear you need to worry about for an LRM machine.

Stuff You Can Try if You’ve Already Gotten Everything Above Fitted Out

-Backup/Point-Defense Armaments: I’ll be honest with you. I’ve got one-count-it-one LRM ‘Mech that still manages to make effective use of direct-fire sub-armaments. I do tend to keep a couple-odd medium lasers on my LRM ‘Mechs, but they’re more for easy assist points, the rare weakened-component-destruction and to make me feel better than because they’ve proven effective in a scrap. After you’ve spent all the weight and critical slots that LRMs require on your ‘Mech, you just do not have the space left for enough backup armament to matter on virtually any design I’ve tried. The only exception I’ve got is my Thunderbolt, and even that is a matter of combining an ERPPC with its 25 LRM tubes in order to vary my threat at long range, rather than believing that a handful of medium lasers is going to let me win the day in close combat against anything other than the most critically weakened of enemy threats.

Good Choices for LRM-centric ‘Mechs:

-TBT: A lot of folks give the Treb a lot of grief, and everyone will claim the Griffin and Shadow Hawk are better choices, but I’ve had great success with the Trebuchet in its intended role of missile skirmisher. It’s quite fast, comes with the requisite jump-capable missile variant, and is also the only medium ‘Mech I can bring to mind at the moment that carries both two 15-tube LRM launchers and jump jets, as opposed to the heavier 20-10 configuration Griffins require or the awkward 10-10-5 set-up the Shadow Hawk uses (and unlike the Kintaro, which can do dual LRM-15 but can't jump). When Artemis is involved, the LRM-15 becomes the most weight-efficient LRM launcher on a tons-per-tube basis, and making effective use of the LRM-15 is the thing the Trebuchet does best.

-GRF: The Griffin is the reason I wish like hell I’d just caved and bought the Saber package when it was available and to Gehenna with me being mad at Piranha. The Griffin is very nearly flat-out the best LRM ‘Mech in its weight class, with the Trebuchet retaining its niche only through the slightly more effective/weight-efficient dual LRM-15 over the LRM-20/LRM-10. The Griffin has phenomenal jump capacity and the missile hardpoints it needs to do just about anything it wants. It is somewhat limited by all those hardpoints being in the same torso, but this issue only means that Griffin pilots end up with sensible missile armaments rather than trying to cram sixty LRM tubes into one machine.

-KTO: The Kintaro is usually employed as a Streak platform, since it carries the largest possible number of missile hardpoints on a medium 'Mech. However, it does have the tube count to make itself into a formidable LRM platform as well, and unlike the Griffin it can carry those launchers spread across its frame. The only medium 'Mech able to use the excellent and highly flexible ALRM-15/-5/-5/-5 tube set-up, or even cheese it up Gouda-style with quintuple ALRM-5, the Kintaro is honestly highly underrated as an LRM platform. A skilled missile user in a KTO can be quite a deadly threat.

-CPLT: The Catapult is an effective missile platform if done well, but nobody ever does it well. Players always emphasize tube counts rather than mobility and supporting equipment. When up-engined into proper levels of mobility, equipped with jump jets and all the pepper-flavored LRM support stuff, the CPLT does damn good work, but it needs – NEEDS – to stop hiding behind cliffs and firing at maximum range!

NOT Good Choices for LRM-Centric 'Mechs

-SHD: Hold on a minute th- HOLD ON! Yes, yes yes yes, I know, I KNOW. ALRM-15/10/5, or quad-5 on the 2D2, or this, or that, or the other!

Here's the deal. The Shadow Hawk doesn't have the tube counts to support more than fire-support levels of ALRM tubes in a single salvo – 10/10/5 is the absolute highest it can get, for a total salvo of 25 missiles. This has proven acceptable in my Thunderbolt 5S(P) (note that the Thunderbolt didn't make the 'Good LRM-Centric' list, either), but my Thunderbolt is also adding high-mount ERPPC fire to its LRM shots. The Shadow hawk just doesn't have the weight to do direct fire and LRMs in the same machine without compromising tube count below acceptable limits. The SHD is a fantastic 'Mech that can do almost anything else, but I don't consider it a top-tier choice of LRM 'Mech.

-CN9: Forgot this guy at first. Silly me. The Centurion is a usable missile skirmisher in the same vein as the Shadow Hawk, hitting almost every high point it needs to be a first-class choice. Nevertheless...it's got the problem of being stuck with a torso-mounted TAG, seriously dampening its arms' usefulness in the role of retaining LRM locks whilst running like baby-man. It's also got the same trailing-missile problem as the Shadow Hawk, being forced to either take three ALRM-10 (very heavy) or deal with a full third of its salvo trailing after the main launch with two ALRM-15. The Centurion certainly has the speed and mobility a missile platform needs to be successful these days, but there isn't a thing this sucker does that the Treb or Kintaro can't do too, without split-salvo issues. or the Griffin, when it finally hits the C-bill market.

-ON1: The Orion is a case of 'Close, but no cigar'. It certainly has the tube counts across all its C-bill variants to support sufficient launchers, but it's just not fast enough in normal play. You need a 350XL to even get close, and unlike the CPLT it doesn't have jumpjets to help make up the difference. It's also a large 'Mech that tends to attract attention, and not even the Onion can mount thirty ALRM tubes and carry space left over for sufficient weight of backup armaments. It can come close, and much like the Thunderbolt, a sufficiently determined pilot could probably make it work down in Puglandia, but you're going to play, and feel, like an overfed Trebuchet.

-STK: NO. Just...no. The STK-3F© is EVERYTHING THAT'S WRONG with LRMs, conveniently bundled into a handy noob-trapping package! Far too many tubes, too damn slow, crippling Ghost Heat issues, even more crippling tube count issues...it's a disaster, and I'd personally like to fish-slap Piranha senseless for introducing it. Anyone who thinks this is the pinnacle of LRM combat is just...lord. No wonder you keep blarching about how bad your team sucks.

-BLR: The BLR-1S variant is another case of 'close but no cigar', and for many of the same reasons as the Stalker. Unlike the STK series, the BLR-1S actually has launchers with correct tube counts for LRM work, but it's still too slow and ponderous. Its torso-mounted TAG negates the usefulness of its arm-mounted launchers, and it can't really use its extra tonnage to mount sufficient direct-fire armament to back its tubes up. It can try, but again, when I was giving it a shot I was feeling mostly like an overweight, way-too-slow version of my lighter LRM machines, for not nearly enough return.

...so. There you have it. Three and a half pages of stuff you didn't even remotely care about. Huzzah.

Edited by 1453 R, 13 February 2014 - 05:02 AM.

[Szegedin]

Good Breakdown 1453

1453 R, on 12 February 2014 - 04:23 PM, said:

-CPLT: The Catapult is an effective missile platform if done well, but nobody ever does it well. Players always emphasize tube counts rather than mobility and supporting equipment. When up-engined into proper levels of mobility, equipped with jump jets and all the pepper-flavored LRM support stuff, the CPLT does damn good work, but it needs – NEEDS – to stop hiding behind cliffs and firing at maximum range!

This - I enjoy an occasional PUG LRM'N run in a C4. With an XL 295 and supporting equipment, I'm always surprised how effective and almost graceful the sequences of LRM skirmishing can be, as one hangs with the crowd, keeps on the move and can TAG, lock and fire on targets while in flight - dropping behind cover just as the missiles impact...

Sounds weird but I feel like the JJ use on the Cat has more in kin with the way I use jets on my lights.

And of course, the speed helps you safely find those spaces where a enemy is squirming 300-400m away in the open, with your teammates nearby doing their thing and drawing fire as you TAG, lock and just pummel away with Artemis launchers.

Edited by Szegedin, 12 February 2014 - 09:11 PM.

[Victor Morson]

1453 R, on 12 February 2014 - 04:23 PM, said:

NOT Good Choices for LRM-Centric 'Mechs

-SHD: Hold on a minute th- HOLD ON! Yes, yes yes yes, I know, I KNOW. ALRM-15/10/5, or quad-5 on the 2D2, or this, or that, or the other!

Other than AMS, I agree with most of your points. However, the SHD 2D2 makes a perfectly acceptable missile boat.

It has a 20 rack in the side torso, and a 5 missile rack in the center torso. By firing the 15/10/5 config, you get 20 missiles out of the side torso, 5 out of the center (at the same time), and then 5 very close trailing missiles - not quite a separate flight. It's close enough that they will land 100% of the trailing 5 before the AMS loses focus on the front 25.

That's why the 15/10/5 works so well in particular on the Shadow Hawk. That said, the Griffin is superior at the role (NO trailing missiles) and I highly recommend that instead as a skirmisher when they come out for cbills, but the 2D2 is really the 2nd best.

Also including the Catapult but not including the Centurion as a viable missile platform is criminal. Before the Shadow Hawk, the best LRM skirmisher was a Cent 9D with 2x LRM15 1x TAG.

Edited by Victor Morson, 13 February 2014 - 01:03 AM.

[Reno Blade]

This might be usefull for some of you.

Here are graphs for Missile speeds of 120, 200, 300 and 500 m/s
And a graph for AMS with its current 3.5dps and the # of LRM/SRM/SSRM shot down.
Note: Narc has 2 health all others have 1 health and a single stationary AMS can't shot down a single Narc missile.

Traveltime for missils depending on speed (LRM, SSRM, SRM, Narc):


versus the amount of missiles taken out by AMS depending on distance (or AMS Module) and missile speed:

[Denolven]

Mighty Virtus, on 11 February 2014 - 02:56 PM, said:

I would try to be well out of range to use Tag. I'd use it as a last resort.

Then you are far away from using LRMs to their maximum potential. This kind of long range LRMing is only for things like "oh look my Atlas is too fat to be there in time, let me throw some rocks to be at least slightly usefull while walking there". If you plan to use LRMs as main weapon, staying at 900m is not going to be very usefull.

To make it short: mid range combat solves all your problems. Higher risk, but alot higher reward.

Spoiler

Yes it means you need a bit more supporting equipment and skill, but you will do at least double the damage I assure you. The art of skirmishing allows you to be closer (200-500 meters) while still staying in a support role. Once you learn aggro management, LRMs effectiveness greatly increases, simply because the short lock times willl be enough when the missiles only need to fly 300m instead of 900m.
You still keep the advantage that you don't need direct line of sight. But nobody said you are not allowed to get line of sight. If you have LoS by your own, both TAG and Artemis increase your performance, effectively allowing you to deal more damage. The low range means the opponent has no time to retreat, also increasing your damage.
The only thing you need to learn is how to play the aggro game, to compensate for the higher risk (being closer to your opponents). That's why 1453 R was talking about engines. Proper engines allow skirmishing, skirmishing allows more LRM damage.

You should try to narrow it down until you are good enough to handle the 300m mark without dying horribly. Both Catapult and Trebuchet are very capable in that field (yes the Shadowhawk too). Don't be afraid of dying. The only way to learn it is by dying alot and finding out what you need to do in order to survive at those ranges. That doesn't mean you must always fight at that range. It only means that you should fight at that range when the battlefield situation allows for it, because ideally that's where you will do alot of damage.
Of course you will learn it faster if you get yourself a master who is willing to show you a thing or two Many clans/groups will happily to do so, just take a look to the clan subforum or the guide subforum to get in contact.

Edited by Denolven, 13 February 2014 - 04:43 AM.

[Rushin Roulette]

Mighty Virtus, on 11 February 2014 - 12:45 PM, said:

I am looking to possibly re-purchase one or both modules to put on my C1...

Just to add to what others have said and something which seems to have been missed. You wont have to re-purchase the modules, you can remove them from the old mech (assuming you havent sold it with the modules still equipped) and move them to the new one.... As long as you remember where you left the modules it isnt a problem at least.

[1453 R]

All right, yeah, spaced the Centurion. You try and do something like that off the cuff Even then though, I've never liked the Centurion as much as a missile platform. It's got the torso-mounted TAG problem of the Fattlemaster and Stalker, as well as even more of the salvo diffusion/trailing missiles problem of the Shadow Hawk. I don't see the Cent as being a better choice for Lurmishing platform than a Trebuchet that can get all its thirty missiles out the tubes at once, and jump while it's doing it. And these days, with Kintaros and Griffins available*, there's no reason to make the Centurion sit up and play Lurmisher anymore.

Poor Centurion. Not really much reason for it to do anything anymore. At least it's still good, even if it's just not the king anymore.

EDIT:: added a section for the Centurion, if in the wrong section s'far as you're concerned. Eat me Vic, I can stick to my guns just as well as you can! Also: what's wrong with AMS? Thought I hit the mark pretty spot-on with that one.

Edited by 1453 R, 13 February 2014 - 05:07 AM.

[Denolven]

Huh? The Centurion A can use triple LRM10 without a problem (3x10 tubes). I actually did that and had fun. No JJ and torso TAG are small limitations, so it's not the king. But it's solid enough to work well.
The only reason I sold all my Centurions is because I suck to bad with them - the A was the only one that made me actually somewhat usefull by playing it with missiles. I still think they are one of the coolest mechs out there. But to tell the truth, feeling useless sucks. I couldn't make them work for me despite having played them for a while, so I keep rocking with my Trebuchet instead. Less cool looking, but more kill. Camo fills the look gap.

Edited by Denolven, 13 February 2014 - 05:10 AM.