135 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

It's really dependent on how hot you got and how many sinks you have.

[Melissia]

MaddMaxx, on 17 November 2011 - 06:57 AM, said:

Learning Heat management should not be a chore

... that's an issue for the UI and tutorial, really. They can add plenty of visual and audio effects to warn people of heat.


There can also be an option of a heat limiter, too, which makes people literally unable to fire if it would push their heat over a certain level. An optional thing-- the limiter can be turned off if you want to risk extra firepower. For people who do not want to deal with overheating and shutting down, this would be ideal, while those who want the extra rate of fire and are willing to take hte risk, they can remove it.

Edited by Melissia, 17 November 2011 - 07:30 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

*SNIP*

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an option of a heat limiter

Where's the fun in that Melissia?

[Zyllos]

Well, I am not placing my vote. I think it should honestly be a function of the number of heat sinks and the amount of heat during shutdown.

Heat (Another gameplay proposal...)

This is a good explaination of how heat should work.

[Melissia]

Joseph Mallan, on 17 November 2011 - 07:36 AM, said:

*SNIP*
Where's the fun in that Melissia?

Heh, there's not much for us veterans who can keep track of that kind of thing, but for newbies learning the ropes, you coudl say taht removing the limiter is like removing the training wheels on a bike.

[MaddMaxx]

Melissia, on 17 November 2011 - 08:24 AM, said:

Heh, there's not much for us veterans who can keep track of that kind of thing, but for newbies learning the ropes, you could say that removing the limiter is like removing the training wheels on a bike.

The Mechs governor is the Pilot. The training wheels are designs that are difficult to overheat which also means they cannot blast an enemy with alpha's and kill them. They would be more pick and peck designs. That way the newb(s) could learn piloting and then move up to the more Heat conscious required designs.

[godzofwar]

all nice ideas. now for a book leason. every book writen has this common point in a mech that is about to over heat.
1 the piolt is baking in his cockpit
2 the mech is slugish, wont respond well to comands, wiring on consols & fcs systems cook
3 the reactor core does take damage
4 heat sinks do start to melt & stop doing there job (more heat less removal of heat)
5 amo boxes close to reactor have a 80% chance to explode due to proxcimitey
6 there is an overide to stop shutdown but not used to fire more but to run away
7 if reactor is stoped from shutdown & then spiked again BOOM your dead

so yes there a lot of factors for heat related start up & shunting of heat( heat sinks, coolant flush if it is on that design, damage done to heatsinks, ect.) the program should take all this into effect.

also when under fire 10-15 seconds is an etrnity i know 1st hand.

[Black Sunder]

Heat should be a factor in your tactical thinking. If you want to fire all and shut down, then you should face the consequences for it and sit there for a while so we can all see it. Meanwhile your massive heat signature will flare as a beacon for scouts to tag you so you can be blown to bits by LRMs

But That won't happen. The game will probably give you a slap on the wrist and off you go again to shut down again.

[StormRuin]

With the overheating issue, I believe that if you have alot of missle mounts in the torso they might det. As well as internal ammo storage. It should also after a period of time (if you overheat your mech to often) start burning up heatsinks. Maybe even start doing damage to vital systems such as targeting, Radar, Gyro and so on.

When I played MW2-4. And because it wasnt a ballistic munition ( ie. Lazer or PPC only mech ) they could do this till end match or till they ran out of respaws / lifes.

[Jack BeFLippen]

i think it should have a base time, then have it be changed by how many heat sinks one fits.

[Aethon]

No idea what to vote, since I have no idea what the game's heat mechanics will be like...but 10 seconds is a VERY long time to be standing there drooling on yourself in the middle of a battle. Seriously, go watch a clock for 10 seconds and think of all that could happen in that time span.

Should there be a penalty for overheating? Sure. But CBT turns represented 10 seconds, and the pilot had a chance to restart the machine after that turn...so, 10 seconds might be a good starting point, with balancing going somewhere from 10.

Honestly, though, I usually end up seeing ammunition cook off or the pilot black out before the reactor shuts off when I am playing tabletop. Your results may vary, of course.

[CeeKay Boques]

Black Sunder, on 17 November 2011 - 09:45 AM, said:

Heat should be a factor in your tactical thinking. If you want to fire all and shut down, then you should face the consequences for it and sit there for a while so we can all see it. Meanwhile your massive heat signature will flare as a beacon for scouts to tag you so you can be blown to bits by LRMs

But That won't happen. The game will probably give you a slap on the wrist and off you go again to shut down again.

Don't know why you say that, so far the Mechwarrior games shutting down has been suicide, same with override. The only "easy time" of it is players who have figured out how to fire into the red, and then shutdown behind cover. That's not really battletechy. But often, even one override is core explosion, way tougher than the TT, which at least gives you a chance to roll.

[Helmer]

Black Sunder, on 17 November 2011 - 09:45 AM, said:

Heat should be a factor in your tactical thinking. If you want to fire all and shut down, then you should face the consequences for it and sit there for a while so we can all see it. Meanwhile your massive heat signature will flare as a beacon for scouts to tag you so you can be blown to bits by LRMs

But That won't happen. The game will probably give you a slap on the wrist and off you go again to shut down again.

Agreed.

Shutdown and recovery should be dependent on how far over the shutdown threshold you've tread, as well as how many online heatsinks you have. It really should be exponential. The further over the line you've crossed the harder it is for your heatsinks to kick in and recover (Kind like the human metabolism and food). A few seconds up to 12-15 seconds on the outside. A few seconds is a LIFETIME when someone is hammering your mech.

Damage effects should also play into it. Reactor core damage, damaging heat sinks , sensor damage, etc etc should be a serious considering in running hot.

[TheRulesLawyer]

Yah. 20-30seconds is just unrealistic. I figure about 5 seconds to "boot" the mech plus the time to get below critical heat. I figure that would leave you with 10-15 shutdowns often. Longer if you have a stupid max energy weapon, no heatsink loadout.

[wolf74]

Voted: go make a sandwich till your mech cools down

Because it can cool down faster if you have more heat sinks. But Targeting and weapons system don't come back online until your back at Normal heat AKA 0. But basic movement system could come online sooner. But if someone has Thermo-Optics up you should be a nice Bright spot for them to see &or if you behind a hill have a Heat column of Air going up from your mech giving away you location behind that hill away.

But if you shutdown because you shot down your mech With 0 heat than you would be much harder if not imposable(with the right advance skill & play opations. Some of the Add Advance CBT player know the option I speak of) to see with Thermo-Optics.

[Alizabeth Aijou]

Dihm, on 17 November 2011 - 05:23 AM, said:

20-30 seconds of shutdown will drive people away from the game.

Because it forces them to think?
That's a good one.

Its one of the reasons why 'Mechs like the Nova, Black Hawk-KU and Supernova are some of my favourites.
Do you stick to relatively heat-neutral firing patterns, or do go the distance and push the heat to near-shutdown levels for that extra bit of firepower?
The Nova Prime overheats with 29 on a jumping alpha strike, an almost-automatic shutdown (unless you roll 11-12 on 2D6).

Quote

Heh, there's not much for us veterans who can keep track of that kind of thing, but for newbies learning the ropes, you coudl say taht removing the limiter is like removing the training wheels on a bike.

You learn how to deal with overheating and such at whatever military academy you attended to become a MechWarrior. Overheating makes it almost impossible to pilot your 'Mech, while also making it almost impossible to hit your target. Using the Nova Prime as an example, after that jumping alpha, you won't be running away unless you can sink enough heat (26 overheat, -5MP).

If a noob has the heat limiter enabled, easy pickings since he can't make use of the overheat to avoid being blown to bits when it counts. If he has it disabled, put a few flamers against him and he shuts down.

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7 if reactor is stoped from shutdown & then spiked again BOOM your dead

Stackpole only. TacOps makes it pretty clear what it takes to blow up your engine, and the listed above isn't one of them.

[infinite xaer0]

I think it should depend on the several factors: how much heat you accumulated over the reacor's limit, how many heat sinks you have, how large your reactor is, and how skilled your pilot is at starting the mech up.

[I R O N Patriot]

Technoviking, on 17 November 2011 - 12:44 AM, said:

The question is, once you shut down, can you hit Override? Or if you miss your "WARNING, SHUTDOWN IMMANENT" window of 3 seconds are you doomed to go to Zero? Or do you roll every second based on your Pilot Skill?

Edit: That passcode idea is great tygr, mini games can be all kinds of fun.

Ya I think if they give you something to do while you are useless on the field is a good idea. But i think there should be some kind of skill level involved as well as the amount of Heat sinks you have.

[Nik Van Rhijn]

The skill comes in riding the edge of the heat curve - and in loading some low heat weapons for use in a close range furball to avoid shutdown.

[Haeso]

Restart should be relatively quick - damage from overheat should be catastrophic. Quick assumes your mech doesn't explode from the effects of overheating. There's something magical about loading up a ton of energy weapons to the point where one shot doesn't quite overheat you and the second one sends it spiraling well over the max to deal stupid amounts of damage more than you're supposed to. Or better yet, weapons that fire quickly enough to shoot several times after you've already overheated and shutdown is imminent.