29 replies to this topic

[The Dandy Lion]

OK so I'm new and I have checked the forum but I can't find an answer. In the round, taking account of ranges, ammo counts, damage per second and usability which is better suited to the Black Jack . The AC 2 makes me feel safer and I'm sure I do more damage per round with it but I seem to get more kills with the AC5?

Please don't toast me for this thread

[Lord Perversor]

The Dandy Lion, on 27 February 2014 - 03:34 AM, said:

OK so I'm new and I have checked the forum but I can't find an answer. In the round, taking account of ranges, ammo counts, damage per second and usability which is better suited to the Black Jack . The AC 2 makes me feel safer and I'm sure I do more damage per round with it but I seem to get more kills with the AC5?

Please don't toast me for this thread

My experience with Ac/2 fire support mechs tell me Ac/2 can deal quite a punch on long term engament, but most of the time you'll lose the kills to bigger punch weapons (hence why Ac/5 net you more kills than Ac/2)

At the end of the day i say play with whatever ffits your play better, even if you not rack much kills you are helping the team by siftening targets and KD:R it's not highly relevant in a team based gameplay.

[aniviron]

I don't run Blackjacks and I'm not sure how much tonnage you have to play with on yours, but in general the AC5 is considered to be superior to the AC2. The AC2 does more damage per second, but you also have to hit significantly more shots and spend more time looking directly at your target, which is dangerous. The AC2 is also prone to spreading damage out over the enemy mech instead of concentrating it where you want it, and runs quite a bit hotter than the AC5.

If you want to share the loadout you're using by creating it on Smurfy's website and posting it here, we'd be happy to have a look at it and give our opinions on what works and what doesn't.

EDIT: Something like this might work?

Edited by aniviron, 27 February 2014 - 03:43 AM.

[The Dandy Lion]

Ah so you can build it with out committing recourses, nice. thank you for your replies and the link.

[627]

You stll have another option. you just need to say goodbye to a symetrical layout and focus on ONE BIG gun and not two small ones.

And no I don't neccessarily mean AC20, AC10 or Gauss are good, too.

[The Dandy Lion]

Thank you, I am trying a gauss rifle now, boy that thing is big and heavy.

[Rhaythe]

627, on 27 February 2014 - 04:41 AM, said:

You stll have another option. you just need to say goodbye to a symetrical layout and focus on ONE BIG gun and not two small ones.

This recommendation is if you play according to the current meta, which is pinpoint alpha damage (meaning, do all your damage at once). If you play Damage-Per-Second mechs, this argument is null and void. Really depends on your play-style. There is nothing wrong with dual-AC2 or dual-AC5 Blackjacks unless your playstyle doesn't accomodate them.

[Roland]

AC5 will focus damage better, and thus is better at killing mechs.

[Rhaythe]

Roland, on 27 February 2014 - 07:11 AM, said:

AC5 will focus damage better, and thus is better at killing mechs.

If that is your goal. Just don't miss.

Though if "getting kills" is your whole goal in this game, you'll probably be better suited by not piloting mediums.

[Clit Beastwood]

The Dandy Lion, on 27 February 2014 - 03:34 AM, said:

OK so I'm new and I have checked the forum but I can't find an answer. In the round, taking account of ranges, ammo counts, damage per second and usability which is better suited to the Black Jack . The AC 2 makes me feel safer and I'm sure I do more damage per round with it but I seem to get more kills with the AC5?

Please don't toast me for this thread

Have you tried emulating the champion build? Ac20 3ml? It really is a pretty darned good build, especially if you use jj to shoot down while jetting.

[The Dandy Lion]

I am currently going through getting my BJ collection to lift them to Master status and the one I'm currently on has no jump jets, but yes I think I shall have a go at the hero version.

[Spheroid]

It depends, you running the stock engine?

[Trauglodyte]

Save yourself the trouble and avoid the AC Blackjack. It is a weight trap and something that isn't worth it overall. I run a BJ-1 like this but you can do it just as well with the BJ-3.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...03d5b371e492372

2 Lrg Lasers put out as much damage as 4 Md Lasers and just as much heat (-2 and -2 for damage and heat, respectively) but you gain a lot of range. The PPC is going to do just as well as the double AC5 but it'll cost you a lot less weight (heat sinks). It is a little bit hotter than what you'd get out of ACs but you're also saving a lot of weight in the process.

This is your standard AC5 BJ-1. It gives you 5 tons of ammo but you're slower than you'd be if you went the pure energy route.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...eb7d2c8d1e17afc

Btw, concerning the AC20, 3 Md Laser build, it does work. The problem, though, is you're hot and extremely short ranged. When you're not very fast and very lightly armored while being rather large, well, that makes for a bad combination. You can make it work and there are people that do really well with it. But, the top guys typically are running it in 12s with lots of support. PUGGERs on the other hand, will have extreme ups and downs depending on their group and opponents.

Edited by Trauglodyte, 27 February 2014 - 08:31 AM.

[Supersmacky]

This is my last asymmetrical build for the Black Jack.

BJ-1 Rockem' Sockem' Robot

Normally I go with very left/right equal build and generally that means AC/2s for me. Understand, that I like speed which is why I have the max engine in it. You could go with a smaller engine. No me, especially in mediums and lights speed = armor.

[CrazyWorm9]

me personally i run the bj-1 with stock engine and 2 jjs with just 2 med lasers and all upgrades with alot of ac2 ammo and it is good at suppression fire nothing is more satisfying when forcing a 100 ton atlas to back up and take cover wile my friends can move in and flank their position. at range the ac2s dont need u to be fast just fast enough to be mobile

[jper4]

actually having 1 ac2 and 1 ac5 has worked out decently for me, you don't have the heat of dual ac2s and have a bit more punch with the ac5 when you need it. ended up switching out because...symmetry dammit! but didn;t seem too bad with a couple lasers for backup (i forget what i had in it). if forget if i went with 2 tons of each ammo or had an extra ton for the ac2 since it chews up it's ammo quicker.

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

I recommend only using the 2 JJ BJs and the larger-engine BJ (1X IIRC). The ones with JJs can use those to make up for their relatively low top speed, while the fast one can pretty much behave like a larger, somewhat slower light.

BJ-1 is a variation on the common AC20/3ML build.

BJ-1X or BJ-1X are both nasty, but the first one is almost half a ton light and requires buying Endo. It simply doesn't have enough critical slots to use all the tonnage if you go with Endo. Put your lasers on three triggers and have fun (1 for each arm, 1 for the torso guns).

BJ-3 gives you a lot of punch. Arrange the lasers to taste. Symmetrical builds are a bit safer (built-in redundancy), but slapping all like lasers together lets you be a bit more cagey with poking around corners and such (but risks losing all your big guns with one limb).

[Spheroid]

After reviewing my DC builds I would say go with the 2x AC-5.

Edited by Spheroid, 27 February 2014 - 09:24 AM.

[The Dandy Lion]

WOW . . . so much info - awesome - thank you all.
All I need do now is gain enough cbills to try these out

[Roland]

I actually ran the 2xAC5 build while leveling up the BJ's, and it's not a terrible mech. Being able to just keep pounding out 10 point hits can hurt things pretty bad, if you can work around the inherent fragility of the BJ.