25 replies to this topic

[Leon Singer]

I just recently found out what I do is called pugging. This is my second account, I scrapped the last one cause I was bored with the same old mechs, playing thousands of games just to scrape enough money together to finally buy an assault mech cause I didn't pay money towards a free game. But enough of this crappy reward system, now back to PUGs. So, why all the dislike of pugs? I don't really "chat" (type) unless I got time or someone is getting flanked or something really important, but that doesn't mean I don't play like a team mate. I hate that call of duty play style. I try to read the battlefield around me, my lance mates, my enemies. If I can comply with orders given to me by someone pompous enough to click the commander button then I do, if Im not other wise occupied. I played with a friend once or twice where we actually communicated and I did not see any difference other than I was talking to my friend. Also I don't make friends online, online is purely for my gaming entertainment. Will I work as a team? Yes. Will I join some badass clan who has a really cool (lame) clan profile picture thing? No. Im PUG, and Im here to stay!

[Mazzyplz]

i am the pompous buffoon you're referring to, infamous pug commander

[marepinta]

Love this! I also play quiet. I enjoy watching what is happening, and following my lance mates if they are not stupid idiots bound to be rodeo-death-fodder just because they are GUYS. Most of the time I'm a good backup for anyone on my lance. But I don't type and don't chat. I usually drop with other friends who do all that stuff and I'm OK with following all directions, but just know I'm out there contributing as best I can and am not particularly interested in talking about whatever.

one small comment though ... why is it that everyone says "not going to put into money into a free-to-play game" ??? Anything someone enjoys is worth some money. I have a decent amount tucked into my computer, and I don't feel bad about paying for premium time, or whatever else catches my eye. Why is it that PGI is the bad guy when they don't provide a PERFECT game free-to-play? if you like it, support it.

[Davers]

Leon Singer, on 21 February 2014 - 04:19 PM, said:

This is my second account, I scrapped the last one cause I was bored with the same old mechs, playing thousands of games just to scrape enough money together to finally buy an assault mech cause I didn't pay money towards a free game.

So you made a second account so you can rebuy the same old mechs, playing thousands of games to scrape enough money to once again buy an assault mech because you don't want to pay money for a free game?

Where is the logic in that?

[Alaskan Nobody]

Davers, on 21 February 2014 - 08:14 PM, said:

So you made a second account so you can rebuy the same old mechs, playing thousands of games to scrape enough money to once again buy an assault mech because you don't want to pay money for a free game?

New player bonus maybe?

[Davers]

Shar Wolf, on 21 February 2014 - 08:16 PM, said:

New player bonus maybe?

Didn't his first account have a new player bonus? I thought everyone got it retroactively?

[Alaskan Nobody]

Davers, on 21 February 2014 - 08:17 PM, said:

Didn't his first account have a new player bonus? I thought everyone got it retroactively?

They did, but a second give it to him again, meaning less effort for more mechs (at the cost of more effort required for modules) it was flying around for a while as a suggestion to the 'casuals' for ways to play a lot of different mechs more easily

[Leon Singer]

I just dislike micro purchases. I'd rather buy a game, and everyone has equal stuff, and not buying the better/ more profitable things (like hero mechs...) Have I done it? Yeah, but then I realized that I ended up paying money for a digital game. Im into table top (Warhammer 40k) and card games (Call of Cthulu). These are very expensive, but in the future I can pass them on to my children, or play with someone face to face. Feels more real than a game that takes up half my computer screen lol.

Davers, on 21 February 2014 - 08:14 PM, said:

So you made a second account so you can rebuy the same old mechs, playing thousands of games to scrape enough money to once again buy an assault mech because you don't want to pay money for a free game?

Where is the logic in that?

I got bored. Plain and simple, plus Im weird and creating new accounts is my way of coping with boredom. I like the process of starting new. Case in point, Ive made tons of skyrim characters only to delete them several days later cause they wernt as interesting as I though they would be. Its just my thing I guess.

Shar Wolf, on 21 February 2014 - 08:18 PM, said:

They did, but a second give it to him again, meaning less effort for more mechs (at the cost of more effort required for modules) it was flying around for a while as a suggestion to the 'casuals' for ways to play a lot of different mechs more easily

I had the administration permanently lock my old account. Im not trying to milk the system, I just got bored of that account and wanted to start fresh.

[Alaskan Nobody]

Leon Singer, on 21 February 2014 - 08:24 PM, said:

I had the administration permanently lock my old account. Im not trying to milk the system, I just got bored of that account and wanted to start fresh.

That works to.

I wouldn't blame you for multiple accounts though - you get a lot more early stuff, but later stuff (modules... higher XP levels) are trickier that way, so you'd lose more than you'd gain

[Leon Singer]

Also I played assault mechs and I didn't have much fun. I like lights mediums and fast heavies. My role in the battlefield would be more suited to scout, support, or harasser. I just cant stand the slow pace of assaults. And I did have a good XL rated engine so it wasn't a stock engine in case someone was gonna say that.

Shar Wolf, on 21 February 2014 - 08:26 PM, said:

That works to.

I wouldn't blame you for multiple accounts though - you get a lot more early stuff, but later stuff (modules... higher XP levels) are trickier that way, so you'd lose more than you'd gain

Yeah and the fresh start gave me a chance to look and choose the 'mechs that I actually want to use and keep. Not get stuck with my noob decisions or sell them for next to nothing... and that's fair cause its a free to play game.

[Remarius]

I pug a lot tbh and enjoy the challenge as its a very different game from 4 or 12 man.

Can't see any logic to getting rid of an account though as there's literally zero advantage to it in game as its the same pool of mech's irrespective of which account you have.

Worse you've got rid of mech bays....

I'll just presume you were banned.

[StillRadioactive]

Leon Singer, on 21 February 2014 - 08:30 PM, said:

Also I played assault mechs and I didn't have much fun. I like lights mediums and fast heavies. My role in the battlefield would be more suited to scout, support, or harasser. I just cant stand the slow pace of assaults. And I did have a good XL rated engine so it wasn't a stock engine in case someone was gonna say that.



Yeah and the fresh start gave me a chance to look and choose the 'mechs that I actually want to use and keep. Not get stuck with my noob decisions or sell them for next to nothing... and that's fair cause its a free to play game.

I sympathize with the dislike for slow 'mechs... but an XL in most assault 'mechs is a death sentence. You're better off with an enormous Standard.

[marepinta]

Remarius, on 22 February 2014 - 02:43 AM, said:

I'll just presume you were banned.

Maybe you're kidding Remarius, maybe not.

I'm not long enough player of games to have ever had the urge to restart a new character, but the people I play with have ALL restarted different accounts. In every game they play. Even if there was zero benefit. Both in MWO and in other games. Logically it makes no sense, but there is something appealing about that clean-slate, do-it-over-better thing that comes into it when the player is bored with where they are once "successful." Especially in this game with everyone carrying on about "when community warfare gets here."

I hope your snarky remark about assuming Singer was banned was a joke. What I love about following these forums is that you guys are mostly straight-up. Even the whiners who come in here doing nothing but complaining end up starting enough of a conversation so they mellow on their way.

[PhoenixFire55]

For me dislike for PUGs is same as dislike for current matchmaker and PGI's treatment of units in general.

Back in closed beta I loved pugging and even tho I could drop with my friends I still was doing solo drops quite a lot, I was getting to know new people, new friendships etc. Generally players were all friendly bunch, had commons sense, basic understanding of tactics, using chat, working together etc.

Ever since game went open beta an influx of new people decreased the quality of an average player by a LOT. Nowadays in random drops you see all kinds of crap, trolls, abusers etc. I won't even bother to specify.

At some point "PUGs" started to cry that 'evil premades' are stomping them all the time and should not be allowed to drop into same queue. What PGI did is limited groups sizes to 4 instead of 8, so if you got 4-7 buddies online you had to choose who you wanted to play with and who not. This was pure BS, because PGI keeps telling us this is a team game and same time prevents any form of team play. If you couldn't get 8 people on same time you were pretty much screwed, further on with an increase of group vs group drops to 12 from 8 it became next to impossible for small units to play together. They also stated a simple fact that they don't give a damn about groups and making a game for a 'wider variety of players' and the 'majority of the playerbase'.

What I always wondered is that if PUG solo players were the majority then how could the premade minority always stomp them poor PUGs. If premades were truly a minority then it would have only been happening like 1 time out of 20 matches, I'm sure you could live with that. It is very convinient for those same "PUG-only" people to claim that there are so many "premades" they can't play and thus force a question like group size limit, and then claiming that "premades" are a minority when a decision is being made thus the opinion of this minority can be simply ignored. This does not lead to any love for these people in PUGs. You still see same "PUGs" complaining about getting stomped by sync-dropping premades even when there are no premades in the match at all.

During 8 vs 8 a skilled premade of 4 was capable of swining the balance of the match in their favor even with rather useless second lance, but in 12 vs 12 it is next to impossible to carry the remainder of your team if they don't do anything. What it means is that even tho you do use teamwork and do try hard it won't matter in the end, your match outcome is decided by a random draw of your teammates.

Last nail in the coffin is the Elo matchmaker. What was promised to us and that MM will create teams based to players skill level, and that high-skill players will only play vs high-skill players and visa versa. Needless to say this MM failed horribly, balanced matches do happen but not any more often than back in closed beta where we had a "random" MM that only matched mech 'types' (lights, mediums etc.).

What MM "balances" is combined Elo scores of two teams. This means that the better player you are, and the better players you team up with, the worse teammates you are gonna get to complete your team. Needless to say, skilled players do want to play with skilled players. Sometimes it does turn to be pretty much 4-6 vs 10-12 and its no fun at all. Other times it is same 10-12 vs 4-6 on their side and you win but it ain't any more fun either.

So, I was promised I will only play with people of about same skill level, and yet I pretty much always get CoD rambos, suiciders, farmers, complete newbies in my matches which slowly but inevitably leads to me hating PUGs more and more. Most people in PUGs don't care about anything but their own c-bills count, they are just there for the money-grind.

12 v 12 queue remains dead, there are no limiting factors in there thus people always bring 'competitive' or 'cheese' builds. Needless to say, sitting in one place and PPC-sniping for 15 mins isn't very fun to play. Currently there is no chance to play for fun with your team in a team-based game.

This was supposed to be a team game, you bring your team, you play with your team. Yet I am forced to play with some random people I want absolutely nothing to do with.

You do still meet decent people in PUGs, and there are still new people joining the game who are willing to learn, improve their game etc., but sadly they seem to be a minority. PUG-ing used to be fun in closed beta but PGI killed it. As soon as private matches are availiable you will never see me in PUGs.

[Bront]

The problems with PUGs? (Note, I enjoy PUGging from time to time, so I don't dislike them, but I understand there are flaws)

1) You are lacking the instant communication that is VOIP. Sure, you can chat via the in game text chat, but it's hard to pilot and do that.

2) You're inherently teamed up with random people, so you never know the quality of people you'll be dropped with (in regards to the game). Even a 4 man does not have this disadvantage.

3) You can't always count on your team. This is as much a symptom of #1 and #2 as it is a problem in and of itself. Sometimes you get folks who don't pay attention to the chat, other times you get questionable teammates.

A great example I have is this. On Terra Therma, I was in a pug, and our lance pealed off to the right and started walking. I asked over coms "Shouldn't we join the rest of the group?" to our lance. One person replied "So, hard left then?", and I replied "yes", and no one changed course, leaving me behind, where I was picked off by a mech before anyone could come to help me, and I couldn't call for help. (I was piloting the trial Stalker, not a good mech to brawl an Orion in). Had my lance stayed together and turned when they did, we would have not ran into that Orion, and if we had, the the resulting 4 on 1 would have made for a dead Orion pretty quickly.

Sometimes, you get good PUGs. You get folks like you who look to play as a team, communicate, follow a plan, and work well together. Other times, you get a group of folks who don't know what they're doing, refuse to listen or communicate, and wander off willy nilly not caring to work with the team, or are more concerned with their own personal safety than with working as a team.


Somewhat on topic, one of my better thought out statements was this: The difference between leading a charge and doing a 'Leroy Jenkins' impersonation is whether the PUGs follow you. To date, my favorite example of this was in a 2 man on Alpine prior to the start point changes where we managed to damage the folks defending the hill pretty well. All the PUGs were in position, so I called for a charge and started to lead it. My friend and I both went, and no one else did, and I got torn down. Immediately after I died, everyone else charged up the hill and we only lost 1 more mech (Game was 3-2 at that point where I died, we won 12-3).

Edited by Bront, 23 February 2014 - 08:07 AM.

[Dramborleg]

Leon Singer, on 21 February 2014 - 04:19 PM, said:

...someone pompous enough to click the commander button...

That's probably part of the reason. You claim to be a team player but if someone tries to coordinate the team you view them as a megalomaniac. Also you view communication as nice but unecessary when, in this game, it is very necessary, although not always practical because of the game's design.

[Koniving]

"So you hate pugs."

Koniving, on 23 February 2014 - 09:55 AM, said:

Lights are like squirrels, every dog wants to chase them. And while dogs are loyal, kind, and man's best friend... let's face it. Dogs aren't as smart as we'd like to think they are. And well, consider that most solo gamers call themselves "Pugs."


This guy chases squirrels that can climb trees. And typically this guy runs into the trees.

As you can imagine, they're chasing lights for the notion of easy kills. But that's what lights want, the mech running away is leading you into an ambush.

[Bront]

Koniving, on 23 February 2014 - 03:24 PM, said:

"So you hate pugs."

Quit dogging the poor man.

[Koniving]

Aw, but, but, it's a pug!

You know how their faces got so flat, right?

Anyway, seriously though there's nothing wrong with pugs. It's more specifically with the people that don't seem to have intelligent thought in what they are doing. Tunnel vision. Spider chasing. Rushing to the center. Leaping from building to building. Running from a single spider with MGs...in a straight line.... in an Atlas... at full health.

Oh my god I wanted to grab his mech by the skull and bash it into the nearby rocks.

Edited by Koniving, 25 February 2014 - 08:29 AM.

[Novalov]

Pugging is all I do of late, a lot of my closed / open beta friends have been absent, I think they saw something shiny in ESO, if they're having fun cool. I had joined an outfit, the one or two that seemed to even notice I was around were nice, regardless of trying to be assigned to a sub group I seemed to be lost in the numerous lot of other requests people had and such. I don't mind the pug so much I don't expect any miracles just a chance to test play styles and mech builds. I have played with a lot of great players and a lot of abusive, petulant complainers. I seldom reply to anything other then constructive chat / suggestions, but on occasion I get pushed a tad far and will speak up. If you want to insult myself or other players with elitist banter I have no time for you or your antics. Being called out because someone "thinks" they know what my name is and how it is spelt (it is just as it is spelled and pronounced "NO VAL OF" not a misspelt "Novalove") and held out to be less than intelligent only shines a light on what I refer to as "cyber balls" pugs are full of them. I stick with this, in a pug focus on bettering your game and do your best to help your team, you win, you lose at time very badly. It's a game treat it as such. Be well and pug on (o-o)7 feel free to shoot me friend requests if you like.