20 replies to this topic

[Mixaren]

Could someone please let me know the difference between Standard and XL engines and what each of the numbers means next to it? Thanks!

[gregsolidus]

http://www.sarna.net...i/Fusion_Engine

[Jost]

Numbers where? In the TT rules? Assuming those:

Standard engines are, well, standard. XL is "extra light", and takes up less weight, though at two costs:
1) takes up more crit slots in the mech; and
2) renders your mech slightly more vulnerable to damage (losing a side torso drops the mech, which isn't necessarily true with a standard engine).

[cipher]

Better link: http://www.sarna.net...ion_Engine_-_XL

[Radgor Ryan]

The numbers indicate their power. So a 280 Vox is more powerful than a 120 magna. If you divide the power by the mech tonnage and multiply by 10 you'll get a rough walking speed. XL engines are lighter but can be destroyed if the side torsos are destroyed.

[Mixaren]

Thanks!

[Shadowscythe]

if you want to see the MAX speed of different mechs with different non XL engines I made a big chart in http://mwomercs.com/...hs/page__st__40

but I didn't make an XL version..

[Kenshar]

TT info is cool... but do we know anything about it in this game?

[Vaktor]

Kenshar, on 19 June 2012 - 03:52 PM, said:

TT info is cool... but do we know anything about it in this game?

They seem to be sticking pretty close with TT from what I have seen of the mech lab

[KageRyuu]

Kenshar, on 19 June 2012 - 03:52 PM, said:

TT info is cool... but do we know anything about it in this game?

Other than the TT construction rules are prime inspiration for the Mech Lab, no.


That aside, the Engine Rating, or "numbers off to the side of the type" are the TT walk MP of the mech times it's Weight. If you divide this number by 25 you get the number of Critical Slot Free Heat Sinks you can get and is also used to measure the weight of the engine by comparing it to a chart available in one of many TT mech construction rule books such as the BattleTech: Tech Manual. Meaning Engines with the same rating and type will weigh the same.

Regardless, there's not much say on how close the game will follow the TT so always consider with a grain of salt.

[SuomiWarder]

In TT rules you putting a slightly bigger engine in your Mech won't result in a speed gain unless you reach a full hex. Don't know what they plan for MWO, but it may be that partial speed enhancements (rather than 30 meter hex units) might be possible. No reason for them not to do so.

[Sierra19]

I read a thread earlier today (maybe the ask the devs thread), that just like in TT BT, if your side torsos get taken out, that'll damage/destroy the XL engine. So you need to be careful, and make sure you're making the right decision with an XL engine. Personally, I've never hadd too much of a problem in the TT game, as we used randomized hit locations, but since you can actually aim in MWO, it may be more of an issue.

[Shadowscythe]

Sierra19, on 19 June 2012 - 04:17 PM, said:

I read a thread earlier today (maybe the ask the devs thread), that just like in TT BT, if your side torsos get taken out, that'll damage/destroy the XL engine. So you need to be careful, and make sure you're making the right decision with an XL engine. Personally, I've never hadd too much of a problem in the TT game, as we used randomized hit locations, but since you can actually aim in MWO, it may be more of an issue.

Yep, hopefully people will think before they use them in the big buys (since it will be easier to aim shots on them)....


As a lot of things in this game, it comes to personal preference.

Take the lighter engine so you can go faster or carry more items....but if you lose a side torso (which has less armor, and easier to hit from side the side) you will be destroyed.......It takes 3 engine hits to destroy a mech and XL engine puts 3 engine crits in each side torso.

Or just take the normal engine. and be able to lose both side torsos before they even touch the center one
Granted if you lose both side before your center, that is probably someone just toying with you lol

The actual dev quote is in Ask the Devs 7

Q: Will destruction of one or both side torsos result in "coring" of an XL engine?
A: As of right now, yes. It may change, though it will at the very least have an extremely bad impact should you lose a torso piece [GARTH]

Edited by Shadowscythe, 19 June 2012 - 04:51 PM.

[KageRyuu]

Unless your smart and rotate your less vital area's into their line of fire using them as a shield while you wait for your weapons to recharge.

[Major Bill Curtis]

Shadowscythe, on 19 June 2012 - 04:37 PM, said:

Yep, hopefully people will think before they use them in the big buys (since it will be easier to aim shots on them)....


As a lot of things in this game, it comes to personal preference.

Take the lighter engine so you can go faster or carry more items....but if you lose a side torso (which has less armor, and easier to hit from side the side) you will be destroyed.......It takes 3 engine hits to destroy a mech and XL engine puts 3 engine crits in each side torso.

Or just take the normal engine. and be able to lose both side torsos before they even touch the center one
Granted if you lose both side before your center, that is probably someone just toying with you lol

The actual dev quote is in Ask the Devs 7

Q: Will destruction of one or both side torsos result in "coring" of an XL engine?
A: As of right now, yes. It may change, though it will at the very least have an extremely bad impact should you lose a torso piece [GARTH]

This^^

Some guys like an XL in everything; some guys think the fragility issue makes them not worth it. My opinion, drawn from long experience (which doesn't make my opinion correct, but I am basing it on evidence) is that the weight cutoff, above which the XL becomes a liability, is somewhere in the wide range of 50-75 tons of chassis size, depending on play style, situation, and a thousand other factors.

XL engines really change 'mechs below 50 tons completely, allowing them to be fast, well-armored, and mount decent weaponry; their armor is still light enough that the issue of side-torso penetration is not as defining as it is for an assault 'mech (don't worry if this seems a little odd).

In the 50-75 ton range, whether you take the XL engine just depends a lot on what you want to do and what you're willing to sacrifice. At 80 tons and up, you're already slow and heavily-armed enough that lasting power becomes key (and you are an easy target).

There are as many opinions on the proper use and value of the XL as there are mech warriors, which is quite a cool thing, if you think about it.

[KageRyuu]

Yep very true, very true.

Personally I can't stand the fragility of it, but more importantly I can't stand the insane price tag on it, nearly doubling or even tripling a mech's cost, let alone increasing it's BV by roughly 50%! Sure it's an easier and more space efficient way to get weight back then Endo Steel or Ferro Fiber, but even those are a drop in the bucket compared to an XL engines's multiplier costs.

[Major Bill Curtis]

KageRyuu, on 19 June 2012 - 06:21 PM, said:

I can't stand the insane price tag on it, nearly doubling or even tripling a mech's cost, let alone increasing it's BV by roughly 50%!

Cataphract-lovers may be in for a surprise when they look at the cost of that thing (you can just about buy an Atlas and a Catapult for the price of a Cataphract).

Things aren't nearly so bad at lighter weights, but we're still talking millions of C-Bills (and what if that gyro has to be upgraded too---oh no!)

[SilentSooYun]

Major Bill Curtis, on 19 June 2012 - 05:55 PM, said:

Some guys like an XL in everything; some guys think the fragility issue makes them not worth it. My opinion, drawn from long experience (which doesn't make my opinion correct, but I am basing it on evidence) is that the weight cutoff, above which the XL becomes a liability, is somewhere in the wide range of 50-75 tons of chassis size, depending on play style, situation, and a thousand other factors.

XL engines really change 'mechs below 50 tons completely, allowing them to be fast, well-armored, and mount decent weaponry; their armor is still light enough that the issue of side-torso penetration is not as defining as it is for an assault 'mech (don't worry if this seems a little odd).

In the 50-75 ton range, whether you take the XL engine just depends a lot on what you want to do and what you're willing to sacrifice. At 80 tons and up, you're already slow and heavily-armed enough that lasting power becomes key (and you are an easy target).

There are as many opinions on the proper use and value of the XL as there are mech warriors, which is quite a cool thing, if you think about it.

Well said

I think in a mixed-tonnage, intel-sensitive game like MWO it might be less of an issue for the lighter Mechs. They have their heavies to draw fire while their mobility makes them a less easy target to aquire. Meanwhile, the increase in weapons and armour keeps them competitive with the heavier opponents, as long as you don't attempt to stand straight up against an Assault.

[Shadowscythe]

At one point I want to see how fast I can get a commando with an XL engine in game

I already know how fast I can get it in BT TT design

[cipher]

On that note, I can't wait to salvage clan XL engines in game. 2 slots in each of the left and right torso would mean no coring of the engine if a side torso goes.