27 replies to this topic

[Felicitatem Parco]

I'm trying to propose that there should be 4 drop modes, like how PGI has presented 4, but I think one of them needs to be adjusted/replaced.

Currently, they are proposing:

1.) Solo and small group public queue
2.) 12-man Public queue
3.) 12-man free private matches
4.) #-man Premium Private matches


I suggest they replace #2.) with a "Big Group Queue" that's comprised of 6+man groups (instead of ONLY 12-man groups) and have the rest of the team filled with solo players. That will let big groups of 6-12 drop against other big groups without letting a single group unfairly dominate the team or forcing them to muster 12 players when they can only get 7 or 8 online at a time. They can still fight for C-bills and for free with groups of less than 12.

This is meant to address the players who can form groups that are too big to drop in the "solo queue" but are short of a full 12-man Company. It would allow you to drop with an 8-man group and 4 solo players against a random 12-man group for XP and C-bills. This would probably prevent the public 12-man queue from drying-up as feared by the Developers.


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Roland, on 01 March 2014 - 10:10 AM, said:

Just make two queues.

Solo queue
Unrestricted queue (anyone, including solo players, can join)

That is all you need to do. It really is that simple.

The problem with the Solo and Unrestricted queue idea is that it does not reflect what Community Warfare will be like. Community Warfare will be divided into two major sections - Mercenary vs. Mercenary Contracts and Faction Military fighting. My proposed scheme will provide an environment that reflects both scenarios: Mercenary fighting will be mostly large-group based because it's only for medium<->big Guilds and solo Lone Wolves , which is similar to my Large Group Queue; the Faction fighting will be mostly smaller groups and individuals with a small proportion of the faction payers using large groups than the Mercenary side.

Once CW goes live with territories, then you can bet your arses that whatever drop schemes/mode are in place at the time will be modified, so my idea is merely a step in the future direction of what CW will be like.

Edited by Prosperity Park, 01 March 2014 - 10:47 AM.

[Wintersdark]

I voted yes, but I'd have to change the suggestion to "groups of any size" or more clearly "unrestricted". This is because you'd need small groups to pad large groups, as you can't really rely on solo players providing ample padding.

[Helbrecht]

well you could if the solo player were given a incentive to join that que you could even call it community warfare que i think somthing along the lines of 10% to 20% cbill and exp for just the solo player would be a sufficent draw to solo players. given the fact that thier splitting ther ques anyway all they would really have to do is change the parameters it shouldnt be that hard.

Edited by Helbrecht, 01 March 2014 - 09:16 AM.

[Prezimonto]

so are 5 man groups just out of luck?

[Helbrecht]

my thinking would be to simplify it and have just a solo que and a group que filled with solo's who want to. plus give them a simple incentive of 10% to 20% cbills and exp. sorry to highjack your post prosperity we have similiar ideas but i dont think having 2 threads about the same idea would be good :0.

Edited by Helbrecht, 01 March 2014 - 09:27 AM.

[Andrinor Johnston]

PGI the community needs this. Test it out on a week end. Groups of 5 to 7 match up, groups of 8 to 10 match up fill the rest with well-paid mercs that opt in.
smaller team gets the better elo scored solos

Edited by Andrinor Johnston, 01 March 2014 - 09:31 AM.

[Felicitatem Parco]

Helbrecht, on 01 March 2014 - 09:27 AM, said:

my thinking would be to simplify it and have just a solo que and a group que filled with solo's who want to. plus give them a simple incentive of 10% to 20% cbills and exp. sorry to highjack your post prosperity we have similiar ideas but i dont think having 2 threads about the same idea would be good :0.

I actually don't like having to give bonuses or incentives for dropping in one mode over another. Also, I think that small groups should be queued separately from large groups while solo players are dropped into either one of those two queues, depending on which queue has open slots for their Mech/ranking.

[NRP]

Yes!

Groups of any size can join, one large group can be pitted against multiple smaller groups, with the rest filled in with solo players. The understanding going into this playlist would be that due to matchmaking realities, the wait times could be long, teams may not always be 12v12, tonnage may not always be perfectly balanced, and you could occasionally get ROFLstomped by the Eridani Baloney Ponies.

Bring that shit on!

[Helbrecht]

Prosperity Park, on 01 March 2014 - 09:31 AM, said:

I actually don't like having to give bonuses or incentives for dropping in one mode over another. Also, I think that small groups should be queued separately from large groups while solo players are dropped into either one of those two queues, depending on which queue has open slots for their Mech/ranking.

they wont do a major over haul like that to a system they have half done. but what thier likly to do is a monor tweak of changing parameters to said system. i agree with you 100% we need a solo and a group que. what we disagree on is the parameters.

[Roland]

Just make two queues.

Solo queue
Unrestricted queue (anyone, including solo players, can join)

That is all you need to do. It really is that simple.

Don't over engineer some complex solution when the simple solution has already been found and shown to work.

Edited by Roland, 01 March 2014 - 10:10 AM.

[NRP]

I like PGI's plans for the Launch Module "solo" queue.

This idea is for a "group centric" queue with lax enough restrictions to accommodate all the half drunk weekend warriors who just want to team up with friends, talk some shit, and cuss up a storm when they get stuck on terrain. It's not intended to be a serious, hardcore playlist.

[Felicitatem Parco]

Roland, on 01 March 2014 - 10:10 AM, said:

Just make two queues.

Solo queue
Unrestricted queue (anyone, including solo players, can join)

That is all you need to do. It really is that simple.

Don't over engineer some complex solution when the simple solution has already been found and shown to work.

The problem with the Solo and Unrestricted queue idea is that it does not reflect what Community Warfare will be like. Community Warfare will be divided into two major sections - Mercenary vs. Mercenary Contracts and Faction Military fighting. My proposed scheme will provide an environment that reflects both scenarios: Mercenary fighting will be mostly large-group based because it's only for medium<->big Guilds and solo Lone Wolves , which is similar to my Large Group Queue; the Faction fighting will be mostly smaller groups and individuals with a small proportion of the faction payers using large groups than the Mercenary side.

Once CW goes live with territories, then you can bet your arses that whatever drop schemes/mode are in place at the time will be modified, so my idea is merely a step in the future direction of what CW will be like.

Edited by Prosperity Park, 01 March 2014 - 10:46 AM.

[Roland]

I think the idea of an unrestricted queue much better represents how a community warfare system for house fighting would work.

Basically, you will have groups of arbitrary size from the houses, filled with solo players, to form the teams for the houses in those battles.

[Helbrecht]

Roland, on 01 March 2014 - 10:10 AM, said:

Just make two queues.

Solo queue
Unrestricted queue (anyone, including solo players, can join)

That is all you need to do. It really is that simple.

Don't over engineer some complex solution when the simple solution has already been found and shown to work.

exactly

[Sinthrow]

I don't know what the best solution is. All I can say is it takes too long to get a 12 man group up and running. How much time we would have saved if we could drop as a group of 10. How many group drops have I missed out on waiting for that 12 man.
I don't want this issue to be dropped. I want PGI to find a way to make this happen and still provide a decent match.
I really like the ideas of the public and private drops but how long of a wait to get that 24 man.. We also need some form of advertizing that we have a 12man that we want to match up against someone

[3rdworld]

I think it is a bad idea.

The 12 man queue is vicious and incredibly difficult for many units / pug 12s.

Unless you could drastically raise the participation you are going to see stomps on a monumental scale.

[Davers]

I think what they have for private matches is pretty dead on. If the apparently huge number of 5 man groups have to use premium time to get their lance on lance action on, I'm sorry but I think it's fair. Pay up or spawn more Overlords to raise your population cap!

But many players aren't interested in ladders or tournaments. They want to fight as a unit in CW. The promise of players fighting in units over control of the Inner Sphere was a big reason Founders invested in this game. The upcoming MM should include (in addition to all the good stuff already announced) matching of units based on size. A 12 man would never be matched vs a 2 man, but could be matched against an 11, 10, or 9 man. An 8 man group could be matched with a 8, 7, 6, or 5 man group.

If this leads to a 'power imbalance' in the middle ranges, there could be a limitation such as: 5 man group must include a light mech, a 6 man must include a light and a medium, a 7 man would need to have a light, medium, and heavy, while an 8 man would need to have one of each weight class. (Or maybe there wouldn't need to be any limitations at all- just brainstorming here.)

With House Units still a distant twinkle in the Dev's eyes, there needs to be a way for these units to interact with CW when it is released.

[Helbrecht]

3rdworld, on 01 March 2014 - 01:31 PM, said:

I think it is a bad idea.

The 12 man queue is vicious and incredibly difficult for many units / pug 12s.
Unless you could drastically raise the participation you are going to see stomps on a monumental scale.

your absalutly right 12 man team vs pug is certain death for the pug. but at the same time using the system of seperate que were proposing that is also a worse case scenario. what your most likly to see is a team of say 5-9 vs another team of 5-9 which in that is fairly balanced. and second i dont know why were all worried about stomps anyway how often does a game actually end close (8-12) not very often usualy its somthing sad lik 12-4 or lower.

Edited by Helbrecht, 01 March 2014 - 05:49 PM.

[Pihb]

Solo dropper here. I in no way shape or form want anything to do with being filler for groups. From what I have been led to understand, people who roll in groups are a very small minority in this game. Keep the groups fighting other groups, keep the solo people solo. Stop trying to get pgi to provide cannon fodder for your group.

[Davers]