174 replies to this topic

[Karl Streiger]

lsp, on 04 March 2014 - 12:43 AM, said:

MW4 was a awesome game.

Yes the awesome was in the game

And MW4 was primary a single player game - so i never understand why the same design decission were made in MWO

[Alex Warden]

Ph30nix, on 03 March 2014 - 08:08 AM, said:

PGI/IGP (really can't tell for sure which company is leading the charge on issues) has shown time and again that they know what they want to do with the game and where they want it to go.

They just told us all something completely differnt and let us belive they were going to give us a great mechwarrior game that we would happily spend money on. Instead we got a game that is heading to be a Mechwarrior version of World of Tanks......

sad part is, WoT feels way more realistic and tactical ... funny, ain´t it?

[Karl Streiger]

Alex Warden, on 04 March 2014 - 01:26 AM, said:

sad part is, WoT feels way more realistic and tactical ... funny, ain´t it?

Not to mention - that WoT is by far the better "Solo" Player experience - because a single player is indeed capable of runining the other team single handed - while a sole player - no matter his abilitys and mech skill trees is dead meat when facing 2 or 3 enemys

[Joseph Mallan]

Karl Streiger, on 04 March 2014 - 01:44 AM, said:

Not to mention - that WoT is by far the better "Solo" Player experience - because a single player is indeed capable of runining the other team single handed - while a sole player - no matter his abilitys and mech skill trees is dead meat when facing 2 or 3 enemys

As should be the case more often than not.

[Davers]

For what it's worth, it is described as an 'EPIC Megabattle' and at least the guys on the winning side seemed to have fun.

[Kaeb Odellas]

Alex Warden, on 04 March 2014 - 01:26 AM, said:

sad part is, WoT feels way more realistic and tactical ... funny, ain´t it?

I should think that a WWII tank battle should, by definition, feel more realistic than a battle between giant combat robots.

[Varent]

Karl Streiger, on 04 March 2014 - 12:44 AM, said:

Yes the awesome was in the game

And MW4 was primary a single player game - so i never understand why the same design decission were made in MWO

you just answered your own question. Primary single player game. MWO is a multiplayer only game. Different realm. Also a one time purchase versus a micro transaction pay to play.

[Rokuzachi]

I basically play matches each night until I end up fighting a poptart squad like the video. In other words, I play 1-3 matches and then don't want to look at the game any more. Game needs soooo much fixing.

[CeeKay Boques]

Karl Streiger, on 04 March 2014 - 12:44 AM, said:

And MW4 was primary a single player game - so i never understand why the same design decission were made in MWO

This is a very wrong statement. MW4 almost kept the Zone alive single handedly, and was doing multiplayer matches for years beyond the match maker in incredible ladder and planetary leagues. You just weren't there.

[Alex Warden]

Kaeb Odellas, on 04 March 2014 - 09:44 AM, said:

I should think that a WWII tank battle should, by definition, feel more realistic than a battle between giant combat robots.

well kinda true, but it should at least be possible to give driving a giant robot a "somewhat realistic feel" to it... in a science-fiction way of course

[Karl Streiger]

it doesn't matter what mw4 did it simple followed its predecessors mw2 and mw3.
pinpoint accurate weapons for the player random assigned hit locations for the AI.
necessary to triumph against the odds.
well but I still don't think it was the right thing for the multiplayer experience

[GreyGriffin]

Alex Warden, on 04 March 2014 - 11:41 AM, said:

well kinda true, but it should at least be possible to give driving a giant robot a "somewhat realistic feel" to it... in a science-fiction way of course

I think what you are looking for is the word "simmy," It's a bit of a dirty word in gaming right now. Games like Independence War were "simmy," or focused on the experience of "feeling" real, rather than actually expressing realism.

Personally I think Jump Jets are terrible. They are worthless for maneuvering, they leave you hovering in the air for way too long, and you get zero lateral distance. But they are insanely good for creating an airborne sniper platform, which the current convergence/pinpoint mechanics support. Fix pinpoint damage and Jump Jets can get way, way better.

[Nick Makiaveli]

Egomane, on 03 March 2014 - 01:55 AM, said:

Did you see this thread, pinned right to the top of this sub-forum, before you posted?

It would have told you, that they are currently looking at exactly that for a nerf.

You think you are so smart don't you, what with your logic and facts?!?!

[Lykaon]

Kaeb Odellas, on 03 March 2014 - 01:59 AM, said:

To be fair, that thread title has no mention of assault mechs or poptarting. It also doesn't address the issue of pinpoint damage, which is the underlying issue here.

That is the issue in the nutshell and many of the beta players saw this coming over a year ago when we saw a glut of twin gauss rifle K2s dominating the field.

Poptarting is an evolution of the means to deliver FLD alpha strikes while remaining in cover as much as possible.

If you nerf jumping to useless levels (not saying this did happen) we would still have all those front loaded damage alpha strikes flinging around creating "hillhumper online" as the next great meta play.

[Joseph Mallan]

Lykaon, on 05 March 2014 - 06:49 AM, said:

That is the issue in the nutshell and many of the beta players saw this coming over a year ago when we saw a glut of twin gauss rifle K2s dominating the field.

Poptarting is an evolution of the means to deliver FLD alpha strikes while remaining in cover as much as possible.

If you nerf jumping to useless levels (not saying this did happen) we would still have all those front loaded damage alpha strikes flinging around creating "hillhumper online" as the next great meta play.

I didn't find the GaussCat to be a problem, They were kinda squishy under my 2x LRM20. Having a full team of players who know where the "R" key is made it really easy to make 'em go crunch.

[Mcgral18]

Joseph Mallan, on 05 March 2014 - 07:00 AM, said:

I didn't find the GaussCat to be a problem, They were kinda squishy under my 2x LRM20. Having a full team of players who know where the "R" key is made it really easy to make 'em go crunch.

But you see, LRMs are rather worthless now. As are SRMs, flamers, and pretty much everything aside from ACs, ML, LL and PPCs. So, the best way to counter the frontloaded build is : Frontloaded builds! What a wonderful balance decision.

Edited by Mcgral18, 05 March 2014 - 07:15 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Mcgral18, on 05 March 2014 - 07:14 AM, said:

But you see, LRMs are rather worthless now. As are SRMs, flamers, and pretty much everything aside from ACs, ML, LL and PPCs. So, the best way to counter the frontloaded build is : Frontloaded builds! What a wonderful balance decision.

Which is what the player base asked for during closed beta.

Make Convergence faster.
Make Missiles weaker
Leave energy alone it is bad enough as is.
Make PPCs better
No make Missiles weaker still.
Make PPCs better
Convergence needs to be better... My Skillz are more awesome than this!
Make PPCs cooler
No Missiles need nerfed some more.
Make PPCs faster
...
...
...
ACs and PCs are to powerful!!!!

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Joseph Mallan, on 05 March 2014 - 07:38 AM, said:

Which is what the player base asked for during closed beta.

Make Convergence faster.
Make Missiles weaker
Leave energy alone it is bad enough as is.
Make PPCs better
No make Missiles weaker still.
Make PPCs better
Convergence needs to be better... My Skillz are more awesome than this!
Make PPCs cooler
No Missiles need nerfed some more.
Make PPCs faster
...
...
...
ACs and PCs are to powerful!!!!

I don't quite remember it that way. Most of these problems stem from PGI's issues with hit detection and missiles having multiple bugs that would crop up whenever adjustments were made.

For instance, PPC's and AC's were very unreliable to before HSR, which caused PGI to balance them...then HSR went in and they were overpowered. And still are.

This of course also is partly due to the terrible heat scale and AC's having insane range...oh and ammo doesn't matter.

As for LRM's, every time PGI mucked with them, it created a broken LRMageddon, which meant they had to nerf them into the dirt afterwards.

And SRM's never recovered from the splash adjustments that broke the hit detection.

So this is not about the players, but more about PGI's balancing methods and bugs.

[Joseph Mallan]

Before HSR I was having no real problems with hit reg... No more than I expected I should say. I would use A PPC or Large Laser depending on how SRMs were working.

I guess it is also a matter of perspective though Nick.

[ScorpionNinja]

Hey, to all the bitching going on about the NEVERENDING AC/PPC QQ's.

Yo, can some of you remember the SEGA GENESIS 16bit "Mech Warrior 3050" game, back in the day...?

Remember in that game, you had to CHARGE UP the PPC, then release to fire it?

Remember when "Betty" voice would say "Over Charging!" then the PPC would BLOW UP and blew up your mechs Arm?


So, how about PGI changes mechanics AROUND?

Return Gauss Rifle back to "point and shoot".

And make PPC/ERPPC's have that "Charge-Up" mechanic?



Now you cannot use pinpoint alphas of PPCs and Gauss Rifles or Autocannons Together!

Futhermore, now Large Lasers and Large Pulse Lasers become more attractive, except for those that are very good with the charge-up mechanic. Those folks will still be using PPCs. PPCs wont be the end all by all weapon anymore!

Edited by ScorpionNinja, 05 March 2014 - 08:00 AM.