19 replies to this topic

[Hollow Earth]

As the title says, is the Dragon Flame worth buying?
i have been wanting to buy a hero mech for the first time and i am interested in the Flame. mostly because it has a high mounted ballistic hardpoint and decent looking energy slots and i have been hearing the Flame is the best of the Dragons. though most of what i heard of it is old and wondering if updates had made the Flame less effective then it once was or not.

I also have an XL300 engine lying around and also wondering if dragons are still okay with that since the hitbox change.

[Nauht]

If you like Dragons, Flame is the best of them.

I think your concerns are more for Dragons as a whole - and that's entirely dependent on hour playstyle and what mech appeals to you.
Just remember the Dragon is a fast skirmisher and you'll need to use it in that role. Everything else a Phract is superior.

[Hans Von Lohman]

It is the only Dragon that can carry an AC-20.

What is more interesting is that AC-20 is mounted high up on the shoulder like the Shadow Hawk. It is a teeny, tiny, little gun but it is there. Definitely surprises the hell out of people when you run into that.

That, and having all lasers in your arms are much better for tracking shots and makes it much better to concentrate maximum firepower on the enemy shield generators...I mean center torso.

The Flame is the best Dragon, but that is if you like Dragons.

[Daekar]

It's the best of the Dragons. It can work, but it is fragile when compared to other heavies. I play my Flame when I am feeling good, because chances are I won't do as well as if I had taken my Ilya Muromets or Protector.

[Karl Streiger]

If your really like to have Dragons than you really should think about the Flame - but the big 55s - S-Hawk, Griffin and Wolverine - are better in all other terms

Have had a really good time with the Flame back in January 3050...(2013) - but currently its obsolete

[Vegetal Maldito]

I actually like a Fang with an AC7 setup. But I'm weird

[zztophat]

I've owned dragons in the past, I don't own them any more.

Personally if I was going to run a fast moving heavy that didn't have JJs, I would go Orion.

Just load up smurfy in two separate tabs and compare an orion k against the flame to see why. While the dragon is the faster mech, in order to really move fast you have to make concessions to the loadout. Concession that raise the question: if you want a speedy agile high mounted ballistics platform why not just run a shadowhawk instead?

Edited by zztophat, 10 April 2014 - 03:24 AM.

[Armando]

Short Answer: NO
Long Answer: Everything the Dragon (any of them including the flame) can do, another mech can do it better.

[Silentium]

I think the Flame is the best Dragon, and has a good hardpoint layout. The high ballistic is nice, and arm mounted energy is a bonus as well.

[meteorol]

While it might not be the worst mech in general, dragons suffer from the same problem many older mechs do:
They are flat-out outclassed by the newer mechs in any possible way.

[Training Instructor]

I like the Flame, and got a lot of use out of it. Wish I'd bought an Ilya instead, because I had a lot of fun with the other Cataphract variants. The other dragons are not great, and you have to work pretty hard to be effective, due to low-slung everything and a larger than average CT.

[tucsonspeed6]

Easily one of my top three favorite mechs. The hitbox pass helped the dragon immensely, and its old stigma makes it a low priority in the field. It feels agile, and has the firepower and armor to back it up.

And I agree that it's a fast skirmisher. You won't be going toe to toe with anyone you meet. You'll be floating through the battlefield taking shots of opportunity as they come up and saving your teammates' butts. Think of it as what the hunchback wishes it was.

It's not for everyone, and it's definitely not meta. I think it's perfectly acceptable, though, if you solo PUG and are comfortable in mediums.

[Draal Kaan]

What the other gentlemen said...

I like it... Driving it with AC20 and 4 ML since ...dunno.... looooong time.
It is quite good. For a Dragon.

[Gevurah]

Don't forget the 4xLL build. Even though you sacrifice your predator shoulder cannon, the four arm mounted lasers do a fine job if fired in banks of two.

[Thejuggla]

If you want a fast Ac20 There's also the YLW. 300Xl also works in that mech and it probably spreads damage better than the dragon.

[operator0]

I have over 1200 drops in the Flame. I'm not saying I'm an expert, but 1200 drops gives me some credibility. Here's my opinion.

The Dragon chassis suffers from substandard hitbox issues. The CT is very easy to hit. The recent hitbox pass has made it slightly better, but at the expense of easier ST hits. Still, the Dragon runs XL engines as good as any mech in the game because your CT will take the vast majority of the damage. Overall though, it's a very fragile mech which is why most are steering you away from it.

Having said that, it is extremely maneuverable when paired with a big engine. This mech must be played differently then most mechs in the game. You cannot expose yourself to enemy fire for very long and you must always be cognizant of the position of you and the enemy. Do not get caught out alone. However, if you are fresh, know how to pilot and achieve the element of surprise, you can 1v1 slow assaults. It's simply so much faster and more maneuverable that they will generally only be able to get poor shots on you, and you should be able to core their back relatively quickly.

The Flame is the best Dragon, bar none. Yes, it does have the exact same hardpoints as the 1C, but they are in much better positions. That high mounted ballistic will open up a whole new plethora of shots you can take and hits you can make. The arm energy will allow you to track lights much more easily. While the Flame is no light fighter, you can generaly hold your own against one or two lights. The speed and maneuverability, combined with arm energy is a decent package to scare lights away. Don't go chasing lights though, because if you run into a few more heavier mechs, you are dead.

The loadout and tactic that I use gives me an average of 340 damage per match and a 1.8 KDR. That's not some over-inflated guess based on my recollection of the last few great matches that I've had, that's what the Stats page says.

Here's what I use and how I use it: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...3146518eca49518

1x Gauss 4 tons of ammo
4x ML
XL360

My initial game start tactic is to find a concealed place (usually a hill) that allows the Gauss to cover typical enemy approach routs. Then I start hill humping. The speed and high mounted ballistic hardpoint really makes this an effective tactic. Charge the Gauss before you start to peek over the hill. If you have a shot fire at the same time as you begin to back down the hill. I don't advise you to use the same part of the hill consistently. Stick and move, change it up, but keep pegging the enemy with that Gauss. If the friendly mechs have started to move off, you should move with them, but remember, you are about 30 to 40 KPH faster than them, so this gives you a little time and allows you to position yourself a little farther away from the main group if you feel the need.

When the match has started to devolve into more close combat, you must decide if you need to support you friends by bringing the ML to bear, which means moving in closer, or are you in a good enough position to continue using the Gauss to good effect. I generally will close in. At this point, if you've played your cards right, you should be one of the freshest mechs in the game, so you can afford to take some damage. Be a little aggressive, try a hit and run or a flank. Just understand that even though you are fresh, you are still fragile and it wont take long for multiple mechs to core you. Don't stand and duke it out with a whole enemy lance, even if they aren't very healthy. Use that speed to good effect.

This mech take practice, and lots of it. You will become a good mech driver, or you will get frustrated and stop playing the mech. No two ways about it. Make no mistake, this mech is a challenge, one not many players are willing to take on.

[3rdworld]

If you enjoy dragons, yes it is the best dragon.

Will you regret buying one after you start playing cataphracts......yes.

[Mechteric]

I like driving the Flame, but that CT hitbox is still just ungodly big and a huge disadvantage when piloting one.

3rdworld, on 10 April 2014 - 06:14 AM, said:

If you enjoy dragons, yes it is the best dragon.

Will you regret buying one after you start playing cataphracts......yes.

I would have to agree, if you really want a heavy hero, the Ilya Muromets is great and the Cataphracts are solid mechs.

[Gevurah]

1200 drops in one mech is no joke. I think my mech ADD limited me to 200 per mech or something

I used to just run like 5 points of rear CT armor and the rest in the front. Did fine after that. Didn't run gauss though after the gauss explosion fix because well.. ac40 jager's 1-shotting me sort of turned me off to that.

That said, it worked brilliant for firing over hills. I remember I got like 13th or so in the Heavy tournament for Dragons way back - I used this build:
1xUAC5
1xXL300
2xLL
2xML
I think 14DHS?

the uac5 over a hill worked better than it had a right to and then you'd use the LL's 90% of the time with the mediums as a 'finisher'. If it got too hot, I'd back off to the UAC5.

Anymore though I prefer an XL340 - seems 'just right' in a dragon.

I didn't like the AC20 + 4ML because I felt the CTF3D did it better due to JJ's. Ran well enough, I suppose. All comes down to play style.

[operator0]

Gevurah, on 10 April 2014 - 06:29 AM, said:

1200 drops in one mech is no joke. I think my mech ADD limited me to 200 per mech or something

I used to just run like 5 points of rear CT armor and the rest in the front. Did fine after that. Didn't run gauss though after the gauss explosion fix because well.. ac40 jager's 1-shotting me sort of turned me off to that.

That said, it worked brilliant for firing over hills. I remember I got like 13th or so in the Heavy tournament for Dragons way back - I used this build:
1xUAC5
1xXL300
2xLL
2xML
I think 14DHS?

the uac5 over a hill worked better than it had a right to and then you'd use the LL's 90% of the time with the mediums as a 'finisher'. If it got too hot, I'd back off to the UAC5.

Anymore though I prefer an XL340 - seems 'just right' in a dragon.

I didn't like the AC20 + 4ML because I felt the CTF3D did it better due to JJ's. Ran well enough, I suppose. All comes down to play style.

I have no quarrel with using a smaller engine, as long as the speed stays at about 100KPH or more. The XL350 is certainly a viable choice in my build as it gives you a few more heat sinks, which can come in handy, but my play style really does lend itself more towards speed and the accompanying maneuverability. I used to run the 4LL XL350 build before ghost heat. I tried it after that patch, but it just wasn't the same. I switched to the Gauss build and haven't looked back.