40 replies to this topic

[DjPush]

Why don't the developers remove ECM from the game? It has no purpose anymore. With all the things that are available to counter it, It no longer holds any weight on the battlefield. NARC, TAG, BAP, UAV..... Isn't the point of an ECM to counter enemy transmissions? So how can a NARC transmit if an ECM is active?

[lCXYl]

not remove, nerf

[Monkey Lover]

I last a lot longer in a ecm light than without one I been on teams without ecm's and the lrms ate us up.

Edited by Monkey Lover, 13 April 2014 - 04:38 AM.

[El Bandito]

DjPush, on 13 April 2014 - 04:15 AM, said:

Why don't the developers remove ECM from the game? It has no purpose anymore. With all the things that are available to counter it, It no longer holds any weight on the battlefield. NARC, TAG, BAP, UAV..... Isn't the point of an ECM to counter enemy transmissions? So how can a NARC transmit if an ECM is active?

It's basically PGI's fault for making ECM a non-canon overpowered piece of shit in the first place. Since it was so overpowered, PGI invented other bunch of non-canon piece of shit counter measures to the ECM, resulting this non-canon piece of shit mess.

Sometimes I wonder if I am still playing a Mechwarrior game or not...especially after their recent attempt to mess with the AC5 and AC2.

Edited by El Bandito, 13 April 2014 - 04:40 AM.

[King Arthur IV]

so you can stand out in the open for me to tag you.

Edited by King Arthur IV, 13 April 2014 - 04:41 AM.

[Silentium]

I don't know the intended result of ECM implementation, but I can see that the side-effect has been endless forum rage. I include myself in that category; this was months ago though, and I have since learned to just live with it.

[Vellinious]

Your tears.....they are delicious

[LoneMaverick]

Since ECM is the end-all be-all anti everything that it's been made to be, for 1.5tons, why shouldn't there be a couple counters to it?

The problem is that ECM in and of itself is overpowered, and has functions way above and beyond what it should have. This is why now there are even more convoluted systems needed to counter it.

[Daekar]

The point of ECM was to create an easy way out on information warfare when they didn't have the time or knowledge to plan and implement it properly. It was broken at release, and is still broken now, albeit less so.

The game is playable as it is even though ECM essentially removes missiles from competitive play and makes them unreliable at other times. It makes balancing missiles impossible, because any time missiles get good people flee back to their ECM mechs despite the fact that they're sick of being forced to drop in them, and it's the luck of the draw whether or not your missile mech is effective or useless on any given drop.

It's a bad mechanic and far too powerful for its weight and size, especially considering it doesn't take up a weapon hardpoint. Still, as I've been told, they're not going to change it, so I just recommend people never use missiles as a primary weapon while pugging and forget about it. All direct fire weapons are reliable under ECM conditions, and SRMs might make missile hardpoints actually useful if they can fix the hitreg issues in the next patch or two.

[Mystere]

What's will all the new anti-ECM threads lately? Things were quiet on this front just several weeks ago. Did we just get an influx of new players, or did current players suddenly turn into eunuchs?

ECM is fine. So what if it's "easy mode" for the other side? (And why are the complainers always talking about the "other" side when no one is stopping them from using it too?)

ECM on the enemy team forces you to find ways to deal with it. So, deal with it. Others have, a long long time ago. Why not you, especially because it is apparently not going away anytime soon?

My own solution to the ECM "situation" is to specialize with ECM hunter-killers. And I can say that it is fun doing so.

Edited by Mystere, 13 April 2014 - 06:53 AM.

[Daekar]

Mystere, on 13 April 2014 - 06:50 AM, said:

What's will all the new anti-ECM threads lately? Things were quiet on this front just several weeks ago. Did we just get an influx of new players, or did current players suddenly turn into eunuchs?

ECM is fine. So what if it's "easy mode" for the other side? (And why are the complainers always talking about the "other" side when no one is stopping them from using it too?)

ECM on the enemy team forces you to find ways to deal with it. So, deal with it. Others have,a long long time ago. Why not you?

There are still ECM threads because it's not fine. Still, I agree that in the absence of change the best course is to just deal with it - hence my recommendation about relegating missiles to secondary weapons only. Maybe someday things will be different, but not for now.

[Macbrea]

How are these items not cannon?

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Guardian_ECM
http://www.sarna.net..._Missile_Beacon
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Beagle_Probe

They seems to work similar to how the fluff states they are supposed to work.

[Mavairo]

Macbrea, on 13 April 2014 - 06:56 AM, said:

How are these items not cannon?

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Guardian_ECM
http://www.sarna.net..._Missile_Beacon
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Beagle_Probe

They seems to work similar to how the fluff states they are supposed to work.

Because those items help kill them. Therefore they are OP and Not Canon

[Daekar]

Macbrea, on 13 April 2014 - 06:56 AM, said:

How are these items not cannon?

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Guardian_ECM
http://www.sarna.net..._Missile_Beacon
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Beagle_Probe

They seems to work similar to how the fluff states they are supposed to work.

They do - similarly, and that's it. It's their relationship to ECM that is totally different. You can include TAG in the list as well. There are others who articulated the issues far better than I can in the thread I started on the topic recently. If you want to understand, I suggest you read up a bit further.

[Amsro]

Macbrea, on 13 April 2014 - 06:56 AM, said:

How are these items not cannon?

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Guardian_ECM
http://www.sarna.net..._Missile_Beacon
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Beagle_Probe

They seems to work similar to how the fluff states they are supposed to work.

Couple things;

"Contemporary guided missiles such as standard LRM or Streak SRMs are not affected by the Guardian suite and will be able to achieve hard lock as normal"

So unless your enemy has Artemis, your shit out of luck those missiles are still coming.

"Guardian is typically used to shield allied units from such equipment by emitting a broad-band signal meant to confuse radar, infrared, ultraviolet, magscan and sonar sensors"

As it stands ECM does none of that, doesn't confuse my radar, infrafed is nil effected, UV nope.

So as it stands ECM is completely off the mark. But truly that can just be added to the list of Wha Happened?

Ghost Heat
ECM
Heat Cap
Double Armor
Frontloaded Damage
Pinpoint, perfect convergence
Hit Detection
Terrible Weapon Balance
Confusing Mechlab
Nerfed Team Play
....


I'm sure there are many things I missed. It is all par for the course, you only think this is a MechWarrior game, when truly it is PaulRussWarriorOnline. With a MechWarriorSkinMod.

Edited by Amsro, 13 April 2014 - 07:11 AM.

[El Bandito]

Macbrea, on 13 April 2014 - 06:56 AM, said:

How are these items not cannon? http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Guardian_ECM http://www.sarna.net..._Missile_Beacon http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Beagle_Probe They seems to work similar to how the fluff states they are supposed to work.

1. GECM in MWO is implemented as AECM, which is not even supposed to be in the current timeline--therefore non-canon.

2. NARC and BAP are suppose to be countered by GECM, not the other way around--therefore non-canon.

Any other questions?

[Mystere]

El Bandito, on 13 April 2014 - 07:08 AM, said:

1. GECM in MWO is implemented as AECM, which is not even supposed to be in the current timeline--therefore non-canon.

2. NARC and BAP are suppose to be countered by GECM, not the other way around--therefore non-canon.

Any other questions?

I call that "creative license".

Seriously though, did all previous Mechwarrior games strictly adhere to canon?

Edited by Mystere, 13 April 2014 - 07:15 AM.

[DocBach]

Mystere, on 13 April 2014 - 07:14 AM, said:

I call that "creative license".

Seriously though, did all previous Mechwarrior games strictly adhere to canon?

Mystere, on 13 April 2014 - 07:14 AM, said:

I call that "creative license".

Seriously though, did all previous Mechwarrior games strictly adhere to canon?

I'd say MWO is about on par with MW3 as being the most lore compliant offering.

However, ECM and information warfare as a whole is pretty out of whack, due to the free to play nature of the game - instead of getting information from the c-bill source that is suppose to do all the things all of the radar modules do (Beagle Active Probe), you have to spend either a month of game time or spend real money for GXP to unlock them, or purchase consumables which becomes a money sink to encourage players spending real money on other items.

[DaisuSaikoro Nagasawa]

I have talked to my great-grandmother at great lengths about this, and she agrees that me being a Founder I have more right than anyone else to say this, but the ONLY REASON we NEED ECM (in the game today) is that TAG IS OP!

Remove (or nuff) TAG or DON'T BUT YOU SHOULD REMOVE TAG PGI! You are RUINING the game by not REMOVING TAG (as evidenced by the many threads concerning TAG being OP)!!!!

Edited by Daisu Saikoro, 13 April 2014 - 07:40 AM.

[OznerpaG]

i play pretty much only LRM boats and ECM doesn't bother me - just takes longer to lock on. otherwise ECM mechs get the same rain of death every other mech gets from me