470 replies to this topic

[Cimarb]

aniviron, on 17 April 2014 - 01:26 PM, said:

So, a thought?

Why not have sized ballistic hardpoints like we have sized missile hardpoints?

Sure, you can put an AC20 on the locust, but because the biggest bore it can normally fit is an AC2, it comes out as a quick burst of 10 shells for 20 damage. Yeah, go ahead and upgrade that autocannon, just be aware that it will have to fire in bursts if the maximum bore size is too small to pop out the full shell.

This method lets mechs that have huge vulnerable mounting points for their ballistics like the Hunchback and Atlas retain some advantage for that vulnerability, while people sticking huge ballistics in machinegun mounts are going to have to settle for burstfire.

Not only does this diversify mech roles, it helps keep them closer to stock, which emphasizes each mech having a unique role and reason to use it, instead of everything getting a homogenous loadout.

Bishop Steiner, on 17 April 2014 - 01:19 PM, said:

same PPC, extra armor removed, on 30, 35 and 50 ton game models.

Bishop Steiner, on 17 April 2014 - 01:26 PM, said:

lolz, no. I just ran the weapon against the Mechlab Models which are in proportion to one another.

Though speaking of Proportion, gosh, look how much bigger the 35 ton FS9 is than the 30 ton itsy bitsy SPider.....

BTW, the proportions of the PPC on the S9 looks about perfect to me for a brawling Panther.

I would be so much happier if that was how they looked...

Btw, I never noticed how stocky the FS was... That's one stout little mech! After all the uproar about the TimberWolf's chunk, I can't believe no one complained about the originally-scarecrow-turned-linebacker FS...
For reference:

Edited by Cimarb, 17 April 2014 - 01:38 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

aniviron, on 17 April 2014 - 01:31 PM, said:

Well of COURSE the FS9 is big; would you have Coventry Metal Works pumping out tiny little mechs instead? I won't hear of it!

Somewhat more seriously, I think the design on the FS9/SDR would be just about perfect there if you replaced the lower arm with the PPC; you lose the hand, but keep the lower actuator. That's a good tradeoff, and attractive, too. I also don't think there's anything wrong with having two energy weapons firing from a single barrel; unlike with chemically powered weapons, barrel heat and wear is not an issue, the drawback is the energy firing mechanism from within.

or make em pay "the tax"

you wanna be ridiculous and have 1/3 your mech hanging there, you get the huge hitbox to go with it. (And hey, while the arm is now an easy target, it's protecting the torso quite nice.)

[Jin Ma]

they RUINED one of the best looking mechs in the game

[Bishop Steiner]

Jin Ma, on 17 April 2014 - 02:21 PM, said:

they RUINED one of the best looking mechs in the game

You got no clue.

Even on nights where I kept getting CT cored and couldn't fight my way out of a paper bag, I kept rolling back to my K2 for the sheer joy of driving that beautiful, predatory looking beast.

Now it looks like I got Baby Bottles of Lightning on each shoulder. Oh. How fearsome.

[Prezimonto]

I've been thinking about this overly huge weapons for a while. One that that could be done is to put a cap on total % tonnage in any mech location other than the CT. Call it a gyro issue. Certain mechs can get quirks to make these values go up or down, if they're designed to hold a large percentage in a specific location.

Base it on the mech's overall structure type
Humanoid thin (HT)--must stay upright gyros work harder to balance the mech, tonnage must be more centrally located without adaptations
Humanoid wide (HW)-- heavier more balanced structures to the sides of the mech make carrying heavy arm loads easier.
Retrograde thin (RT)-- easier to carry arm mounts that a humanoid mech on the arms, harder on the legs
Retrograde wide(RW)-- most able to carry peripheral weapons mounts

A HT 35 ton mech might have a maximum weight distribution profile of
RL/RA/RT/CT/LT/LA/LL
6 / 10/ 15/--/ 20/15/10%
2 / 3.5/ 5/ -- / 5/ 3.5 / 2 tons

A HW 35 ton mech might have a maximum weight distribution profile of
RL/RA/RT/CT/LT/LA/LL
10/ 15/ 20/--/ 20/15/10%
3.5/ 5/ 7/ -- / 7/ 5 / 3.5 tons

A mech like the Hunchback would get a special mech quirk that allows the AC20 tonnage into the right torso: it pays for that ability with a huge profile.

[Garegaupa]

I agree that the old PPC version looks better than the new one. You've got my vote, Bishop Steiner!

[Simbacca]

I agree - I want the huge PPC barrels back for the K2 - that was part of the appeal when I bought it in Beta. Those big PPC barrels just make the Catapult-K2 look more vicious !

[Bishop Steiner]

Simbacca, on 17 April 2014 - 02:40 PM, said:

I agree - I want the huge PPC barrels back for the K2 - that was part of the appeal when I bought it in Beta. Those big PPC barrels just make the Catapult-K2 look more vicious !

maybe all the people who bought it before the change can start filing for a belated refund because it is no the mech we bought.
Mechanics aside, one can buy something for many reasons, and looks are indeed a legit one.

[Koniving]

Bishop Steiner, on 16 April 2014 - 07:43 PM, said:

Thank you for your support.

From PGI's perspective, it was fix almost every mech (except the Awesome)... or do this to the Catapult. Sorry Catapult, but you got the vivisection. *Snip.*

[Bishop Steiner]

Koniving, on 17 April 2014 - 03:44 PM, said:

From PGI's perspective, it was fix almost every mech (except the Awesome)... or do this to the Catapult. Sorry Catapult, but you got the vivisection. *Snip.*

oddly, since they had to manually go in and do it, it really wasn't an "us or them" scenario. They could have left it well enough alone and I am all but certain no one would have complained.

[Hillslam]

NEAH!!! THOU SHALT HAVE

NO BIG CANNONS!

Those emasculating little girly PPCs are your punishment

for hiding Gauss rifles up your MG ports!

Bow down and beg for forgiveness, vile charlatans and sinners!

Repent! and be thankful for the chance to pay for your closed beta misdeeds!

Bow down! Bowww, foul deceivers and sneakers of large ballistics!

Kneel before Zod!

KNEEEEEEEL!!!

Edited by Hillslam, 17 April 2014 - 04:01 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Hillslam, on 17 April 2014 - 03:51 PM, said:

Those emasculating eensy teensy PPCs are your punishment for hiding Gauss rifles up your MG ports.
Bow down and beg for forgiveness, vile charlatans and sinners!
Repent! and be thankful for the chance to pay for your CB misdeeds!

OK, bowing and scraping done, now, "Let my People GO!"

[zagibu]

I wonder if it would be possible to replace the new barrels with the old client side without triggering cheat detection.

[Koniving]

Bishop Steiner, on 17 April 2014 - 03:51 PM, said:

oddly, since they had to manually go in and do it, it really wasn't an "us or them" scenario. They could have left it well enough alone and I am all but certain no one would have complained.

I complained, a lot. The AC/20 and AC/2 on the Blackjack are identically sized. The UAC/5's barrels on the blackjack are smaller than the machine gun barrels.

The entire UAC/5 on a Firestarter is smaller than the the AC/2 barrel on a Blackjack.
Shadowhawk gets a PPC as small as its own AC/2 barrel. But a Kintaro, a mech of the same weight, gets a PPC as HUGE as the AC/20 barrel on the Shadowhawk.

There is absolutely no consistency anywhere in the weapon sizes.

Mind you I liked the old size but I felt every mech had to fit that or that shouldn't be done.

Next thing we know, that's how the Catapult turned out. Not that it's specifically all on me. But yeah.

Some weapon comparisons.

Edited by Koniving, 17 April 2014 - 04:08 PM.

[Captain Stiffy]

The catapult was utterly and completely crapped on geometry-wise. A massive WTF to bolting extra missile launchers onto the outside OF THE ALREADY HUGE MISSILE LAUNCHERS.

It's like the shrink ray gun from the venture brothers that has a picture of a shrink ray gun on it.

DEVS: TELL ME SPECIFICALLY WHAT YOU THOUGHT THE LARGE BOXES ON THE SIDES OF THE CATAPULT WERE FOR?

HINT: NOT SRM 6'S! The FIVE launcher is for arrows, you ninnies!

Edited by Captain Stiffy, 17 April 2014 - 04:15 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Koniving, on 17 April 2014 - 04:06 PM, said:

I complained, a lot. The AC/20 and AC/2 on the Blackjack are identically sized. The UAC/5's barrels on the blackjack are smaller than the machine gun barrels.

The entire UAC/5 on a Firestarter is smaller than the the AC/2 barrel on a Blackjack.
Shadowhawk gets a PPC as small as its own AC/2 barrel. But a Kintaro, a mech of the same weight, gets a PPC as HUGE as the AC/20 barrel on the Shadowhawk.

There is absolutely no consistency anywhere in the weapon sizes.

Mind you I liked the old size but I felt every mech had to fit that or that shouldn't be done.

Next thing we know, that's how the Catapult turned out. Not that it's specifically all on me. But yeah.

Some weapon comparisons.

Not what I meant. I meant that it's not like they changed the weapon model and BAM! Every model is affected. Some were egregious. But they had to go in and consciously change each and every one. And at some point, some DERP decided that PPC Nipples were teh way to go on the K2.

But in cases like the K2, would ANYONE have complained about the PPCs? The had already done a needed geometry pass for the ballistics (you will notice the torso lasers are STILL the original ones).


Oh, and now, the weapons are worse sized, across the board, then ever. Look at the PPCs on a frikkin FS9.

[Smitti]

K2 was the first Stompy I ever purchased. How I miss those chunky barrels...

Bishop Steiner, on 16 April 2014 - 07:52 PM, said:

you could add more by "liking" this post. The fools gave us back a wide open GenDis. Let's start a threadnaught. We cannot correct all the injustices of MWO, but we could at least have some beauty restored to our lives.
https://twitter.com/...640773216141312

Started a twitter account just for this

Edited by Smittiferous, 17 April 2014 - 04:25 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Koniving, on 17 April 2014 - 04:06 PM, said:

weapon comparos

check THIS compàrison. Mech lab, Model to Model.


GG, PGI, Close!

[Sigilum Sanctum]

Wow the K2 got gimped....those original barrels look intimidating as hell. What happened D:

[Bishop Steiner]

Sigilum Sanctum, on 17 April 2014 - 04:42 PM, said:

Wow the K2 got gimped....those original barrels look intimidating as hell. What happened D:

And THAT, would be the 5 Million Dollar question.
(Founders will know the 5 mil reference)