24 replies to this topic

[Fooooo]

RedDragon, on 21 April 2014 - 02:05 AM, said:

Wait a minute... since we all started with the same Elo, how could the system have started to work in the first place? When every player has an Elo of 500, the team's mean Elo will be 500, so no matter if they win or lose to another team of 500, there won't be an adjustment... so, if they calculate Elo in relation to Elo and not based on the sole number of your w/l-ratio, how the hell does that work?
(I wouldn't by surprised if no one at PGI caught this and we were playing with our start-Elo ever since )

I think if the averaged elo is the same for both teams then whichever wins gains a slight increase to elo. Not as much as if the winning side had lower average elo, but still some....otherwise the situation you stated would happen...(if they reset elo that is...)

At the start we were all given an elo based on past wins and losses I think, so they never would have faced the problem anyway.

[EgoSlayer]

RedDragon, on 21 April 2014 - 02:05 AM, said:

Wait a minute... since we all started with the same Elo, how could the system have started to work in the first place? When every player has an Elo of 500, the team's mean Elo will be 500, so no matter if they win or lose to another team of 500, there won't be an adjustment... so, if they calculate Elo in relation to Elo and not based on the sole number of your w/l-ratio, how the hell does that work?
(I wouldn't by surprised if no one at PGI caught this and we were playing with our start-Elo ever since )

Actually, if both teams are equally rated there will be a 25 point elo change for each team. According to the elo equation the P₀ number is 0.5 for equally matched teams and with a maximum change value of 50 that means a 25 point change each team for a total of 50 points.

Edited by EgoSlayer, 21 April 2014 - 07:41 AM.

[Iskareot]

Roadbeer, on 20 April 2014 - 11:28 AM, said:

Magic space cats with pizza. That's how Elo and the Matchmaker work in MWO.

I can't find a better explanation, even from the Devs.

I agree with Beer... or I could add the comment.. "I do not even think the Dev team does"... or at least what it plays out like in real drops.

I tend to wonder if they do. The MM System either... some how, I end up in a drop with a 2 day old player.. and that is not good at all. SURE I WANT TO PUG... but damn at least a week or so long player would be good.

[Roadkill]

Appogee, on 20 April 2014 - 11:56 AM, said:

Thanks Strum Wealh, much appreciated.

For those who want a summary:

• At the start of a match, each of the two team's average Elo rating is calculated (ie the sum of each of the team's players' Elo ratings, divided by 12).
  
• If the team with the higher average Elo wins, then no player's Elo is adjusted.
  
• However, if the team with the lower average Elo wins, then the players on the winning team have their Elos adjusted up, and the players on the losing team have their Elos adjusted down.
  
• The amount of Elo adjustment is in proportion to the gap between the two team averages. That is, if a team which has a much lower average Elo beats a team with a much higher average Elo, then each player's Elo will be adjusted by a greater amount ... to a maximum adjustment of +/- 50.
  
• Your individual performance - your score, the number of kills or assists you personally made - make zero difference to your Elo rating. Only your team's performance can result in an adjustment to your Elo.

The part in italics is the problem.

That is indeed how PGI explained their implementation of their rating system.

The problem is that that's not how an Elo system works. In an Elo system, your rating always changes after a match. It just changes less if the expected result occurred.

If the linked explanation from PGI is actually how they implemented the rating system, then it's completely borked and not an Elo system.

Edited by Roadkill, 21 April 2014 - 08:23 AM.

[Corbon Zackery]

The part in italics is the problem.

That is indeed how PGI explained their implementation of their rating system.

The problem is that that's not how an Elo system works. In an Elo system, your rating always changes after a match. It just changes less if the expected result occurred.

If the linked explanation from PGI is actually how they implemented the rating system, then it's completely borked and not an Elo system.

We think your ELO score is set in the first match of play. That's why you get so many bad first matches. Like I said ELO doesn't factor in mech tonnage that's why you matches with 8 firebrands.