846 replies to this topic

[Koniving]

SirLANsalot, on 31 May 2014 - 01:03 PM, said:

Your comparing Apples to Oranges there.

MW:T is the Table Top 3025 game, basically as if the game just launched. Same rules and flow just like as if you were playing the TT. The Card Aspect is just a way to "collect" or salvage enemy mechs/weapons ect.

MW:O is a FIRST PERSON (not lance based) game BASED on Battletech and is set in the year 3050. TT is setup to be with multiple mechs controlled by one "person" (you), hence why the firing system (dice roll) works for that game. Here you have REAL LIVE humans behind the controls, and RNG....we hate RNG.


Two completely different games made by two completely different company's with different outlooks. Both are being published by IGP since there the ones now holding the license to the MW name.

No one's asked for random number generators. We don't have any either.

If anything, the post was emphasizing that they had the lack of RNG when it came down to the core gameplay. 30 threshold means a limit to boating without ghost heat. 3 PPCs? Shutdown. 2 PPCs? Fine. 1 ER PPC (which after the AC nerfs will be the second longest ranged weapon in the game) is safe but 2 ER PPCs = shutdown. 2 AC/20s with a burst fire mechanic would be fine. 2 AC/20s as they are now + ghost heat means instant shutdown with 30 threshold, preventing the pinpoint of 40 damage.

Just that alone would make this game significantly more balanced. Top of 7 ML if you are not moving! Clan ER ML would be even more restricted by their heat, and ironically enough they do about equal damage with 30 threshold even with fewer ER ML being fired!

They have a sized hardpoint system; something begged for here.

They have no need for double armor, an AC/2 does 2 damage in 10 seconds. An AC/20 does 20 damage. Add a damage over time mechanic here where a laser would do 5 damage in 10 seconds, a Gauss Rifle 15 in 10 seconds, and we wouldn't have such a need either even with perfect pinpoint.

In fact, even with perfect pinpoint we might stand to have a reduction in armor values from 1x, instead of the "2x isn't enough" crap we have now with 1 AC/20 hitting 60 damage in 8 seconds and a UAC/20 able to do 140 damage in 10 seconds if it doesn't jam.

Even something this simple would work to alleviate pinpoint issues without random number generators as the mech's own movements determine how the crosshair moves; thus you can control it. Meanwhile the pinpoint is 100% pinpoint, provided you have the skill to time your shot to exactly where you want it. (Gif warning)

Spoiler

[SirLANsalot]

Koniving, on 31 May 2014 - 01:23 PM, said:

No one's asked for random number generators. We don't have any either.

If anything, the post was emphasizing that they had the lack of RNG when it came down to the core gameplay. 30 threshold means a limit to boating without ghost heat. 3 PPCs? Shutdown. 2 PPCs? Fine. 1 ER PPC (which after the AC nerfs will be the second longest ranged weapon in the game) is safe but 2 ER PPCs = shutdown. 2 AC/20s with a burst fire mechanic would be fine. 2 AC/20s as they are now + ghost heat means instant shutdown with 30 threshold, preventing the pinpoint of 40 damage.

Just that alone would make this game significantly more balanced. Top of 7 ML if you are not moving! Clan ER ML would be even more restricted by their heat, and ironically enough they do about equal damage with 30 threshold even with fewer ER ML being fired!

They have a sized hardpoint system; something begged for here.

They have no need for double armor, an AC/2 does 2 damage in 10 seconds. An AC/20 does 20 damage. Add a damage over time mechanic here where a laser would do 5 damage in 10 seconds, a Gauss Rifle 15 in 10 seconds, and we wouldn't have such a need either even with perfect pinpoint.

In fact, even with perfect pinpoint we might stand to have a reduction in armor values from 1x, instead of the "2x isn't enough" crap we have now with 1 AC/20 hitting 60 damage in 8 seconds and a UAC/20 able to do 140 damage in 10 seconds if it doesn't jam.

Even something this simple would work to alleviate pinpoint issues without random number generators as the mech's own movements determine how the crosshair moves; thus you can control it. Meanwhile the pinpoint is 100% pinpoint, provided you have the skill to time your shot to exactly where you want it. (Gif warning)

Spoiler

Thing is any major changes like that will make a lot of people not very happy, and most will leave because it will be too much of a nerf.

Example of a major mechanic change like that?

The UAC5. Not many will remember back when it DIDN'T jam, but since it didn't jam no one used the AC5 unless they couldn't fit another UAC in (like the Dragons were amazing with UAC/AC5 combos back then). Then they started to add in the jam, first few renditions of how to unjam were kinda...odd. Then we went to what we have today, but it still feels "off" to those of us who used to play with it when it had no jam.

Doing mechanic changes like that leave a bad taste of the game in the players mouths, because we knew "what it was like before" said changes happened. Now the UAC change wasn't uberly game breaking, and neither was ghost heat (its not as evil of a system most people make it out to be) which was applied to too many weapons when it was designed to only stop a few (aka the PPC/LL boating).


Adding any random anything, even if its controllable, is not what PGI wants for this game, and it will never happen because of that. Do I want ghost heat changed and removed from certain weapons? Absolutely, will it ever happen? Maybe, but at least I know PGI isn't 100% set against changes to that system. Where as with CoF or Heat Based inaccuracy or movement based, PGI doesn't want to put that in, plus they already have stated that the game itself cannot do it either (with the way this games been written it cannot be done). Also it feels good when you take a shot and it lands right where you wanted it to, rather then the game saying "nope it missed because you were not standing still" or "nope you missed because you were running too hot". It also brings the human element into the game more, by making your shots your own responsibility, if you missed, its your own damn fault you missed.



There are ways to increase TTK without touching accuracy or weapon cool downs or anything (again things that HURT the player base and game play). You CAN increase the armor values again, and increase the internal HP of the mechs. It "bends" the base rules of TT (which this game isn't) but makes for better game play within MWO itself. Adding more HP for enemy's to chew though will greatly increase TTK without changing any major components of the game. It also would slightly shift the "meta" as it were, toward more DPS weapons and less alpha guns. Thus giving the game that slug fest feel that it lacks right now.

[mongo2006]

shad0w4life, on 28 May 2014 - 02:38 PM, said:

Jealous much?

LOL not going to get into my finances but I do well in real estate.. To put $500.00 into perspective that's lunch for 2 loan officers a city alderman that i'm bribing and myself.. depends on the wine.. then i'll write it off on taxes and YOU get to pay for it.. I digress, the point is $500 is nothing for some (included) but there was a time in a far, far universe where $500 would have taken many months for me to save $500 for a game.

My point is simple if the makers of this game get comfortable with selling mechs for $500 a pop they will eventually raise the prices on everything else.

Edited by mongo2006, 01 June 2014 - 12:10 AM.

[SirLANsalot]

mongo2006, on 01 June 2014 - 12:00 AM, said:

LOL not going to get into my finances but I do well in real estate.. To put $500.00 into perspective that's lunch for 2 loan officers a city alderman that i'm bribing and myself.. depends on the wine.. then i'll write it off on taxes and YOU get to pay for it.. I digress, the point is $500 is nothing for some (included) but there was a time in a far, far universe where $500 would have taken many months for me to save $500 for a game.

My point is simple if the makers of this game get comfortable with selling mechs for $500 a pop they will eventually raise the prices on everything else.

This is also probably a one time thing being at the 500 mark. It is labeled for the most loyal of Kerensky followers after-all.

I would assume that most packages coming in the later years will be, at most, 200ish as this 240 is the most mechs offered in one package, so far. 120 was Phoenix but that was only like 16 mechs total, and the re-enforcement package was another 6 for another 50 bucks. The Masakari package is 240 for 24 mechs (eg 10 bucks a mech) but these are no ordinary mechs, these are CLAN mechs, and were getting them CHEAP!

[Saber1]

Please watch before you consider buying:



It's so sad how simple it is to avoid all of this.

[Azure Kit]

Kaptain, on 25 April 2014 - 11:03 AM, said:

UGH.

Can't wait to kill the PGI Zealots in their shinny overpriced toys.

UGH

Can't wait to record it and send it along with the reports of CoC violations.
As someone on a previous page put it, you're keying a Ferrari because you can't afford it/don't want it.
I plan on returning fire on people that try and attack the people in gold. Let them have their toys.

[BLOOD WOLF]

Saber1, on 01 June 2014 - 11:09 AM, said:

Please watch before you consider buying:



It's so sad how simple it is to avoid all of this.

PGI!!!, watch this guys video's.

[Buckminster]

Saber1, on 01 June 2014 - 11:09 AM, said:

Please watch before you consider buying:



It's so sad how simple it is to avoid all of this.

For all the things PGI has done wrong with some of their pricing models, I think that they have done some things very right - they have not monetized power, and they have not divided the pay and free players. People may complain that $500 is too much, and that mech prices are too much, blah blah blah. The fact is that no one has to pay for any of it. The only thing you *need* actual cash for it extra mechbays, which you don't strictly need to play, and don't have any impact on the itself.

[White Bear 84]

Pyrrho, on 28 May 2014 - 02:33 PM, said:

*clicks on "Sold Out" Gold Timberwolf; is asked to input credit card information*

Anyone dare to test out if you can buy the sold out item?

Pyrrho, I think you should take one for the team..

Buckminster, on 28 May 2014 - 08:07 AM, said:

Honestly, I don't understand all the hate towards people that are willing to drop $500 on the game. If you think the game is second rate and not worth the money, don't spend it.

Haters gonna hate..

Probably because of at least one of the following; 1. Jealous of disposable income or 2. Hating on players that are giving money to PGI when a select few are trying to get players to stop supporting PGI (which ironically enough would be counter productive towards producing a better game..)

mongo2006, on 22 May 2014 - 01:16 PM, said:

The way I see it.. anyone that spends $500 for a gold mech in a 2nd rate game needs to be shot on site.. even their own team mates need to unload on them.

Really, do explain why.

I for one do not see the value in the $500 gold mechs, nor would I be willing to part with that much $$ for a game. But anyone else that does is entitled to do so if they so choose.. ..that said I reserve my right to my own judgement but will not openly judge others on any decision they make.

[Alaskan Nobody]

Marack Drock, on 01 June 2014 - 07:21 PM, said:

For some reason I have the sneaky suspicion that all 50 of the mechs will still be there when time runs out.

White Bear 84, on 01 June 2014 - 07:39 PM, said:

Pyrrho, I think you should take one for the team..

I checked

No I do not have the money to do it with.

However - the TW Gold package is the only one that doesn't pop up the menu to buy it when you click on it.


In other words - no more Gold TW for sale!

[Gattsus]

I wonder if Golden mech players will get harassed and bullied because of spending so much money on a skin.

[Alaskan Nobody]

Gattsus, on 02 June 2014 - 11:46 AM, said:

I wonder if Golden mech players will get harassed and bullied because of spending so much money on a skin.

Almost guaranteed some people will.

After all, there are people who harass the Founders and Phoenix players for their purchases.

Only question(s) will be how many, how frequently, and whether the harassees will use the proper channels to deal with it.

[Jetfire]

Bought a Gold TW because I wanted to thank the Devs for sticking to the timeline for private matches. Stock mech battles and duels have been a blast. I didn't buy it for the value or even because I wanted the skin but simply to show that I as a customer appreciate the new direction the company has taken since their low point at launch and to show them that if they keep at it and deliver what we all have been asking for, there is money in it for them.

[Heffay]

Jason Vile, on 01 June 2014 - 06:15 PM, said:

Can't wait to record it and send it along with the reports of CoC violations.
As someone on a previous page put it, you're keying a Ferrari because you can't afford it/don't want it.
I plan on returning fire on people that try and attack the people in gold. Let them have their toys.

Don't return fire on people who shoot gold mechs. They'll be reported anyway (heck, why else would you GET a gold mech other than to pvp other people's accounts??), and you don't want to get caught up in the account actions.

[Chiasson Brinker]

I still wonder whether or not some people remember that the Khan packages include the Masakari package as well? That $500 also goes into supporting the game and the costs inherent in running it. I understand that people are sore over unkept promises and broken timelines, but the simple fact of the matter, is that without the support, this game ends. No more Mechwarrior Online. If you don't agree with the price, don't buy into it. It really is that simple. I can't help but wonder if there's an element of jealousy involved in all the griping over pricing. And our own $500 aside, has everyone forgotten the $15000 packages for Star Citizen?

**edited for spelling

Edited by Aidan Kell, 02 June 2014 - 03:08 PM.

[Kitty Bacon]

Aidan Kell, on 02 June 2014 - 02:09 PM, said:

I still wonder whether or not some people remember that the Khan packages include the Masakai package as well? That $500 also goes into supporting the game and the costs inherent in running it. I understand that people are sore over unkept promises and broken timelines, but the simple fact of the matter, is that without the support, this game ends. No more Mechwarrior Online. If you don't agree with the price, don't buy into it. It really is that simple. I can't help but wonder if there's an element of jealousy involved in all the griping over pricing. And our own $500 aside, has everyone forgotten the $15000 packages for Star Citizen?

And lets not forget it has already had launch failures with missed deadlines. Those people who paid hundreds, maybe even thousands on Star Citizen did not get what they wanted. Least in MWO, they have missed very little deadlines, none when money is on the line.

Edited by Blue doqyn, 02 June 2014 - 02:34 PM.

[White Bear 84]

Shar Wolf, on 02 June 2014 - 11:49 AM, said:

After all, there are people who harass the Founders and Phoenix players for their purchases.

Only question(s) will be how many, how frequently, and whether the harassees will use the proper channels to deal with it.

I wear my in game founders tags with pride. Same on the forums. Got a problem, bite me

Usually down to some kind of inferiority complex, aint got no time for that...

[Alaskan Nobody]

White Bear 84, on 02 June 2014 - 03:28 PM, said:

Got a problem, bite me

Only reason I don't wear my Phoenix Tag in game is cause I have been too lazy to keep turning it on.

[DocBach]

Blue doqyn, on 02 June 2014 - 02:32 PM, said:

And lets not forget it has already had launch failures with missed deadlines. Those people who paid hundreds, maybe even thousands on Star Citizen did not get what they wanted. Least in MWO, they have missed very little deadlines, none when money is on the line.

PGI's gotten better about communication and deadlines recently, but when this game was being crowdfunded with the founders packs we were promised to be deep into Community Warfare by now.

[White Bear 84]

Shar Wolf, on 02 June 2014 - 03:29 PM, said:

Only reason I don't wear my Phoenix Tag in game is cause I have been too lazy to keep turning it on.

If only we got a tag for buying the clan package, id flaunt that sexy purchase.

(Yup, im caving. I know enough about the clan mech design, do not want to wait 3 months to get the good and do not want to grind to get 18 mechs.)

Of course this doesn't retract from the fact that the information presented on clans is all over the place - it is only through researching a number of threads that I have got complete info as currently communicated.