292 replies to this topic

[Ol Dirty Bastard]

Why not make a hardcore and a casual queue? I know several games that use a "Ranked vs Unranked" queue system, formatting the selections to a similar fashion could be beneficial. Using ranked/unranked wouldn't work, because despite the outcries, ELO is working at least decently and should remain in use, even with a "hardcore/casual" Queue system.

There are huge issues getting 3x4 and 1 group per team, we all know this is a major development issue, and keeps being pushed back farther and farther. I personally like the 3x4 idea, but hate the 1 group per team idea. I feel that many also hate the 1 group per side restriction, and the gameplay that would come with it. Many of us would like to see larger group sizes allowed, and to be matched equally with grouped players of roughly equal skill. There is also a large divide between players of skill, and those without, ie: meta players and the idealists.

There are several complaints of meta groups farming up the solo newbs or non meta groups, and this is a big cause of dissatisfaction for all on both sides of the fence. The idealists want the tabletop version of the game, where everybody brings well rounded loadouts and brawls it out. While the meta players want to use what works the best and deploy tactics to overcome the enemy at all costs, and the two do not mix well. Meta players hate having that charlie lance that cant keep up with the "ring around the rosie" movements, and commonly pug matches with high ELO players end up being "who can chew through the puggers faster" matches, and less about skill. It boils down to who has the slower pug mechs really. While obviously idealist players hate this, as they stand no real chance in front of a horde of jump sniping meta players coming at them.

Regardless of what side of the fence you are on, we all realize things are not optimal for either side when pug queueing. Were all mixed in the same pot, and neither side wants that. I will say that for the high ELO players, we do enjoy mixing teams up and getting paired with people from other teams, and facing off against people from our own as well as players from other teams. It is truly a lot of fun, and so arguing that there are private lobbies for us to carry those kinds of matches out is null and void, as those lobbies are used typically for inter-team, or team vs team scrimmages and matches. The pug queue is a place for us to test new builds, practice techniques and play against people we wouldn't normally play against, AKA FUN! Its unfortunate that people playing the idealistic battletech game for fun get in our way.

For that reason, I personally feel that separating the queues by hardcore and casual would be MORE ideal than what we currently have. No doubt some trashy meta players could still queue in casual, but maybe this could be a moderation issue to be explored, but potentially still a problem. More often than not those players would logically queue in the hardcore lines, and meet players utilizing the mechs/builds/skills that offer them a challenge. While the idealist players can queue in the casual mode and be matched by ELO against people of equal skills with who knows what for builds, that offer the variety of gameplay they desire, with the tabletop feel they desire.

Edited by Eric Pryde, 05 June 2014 - 11:16 AM.

[Nova Yield]

We fixed this, we've done that, blah, blah. Nothn matters if they dont fix the mm. They are just shovel'n **** down your throats, and like always the people just eat it

[Sandpit]

JD LOWE, on 06 June 2014 - 12:32 AM, said:

We fixed this, we've done that, blah, blah. Nothn matters if they dont fix the mm. They are just shovel'n **** down your throats, and like always the people just eat it

^
pretty much

I haven't posted on the forums in quite a while and read them even less frequently. After getting involved in a couple of other MMO style games I've noticed something. No matter how big or small the dev team is, or the size of their budget, a year after release they have a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOT more content released and a lot more done in general. This game isn't an alpha or beta, it was launched as a "finished" title almost a year ago. How much new content have we gotten in the past year?
Maps?
Proper MM?
Robust campaign?
Tutorials?
VOIP?
CW?
Maps that don't cause a mech to stop cold in its tracks because of a rock that doesn't come above its ankle?
MASC?
Collisions?
Rudimentary Lobbies?

Anything that isn't monetized?
No, not really. What you HAVE gotten in the past year are
Hero mechs
Mechs
Colors
Camos
Cockpit items
Phoenix Packages (which STILL haven't had all of their items integrated IE faction medals anyone?)
Clan Packages


That's a fact Jack any way you cut it.

[Sandpit]

Ol Dirty *******, on 05 June 2014 - 11:13 AM, said:

Why not make a hardcore and a casual queue? I know several games that use a "Ranked vs Unranked" queue system,

you mean like every other online shooter out there? You mean actually give players MORE options on how to play the game that don't cost extra cash? You mean stuff that's been done as an industry standard for a decade now?
You mean something like....
"Hardcore Queue" all group sizes plus solo who opt in
"Regular Queue" anyone not wanting to play with groups?

Nah, that's far too much trouble. it's far easier to...

Give players LESS options and tell anyone who doesn't like it "peace out" and "drop the mic" on them to show how "cool" you are to your "TRUE" supporters.

[Cimarb]

Then go back to those other games, Sandpit. We are doing just fine here, thank you very much.

[DustySkunk]

Ol Dirty *******, on 05 June 2014 - 11:13 AM, said:

Why not make a hardcore and a casual queue?

....

truncated for size

You have no idea how many times this has been brought up. It was even planned as a feature at one point during 3PV-gate and never came to fruition. Will it happen? Possible if the playerbase gets gigantic enough to guarantee full queues, and other higher priority features are done...

Edited by DustySkunk, 13 June 2014 - 06:48 AM.

[Sandpit]

Cimarb, on 13 June 2014 - 06:12 AM, said:

Then go back to those other games, Sandpit. We are doing just fine here, thank you very much.

awwwwwwwwwww did I hurt your feelings. Let me guess, because I didn't jump up and down and say "PGI is the greatest ever" my opinion doesn't count right? lol gpclose sir, why don't YOU go back to playing a game YOU enjoy and not care if someone else has a negative opinion about it? Or did you just feel like you could jump on a bandwagon and take a shot at me? Do you need a hug?

Not once in either of those posts did I troll or bash or gloom and doom. I merely pointed out what's happened over the past year or so and commented on the idea of having separate queues. Tell me cim, what exactly did your post contribute to the conversation?

[BLOOD WOLF]

Sandpit, on 13 June 2014 - 12:35 PM, said:

awwwwwwwwwww did I hurt your feelings. Let me guess, because I didn't jump up and down and say "PGI is the greatest ever" my opinion doesn't count right? lol gpclose sir, why don't YOU go back to playing a game YOU enjoy and not care if someone else has a negative opinion about it? Or did you just feel like you could jump on a bandwagon and take a shot at me? Do you need a hug?

Not once in either of those posts did I troll or bash or gloom and doom. I merely pointed out what's happened over the past year or so and commented on the idea of having separate queues. Tell me cim, what exactly did your post contribute to the conversation?

they said it was on low priority but work for CW takes precedence. Leave it alone, when the time comes then bring this up with them.

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 13 June 2014 - 12:39 PM.

[Sandpit]

BLOOD WOLF, on 13 June 2014 - 12:39 PM, said:

they said it was on low priority but work for CW takes precedence. Leave it alone, when the time comes then bring this up with them.

leave what alone? They said the EXACT same thing a year ago. Almost word for word. No, I won't "leave it alone" I spent my money (which according to Russ apparently isn't considered "true" support of the game but I digress) so I'll voice my opinion just the same as you will. here's an idea, why don't all of those that are "mad" because I spoke up and said something negative about the game not worry about MY opinion, and continue playing the game. See this is called a feedback thread. Just because you don't like my feedback doesn't mean I have any less right to voice it.

Just out of curiosity, when would be "the time" to bring it up?
smh

[Karl Marlow]

What Sandpit is saying is something that has been bothering me for a while now. Most other MOBA style games add stuff more frequently. The problem MWO has compared to other MMO's is that when they release a new mech it doesn't feel fresh. IT doesn't really add much of a change in playstyle. Every time Smite release a new God or Dota releases a new champion it changed the dynamics of the battles. It also is a new thing you can learn and have fun with.

With Clans we are seeing a bit of that. There are new weapons and equipment to play around with. I think that is why people are getting excited over it. Playing Clans is FUN not just because it's clan mechs but because we have new toys to play with. IT breaks p the monotony. In this they have hamstrung themselves due to the ability to customize our mechs. Imagine if in Smite All they ever did was release new Gods that were basically just appearances and maybe a passive ability unique to them. Then you had to slot the same active powers you have had since closed beta to fill out its power tray. No one would really care about God releases other than those few who just like the art or want to play one of their favorite gods.

I don't really know how they fix that either. Clans are going to hep in the short term but eventually a new meta will develop and things will go back to being ho hum. Stock matches help but that is more community driven and not well known. New maps would help but those appear to be hard to make.

I don't know. I don't have many answers to their dilemma. At the same time I'm willing to ride it out. This feels like the same content drought STO had after it's release. It got through that and is doing quite well now.

[Threat Doc]

I want to be as positive as possible about this game, and I've held on for a long time, and I want to take our hosts at their word, but it's getting harder and harder to do. So, while I appreciate and enjoy Cimarb's statement that Sandpit should go play another game, I also have to agree with Sandpit that we're moving seriously into territory where this game's market viability is shot. I don't play MOBAs, I barely play MMORPGs, anymore, just too busy with life to do so, but the devs said CW was going to come out before the Clans, and CW is barely on the drawing board, now, if it's there at all.

All of that being said, PGI have accomplished some pretty huge things with this game, brought themselves up from putting out total crap to putting out a game that is pretty marvelous in and of itself, equaling and, almost, exceeding all previous MechWarrior titles. If it weren't for graphics, these guys would have MechWarrior III on their hands, and little else. However, I believe they're going to move forward and, eventually, we will see what we're supposed to see.

Something to consider about other MOBAs, with your gods and champions coming out... those games are not under heavy legal constraints. As far as PGI goes, they took on one hell of a large task, and they're making it work, even if it is amazingly slow. Once the Clan 'Mechs start to release on Tuesday, I think we'll see a pick up in maps, the completion of the Attack/Defend game mode within a couple of months, and the first portion of Community Warfare, Association, on-time in September or October. At least PGI gave us a reason WHY they set back this first phase by a month, this time.

[Cimarb]

Sandpit, on 13 June 2014 - 12:43 PM, said:

leave what alone? They said the EXACT same thing a year ago. Almost word for word. No, I won't "leave it alone" I spent my money (which according to Russ apparently isn't considered "true" support of the game but I digress) so I'll voice my opinion just the same as you will. here's an idea, why don't all of those that are "mad" because I spoke up and said something negative about the game not worry about MY opinion, and continue playing the game. See this is called a feedback thread. Just because you don't like my feedback doesn't mean I have any less right to voice it.

Just out of curiosity, when would be "the time" to bring it up?
smh

Sorry, I was busy having a blast with the new Clan mechs... what were we talking about?...

[Threat Doc]

You enjoy your silly Clan 'Mechs - blech!!! -

[Cimarb]

Kay Wolf, on 13 June 2014 - 05:04 PM, said:

You enjoy your silly Clan 'Mechs - blech!!! -

I will!!!

[Sandpit]

Cimarb, on 13 June 2014 - 04:29 PM, said:

Sorry, I was busy having a blast with the new Clan mechs... what were we talking about?...

which explains why you continue to post nothing on-topic I suppose

[Cimarb]

Sandpit, on 14 June 2014 - 08:14 PM, said:

which explains why you continue to post nothing on-topic I suppose

If you had been around the last month, you would have saw plenty of on topic posts. This thread has ran its course and you are late to the party, but please, feel free to keep crying, because it's your party now.

[Sandpit]

Cimarb, on 15 June 2014 - 07:49 AM, said:

I have nothing valid to say so I'll just insult you. It has more to do with that fact that I have absolutely nothing constructive to add to the conversation so I'll flail about trying to be "cute" and hope that by insulting you I'll distract enough that no one notices I'm not really saying anything

sounds about right...

Kay Wolf, on 13 June 2014 - 01:56 PM, said:

I want to be as positive as possible about this game, and I've held on for a long time, and I want to take our hosts at their word, but it's getting harder and harder to do. So, while I appreciate and enjoy Cimarb's statement that Sandpit should go play another game, I also have to agree with Sandpit that we're moving seriously into territory where this game's market viability is shot. I don't play MOBAs, I barely play MMORPGs, anymore, just too busy with life to do so, but the devs said CW was going to come out before the Clans, and CW is barely on the drawing board, now, if it's there at all.

All of that being said, PGI have accomplished some pretty huge things with this game, brought themselves up from putting out total crap to putting out a game that is pretty marvelous in and of itself, equaling and, almost, exceeding all previous MechWarrior titles. If it weren't for graphics, these guys would have MechWarrior III on their hands, and little else. However, I believe they're going to move forward and, eventually, we will see what we're supposed to see.

Something to consider about other MOBAs, with your gods and champions coming out... those games are not under heavy legal constraints. As far as PGI goes, they took on one hell of a large task, and they're making it work, even if it is amazingly slow. Once the Clan 'Mechs start to release on Tuesday, I think we'll see a pick up in maps, the completion of the Attack/Defend game mode within a couple of months, and the first portion of Community Warfare, Association, on-time in September or October. At least PGI gave us a reason WHY they set back this first phase by a month, this time.

I would agree more if it weren't for Russ' dismissive and condescending attitude towards customers and the fact that it is the exact same tagline almost word for word that's been said for 2 years now.

[Threat Doc]

Sandpit, on 15 June 2014 - 08:49 PM, said:

I would agree more if it weren't for Russ' dismissive and condescending attitude towards customers and the fact that it is the exact same tagline almost word for word that's been said for 2 years now.

Okay, yes, he runs a business, and they are supposed to detach themselves and remain positive and objective at all times. I know what positive and objective looks like, as every job I've ever worked has required me to detach myself, as a person, and act in-line with the company's best interests. However, I also know there are times when I've come home from work and punched a tree, or a wall, or growled my way through to dinner, etc.

PGI and, in particular, Russ and Bryan and Paul, have listened to nearly three years of hammerfallen bullshit from nearly 600,000 players, including from me; I cannot possibly hold myself innocent in any of this. The very first day these forums were open, I told PGI they needed to close them, and they didn't listen, so the fault belongs with them for that. Still, having to listening to the incoherent yammerings of so many people for so long is bound to have a negative effect on an individual's psyche, and their professionalism. That would be, in and of itself, excellent reason for any condescending nature anyone at PGI might have. However, now consider that you're not a customer service professional, naturally, but instead you're a game designer that's been able to get your hands on your lifelong love, and you're able to shape it how you want to shape it, but all of those voices are out there, again, and you have to learn customer service? How would you act with 600,000 condescending ******** telling you if you don't make the game such and so way that you're going to fail, the game will fail, etc. Again, I'm guilty as charged.

If the damn stakes weren't so high, and I were Russ or Bryan, I would have told this community what it could do with itself, develop the game without forums or feedback, test it with a limited number of people, and then publish it. "If you build it, they will come" never had a truer ring to it, and Russ and Bryan and everyone at PGI could fire and forget this game, never update it, and just rake in the cash, enough to keep them and their families well-to-do for generations to come. For my part, I think it screams volumes about their character that they haven't just gone to the dark side and walked away fanning themselves with cash.

I may have been negative, and I may continue to be negative, but it's because of the love I have for this universe, and because I believe that, despite being two years late, these guys are going to shoot for the moon as far as getting out what they said they would and, in the end, we're going to have an amazing game that encompasses the most important fighting worlds of the Inner Sphere, some larger maps, perhaps even objective-based missions rather than kill it all and let God sort it out ALL THE TIME. It's just going to take more time, is all.

[Cimarb]

Sandpit, on 15 June 2014 - 08:49 PM, said:

I would agree more if it weren't for Russ' dismissive and condescending attitude towards ME.

FTFY. :drops mic:

[Sandpit]

Cimarb, on 16 June 2014 - 08:08 AM, said:

FTFY. :drops mic:

Pssst might want to pick that up. It wasn't me he took that attitude with. I just saw it on his twitter feed. Done making I consequential noise yet? You're just reinforcing everything I said sir

Kay Wolf, on 16 June 2014 - 05:46 AM, said:

Okay, yes, he runs a business, and they are supposed to detach themselves and remain positive and objective at all times. I know what positive and objective looks like, as every job I've ever worked has required me to detach myself, as a person, and act in-line with the company's best interests. However, I also know there are times when I've come home from work and punched a tree, or a wall, or growled my way through to dinner, etc.

PGI and, in particular, Russ and Bryan and Paul, have listened to nearly three years of hammerfallen bullshit from nearly 600,000 players, including from me; I cannot possibly hold myself innocent in any of this. The very first day these forums were open, I told PGI they needed to close them, and they didn't listen, so the fault belongs with them for that. Still, having to listening to the incoherent yammerings of so many people for so long is bound to have a negative effect on an individual's psyche, and their professionalism. That would be, in and of itself, excellent reason for any condescending nature anyone at PGI might have. However, now consider that you're not a customer service professional, naturally, but instead you're a game designer that's been able to get your hands on your lifelong love, and you're able to shape it how you want to shape it, but all of those voices are out there, again, and you have to learn customer service? How would you act with 600,000 condescending ******** telling you if you don't make the game such and so way that you're going to fail, the game will fail, etc. Again, I'm guilty as charged.

If the damn stakes weren't so high, and I were Russ or Bryan, I would have told this community what it could do with itself, develop the game without forums or feedback, test it with a limited number of people, and then publish it. "If you build it, they will come" never had a truer ring to it, and Russ and Bryan and everyone at PGI could fire and forget this game, never update it, and just rake in the cash, enough to keep them and their families well-to-do for generations to come. For my part, I think it screams volumes about their character that they haven't just gone to the dark side and walked away fanning themselves with cash.

I may have been negative, and I may continue to be negative, but it's because of the love I have for this universe, and because I believe that, despite being two years late, these guys are going to shoot for the moon as far as getting out what they said they would and, in the end, we're going to have an amazing game that encompasses the most important fighting worlds of the Inner Sphere, some larger maps, perhaps even objective-based missions rather than kill it all and let God sort it out ALL THE TIME. It's just going to take more time, is all.

And I agree with a lot of what you said. I still will no longer defend or attempt to look over their attitudes. They want to act unprofessional, that's fine but don't get panties in a bunch when they're called out for it.