13 replies to this topic

[Apnu]

This is officially ridiculous now. 3-3-3-3 is in, then its out, then its in, then its out.

I just bought a CPLT-C4. I have 2xLRM15+A, 3xML, and TAG on it. Its not the strongest build for that chassis. In 20 games I have a 8/11 W/L but a 21/11 KDR and 7,000 damage. I just unlocked the last basic on the thing.

Most of my time in that mech has been spent on teams full of newbies, in random mechs, being newbies and dying. While the other team usually out-tons us (tonight was all about triple DDCs per match, come on!) 1-2 more random assaults, 2-3 heavies, 1 screwball medium and the rest lights, and clearly they had better skill as a group. A few of the matches I was in had one or no assaults at all!

All this tells me that Elo isn't working, the match maker isn't working (even without 3-3-3-3 its still busted).

So here's a suggestion: DROP THE MATCHMAKING! Introduce a lobby system, enforce whatever balance rules you want on that lobby and be done with it.

Let players see lobbies looking for pilots and certain weight classes and let them just go fill those slots. if you wan to go a step further, let players only see other lobbies that have the same average Elo bracket as the player searching.

You could also let the lobby drop into a game when its got 4v4, 8v8, 12,v12. This would satisfy needs for private matches. And if players like the dynamic of the group, they can stay in the lobby and play more games.

Having a lobby system will remove the complicated problems PGI is having with the matchmaker and times to find games, plus its a step closer to CW because you could name some lobbies after planets or zones or whatever! You can also have faction players only team up with their own faction and whatever loan wolves are hanging around.

However you do it, it really doesn't matter to my point. What does matter is its time to cut your losses with the match maker and move on to something else.

[DeathlyEyes]

You should take a look at this thread http://mwomercs.com/...19#entry3391919

[Ebonkosh]

SLDF DeathEyes...I agree that there needs to be a better method... I posted about it after a days worth of hell. Below is a link my post...Below the link is some dev life cycle humor...

http://mwomercs.com/...m-more-venting/


Humor starts hee.......heee..

In order for them to fix the LRMs that were broken they had to add some code to disconnect the folks with LRMs so they can not complain about the LRMs not working until they really find out why the LRMs are not working and then they will fix the Disconnect issue and hope that that doesn't cause the hit registration on light mechs to be even worse and then they will patch to fix the hit boxes and then the clan mechs will not work right and cause clan mechs to all have infinity range on all weapons. Once they fix the clan mechs it will cause the LRMs to not work right again...Then they will try to fix UI2.0 and break the match maker so that everyone joins the matches with only machine guns and small lasers. The PGI cycle of life......

Ebonkosh

[meteorol]

Way too late now. Lobbies have been requested all the way since CB, but PGI chose not to go that way.
They neither have the resources nor the manpower to switch to lobbies on the fly, especially with clan mechs on the horizon. MM is bound to stay, now matter how broken it is.

[Kyynele]

Apnu, on 21 May 2014 - 09:59 PM, said:

I just bought a CPLT-C4. I have 2xLRM15+A, 3xML, and TAG on it. Its not the strongest build for that chassis. In 20 games I have a 8/11 W/L but a 21/11 KDR and 7,000 damage. I just unlocked the last basic on the thing.

Sorry for nitpicking, but that loadout would be the CPLT-C1. And I'd claim it's pretty much the strongest build you can have on that chassis, especially at the moment with LRMs realistically usable against PUGs. And it's one of the easiest mechs to end up being the last one in your team alive, which in lost games often means you should have the highest damage in your team. If this happens, it's just a sign that you played the mech properly, it doesn't automatically mean you were heads above the rest better than your team.

Catapult A1 is my main ride at the moment, with KDR 3.99 and average damage of 552 per match after 271 matches (149,637 total). Just to make clear I'm not bashing the play style, I just do know how that works. In lost games I often score 5 times more damage than my average team member, but that's because of my mech choice, not because I'm 5x better than the people I'm playing with. I do have my share of truly bad teams of course, but simply losing a game doesn't mean your team was terribad, it just means the opposing team played better.

W/L of 8/11 is pretty close to 1.0 (which is what you should be getting if MM truly finds worthwhile opponents for you), and 20 matches is so insignificant amount that it's bound to even out from that.

Honestly, the data you provide here seems to point to elo working pretty much as intended. Having not seen the actual matches I can't of course really claim that you're mistaken, so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

Anyway, I'm not against the lobby idea. Carry on.

[Apnu]

Kyynele, on 22 May 2014 - 01:07 AM, said:

Sorry for nitpicking, but that loadout would be the CPLT-C1. And I'd claim it's pretty much the strongest build you can have on that chassis, especially at the moment with LRMs realistically usable against PUGs. And it's one of the easiest mechs to end up being the last one in your team alive, which in lost games often means you should have the highest damage in your team. If this happens, it's just a sign that you played the mech properly, it doesn't automatically mean you were heads above the rest better than your team.

You're right. I confuse the C1 and C4. It is a good build, balanced, yet focused on a role. Highly mobile fire-support, but enough punch to drive lights off your back and/or have decent contributions in the end game. I rather love this build and chose that variant do specifically mix LRMs and MLs. I have a pal that turned his into what he calls a "pulsecat" Max engine, 2xLPL, 2xMPL, JJs and the rest in armor and DHS. Its surprisingly effective. I replicated the build on a K2 and added MGs, it very good.

Quote

Catapult A1 is my main ride at the moment, with KDR 3.99 and average damage of 552 per match after 271 matches (149,637 total). Just to make clear I'm not bashing the play style, I just do know how that works. In lost games I often score 5 times more damage than my average team member, but that's because of my mech choice, not because I'm 5x better than the people I'm playing with. I do have my share of truly bad teams of course, but simply losing a game doesn't mean your team was terribad, it just means the opposing team played better.

W/L of 8/11 is pretty close to 1.0 (which is what you should be getting if MM truly finds worthwhile opponents for you), and 20 matches is so insignificant amount that it's bound to even out from that.

Honestly, the data you provide here seems to point to elo working pretty much as intended. Having not seen the actual matches I can't of course really claim that you're mistaken, so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

Anyway, I'm not against the lobby idea. Carry on.

Yes the data set is small, but there's more to the story I didn't mention. Those 20 matches came in three nights of play. The first night was an incredible 7-0 evening. The other two I struggled to wind up on a team (as solo player mind you) that had a reasonable chance of winning. Those other two nights I was on a team that won a game once or twice in the session. The rest were all ROTFLstomps.

And this is in a "new" mech for me. I have a positive, over all, stats, and I'm in the middle of the pack from what I can tell. I'm neither awesome or awful, I'm a dependably average pilot.

However, I used this "new" mech to track this situation out of curiosity. I found it suspicious that I wind up in a cycle of strong teams winning one evening, but two others I wind up on weak teams. That is a worrying trend. If I was winning 1:1 or 1:2 I'd not complain. But going 1-6 and 2-7 in a gaming session?

Time will tell if that holds out, as you say. I'll continue to monitor this and see if my suspicions are founded or not.

I also did things like hang out in the mechlab for a while, or dork around on Smurfy and mechspecs.com trying to break the cycle of being placed on newbie teams. I figured I was getting back to the main UI and looking for a game around the same time as the other players, so I took a break for a random amount of time. No good, I came back and wound up on either really strong teams (usually out toning the opposition) or really weak teams (being under toned or under skilled).

And its not just this mech, I've have this cycle for a few months now when I solo. I'm usually found in Hunchbacks or Jaegers these days, I've seen this trend in those mechs that I've mastered. So, I have suspected the MM has balance issues for a while well beyond the fixes PGI has tried. I've chosen, with this mech, to track this and see what the results are. I think, going forward, I'm going to screenshot the end screen for each match and analyze the results. Should prove interesting, if I can keep personal bias out of it.

But regardless of all that, I'm not the first one to complain about the MM or recognize that its not working very well. There are many others and many other threads.

What I am doing here is suggesting that PGI cut their losses with the MM, abandon development on it, and start working on a lobby system. I'd tolerate the poor MM for a few months if we'd get a lobby system out of it late this year. I'm sure many other players would also. But I could be wrong so I gave birth to this thread to see if the idea has merit with the community.

[SgtMagor]

I thought lobbies were going to be integrated into CW, or did I misunderstand something?

[Apnu]

SgtMagor, on 22 May 2014 - 06:00 AM, said:

I thought lobbies were going to be integrated into CW, or did I misunderstand something?

Its confusing. There are supposed to be lobbies, and private matches, and matchmaking for lone wolves. Three separate systems for finding and playing games. That's silly. Just make a lobby system and every group is satisfied. That's the essence of my point.

[ktKAPS]

I agree with adding lobbies but do not agree with dropping matchmaker. Agreed matchmaker needs to be adjusted but still leave it for people who simply want to use it and play a match.

By simply using lobbies now I would have to deal with arrogant players trying to tell me what I should or should not be playing and then kick me out of the lobby because I refuse to listen to them.

Sometimes I simply want to play and don't care if I win or lose and seriously don't want to sit in a lobby for 30 minutes while the 6 man team is trying to build the perfect team and telling me to go down to the other team or play a certain mech.

[Vandul]

OP

Catapult C4 has two energy hardpoints. Where did you cram the other two at?

OR did you mean C1?

[Joseph Mallan]

Also, we have lobbies now.

[Damocles]

Joseph Mallan, on 22 May 2014 - 06:40 AM, said:

Also, we have lobbies now.

Disagree, Steiner.

this is a lobby
;

[Joseph Mallan]

Damocles, on 22 May 2014 - 07:04 AM, said:

Disagree, Steiner.

this is a lobby
;

Okkkkkkkkkkk!

[AlmightyAeng]

Kyynele, on 22 May 2014 - 01:07 AM, said:

And I'd claim it's pretty much the strongest build you can have on that chassis, especially at the moment with LRMs realistically usable against PUGs.

I'm sorry, did you not read that PGI broke the missile code by introducing Clan data? Lol.