275 replies to this topic

[CCC Dober]

Koenig, on 22 June 2012 - 09:20 AM, said:

It's not the NDA alone that is the problem. It is a combination of a "get it before its too late" gimmick that expires the public will get a chance to experience the game PLUS a gag order (the NDA) for those who are aloud to play. If either of these two were relaxed then there would not be a problem.

Dude, you are so damn wrong on this one. It's like you don't even know what a damn NDA is meant to be: NON DISCLOSURE AGREEMENT.

Do you speak english? Do you know what these words already imply? If not, use a dictionary, please do.
Lord almighty ...

[Killless]

I guess for the amount of risk involved, I find "Founder pack" to be underwhelming. It does not seem good enough deal for the amount of risk.
In WOT very similar pack was offered after open beta. I was able to make an educated choice. Here in am buying box with schrodinger's cat.
If I got into Beta and liked the game I would buy it immediatelly.

Bagheera, on 22 June 2012 - 08:41 AM, said:

Buying founders is no different from the last time you pre-ordered a console game, or bought a game in a store, or ordered one from D2D, or whatever. Well, okay, the difference is you have to wait longer to get to play it. People almost ALWAYS buy a game before getting to play it. It's the way games have been sold, um, since forever.

I disagree, to me it is different. Normally there are reviews or pre-views from "game review sites" about the game. Most of the games are sequels and I know what to expect.
I have seen the videos, but I have very little feeling for how this game will play once it is out. How good the controls are. Features I like may or may not appear. (people disagree on forums how it will be handled)

[Koenig]

Silent, on 22 June 2012 - 09:21 AM, said:

If you need to experience gameplay before you consider giving PGI your money then wait till the game is released. It's going to be free to play after all. You will have nothing to lose if you don't like it.

So people keep saying this same thing and it sounds really great but unfortunately does not address the questions and concerns being asked in this thread. I'm sure you are the #1 fan of all MW/BT and you want me to be #2. That doesn't change the fact that a choice that could make a big impact on the game has to be made before anyone has a chance to be informed about it.

CCC Dober, on 22 June 2012 - 09:30 AM, said:

Dude, you are so damn wrong on this one. It's like you don't even know what a damn NDA is meant to be: NON DISCLOSURE AGREEMENT.

Do you speak english? Do you know what these words already imply? If not, use a dictionary, please do.
Lord almighty ...

Ironic post is ironic.

Please tell me what you think will happen to players in the CB that post comments to the public forums about the game after they have had a chance to play it. Please tell me how the NDA will have no bering on the fate of their post and possibly their account.

[PodX140]

I personally am fine with paying before I try it, but I would love a kind of benchmark tool or test client to make 100% sure that my computer can run the game.

Edited by PodX140, 22 June 2012 - 09:38 AM.

[BlindProphet]

Koenig, on 22 June 2012 - 09:16 AM, said:

I'll agree the extra skin is a trivial bonus. The extra cbills might not be. Remember, this is a lifetime bonus that will add up to a lot of extra cash over time. Also, you're forgetting about the most important thing with these mechs: 4 free garage slots. It has been stated that garage slots are finite, these 4 mechs will not count toward the normal slots.

So then, why not offer just these couple things to the people who waited too long. Hell, charge us more money if you want.

Now while I could be 110% wrong here...I believe you'll be able to purchase additional garage slots as I believe in the calculation that the $120 legendary pack being worth $170 includes them as part of the value. Thus to me that says you'll be able to purchase additional slots.

As for the cbill bonus, you are correct. Over time that could add up to a lot. On the other hand...its a convenience. And still on another hand...we don't know if they'll eventually, or at launch, sell mechs in the shop that have this bonus. Honestly I could take or leave the bonus, it wouldn't have affected my purchase if it was not there.

The other thing that comes into play is that the bonus is only for those specific founders mechs. Meaning if I end up preferring to play other mechs in the long run I don't end up getting that bonus.

So the only thing that we get, that we're still not 100% sure you will not be able to get, is that cbill bonus on those four base variant mechs. A bonus that could add up over time or not end up being a factor depending on individual play style and mech preference.

Personally I probably won't play the hunchback, or Jenner much at all. While I cede that both are decent mechs, neither does anything for me personally. Much rather be running in a raven or trenchbucket for those weight classes respectively.

[Todd Lee]

I'm personally going to wait. Putting blind faith into games this year has proven to be disastrous. Not only that, but if MWO Mercs leans towards the "I buy power" method, I DEFINITELY won't be getting it.

[Koenig]

blindprophet, on 22 June 2012 - 09:39 AM, said:

Now while I could be 110% wrong here...I believe you'll be able to purchase additional garage slots as I believe in the calculation that the $120 legendary pack being worth $170 includes them as part of the value. Thus to me that says you'll be able to purchase additional slots.

As for the cbill bonus, you are correct. Over time that could add up to a lot. On the other hand...its a convenience. And still on another hand...we don't know if they'll eventually, or at launch, sell mechs in the shop that have this bonus. Honestly I could take or leave the bonus, it wouldn't have affected my purchase if it was not there.

The other thing that comes into play is that the bonus is only for those specific founders mechs. Meaning if I end up preferring to play other mechs in the long run I don't end up getting that bonus.

So the only thing that we get, that we're still not 100% sure you will not be able to get, is that cbill bonus on those four base variant mechs. A bonus that could add up over time or not end up being a factor depending on individual play style and mech preference.

Personally I probably won't play the hunchback, or Jenner much at all. While I cede that both are decent mechs, neither does anything for me personally. Much rather be running in a raven or trenchbucket for those weight classes respectively.

Well you or I could be wrong about interpretting the value of the purchase. If it turns out like you said that the founder mech garage slots aren't special (that would imply you can sell the founder mechs btw) or that the cbill bonus is so marginal that it won't matter after a couple months, then it becomes less and less of an issue.

At this point, kind of wish one of the people in the know would just answer a few of the basic questions surounding this. If it turns out that you are correct and that all of the benefits I mentioned earlier will be available for purchase after the game goes live, I would gladly close this thread and shut up.

[GHQCommander]

Kalenn, on 22 June 2012 - 08:22 AM, said:

Corrected below.


... but wait, you're a legendary founder...?

Guess you changed your mind?

lol

I was fighting for beta access earlier than they said but I got a strict message in my inbox saying, it just is not going to happen.

I still stand by my word. What else can I do in this situation. No point missing out totally, said my part.

[Silent]

Koenig, on 22 June 2012 - 09:36 AM, said:

So people keep saying this same thing and it sounds really great but unfortunately does not address the questions and concerns being asked in this thread. I'm sure you are the #1 fan of all MW/BT and you want me to be #2. That doesn't change the fact that a choice that could make a big impact on the game has to be made before anyone has a chance to be informed about it.

The Founders packages are a form of early adoption. They are available for those that wish to support the developers and/or intellectual property and become an early customer. They get early access to the product while the developers get feedback from these customers. If someone doesn't want to be an early customer then that's their prerogative. I am sure there will be many other windows of opportunity to buy perks after launch if the game interests you.

[Koenig]

Silent, on 22 June 2012 - 09:59 AM, said:

The Founders packages are a form of early adoption. They are available for those that wish to support the developers and/or intellectual property and become an early customer. They get early access to the product while the developers get feedback from these customers. If someone doesn't want to be an early customer then that's their prerogative. I am sure there will be many other windows of opportunity to buy perks after launch if the game interests you.

You're saying we will be able to buy mechs that give +cbill bonuses that don't take up garage slots?

[Silent]

I don't know what they plan on doing.

[Dragonsbane]

GHQCommander, on 20 June 2012 - 09:58 AM, said:

I was going to spend $120, then I read more posts asking to actually see what they are going to get for it. Even a single player game gets a small demo for half the price.

So I'm joining that argument.

Give it a couple of months and there will be players in this forum complaining about how they wish they never spent $120. There always is in every game, every kind of argument and complaint. So many users in this forum have spent the $120, they behave as if its nothing, but just wait and see. Some of them will have some complaint to make one day and their tune will change about their payment. Granted not all and most will be happy, like I probably will be.

I too think I will love the game, but it is not the point. My own customers for my own software get a refund if they are not happy and they pay about $140. They also get endless videos, tutorials, endless page of documentation, they get to speak to myself directly, they get access to beta, trials etc

I won't get a refund for my $120 on this if it launches, no rights. Only with software can they get away with that, despite this being a service that can be stopped from their end. Many developers ethics are poor especially in MMO game development. So I realised I don't want to encourage this behaviour in software development when the software is provided via a controlled web service, not a stand alone product for Windows. They are hiding behind the old software no return excuse, desptie it not applying in the slightest because this is a service.

They could issue even 1 hour of beta access and I want that first. That is my change of position since a couple of days ago.

When I have no trial for my software, customers don't want to pay $20 never mind $120. Let me see the game please, thanks.

I loled pretty hard when after reading this, I saw the poster Legendary tag.....

[Koenig]

Silent, on 22 June 2012 - 10:12 AM, said:

I don't know what they plan on doing.

None of us do. Hence the thread.

[gregsolidus]

This is still going on?

[Aegic]

If you tried it before you bought it, you wouldnt be an investor/founder. You would be a buyer.

gregsolidus, on 22 June 2012 - 10:33 AM, said:

This is still going on?

I know right?

[GldnSabre]

Ok, from one Founder to others out there. I see the founders pack as a special support us pack. With this pack you receive x stuff. When you buy this Founders pack you help us make the game better for launch.

This being said for those that want a try before you buy, this game is in beta if you did not or have not received a beta key your point is not going anywhere. You will not be able to try the game before the Founders pack is taken off the market. So at this point any argument is moot.

There will be NO TRY BEFORE YOU BUY "A Founders Pack" DURING BETA so let please stop trolling the topic. (only way is if you get a beta key before aug 7th)


Secondly for those that want to be able to get this deal when it launches then it would not be a founders program, it will have to be something else. If they handle the F2P like I have seen many other do there will be specials and gifts and things that make the game easier as the game progresses. Why would a company want to extend the founders program after soft launch. I feel that the Founders pack should be for those that want to take the risk to put money into a game before release because they wish to see it succeed and because the dev offer cool stuff along with it.

Last but not least people come on here complain about a pack that is available for purchase but why , no one is holding a gun to your head to buy it. Wait for the game to be released, One. you wont have to pay anything to play aka(No Risk), Two. You will have access to all gear through the game(you just have to work for it because you did not take the risk). Three if you like it you most likely will be able to buy in game cash with real cash(wait founders program does this) and purchase the things you want. You may pay more because you waited but you still have access to the stuff but, you still can buy it.

Have fun stop feeding the trolls.

[GHQCommander]

I thought I could spend a week debating it. With enough of us doing so, maybe push for beta to come quicker.

Never going to happen. Everyone has their own reason for why they want to try before they buy. I just like to push for the most I can get. However I am slightly suspicious that they think they will earn more money this way in the initial launch, than they would offering open beta this early.

My poll on PvP players suggests that at least 10% of founders, are not PvP mad. How many of them will get a big surprise about how brutal a PvP game this is? Probably a lot and that is why I begged for beta now. It would help people make a real decision.

Me I'm a big PvP fan. I'm sure to love this game. I just feel sorry for those who don't know what they are putting $120 and I said my piece all over the forum about how beta should be offered. Even if it was giving in a week to legendary founders, it would at least help people to decide if they need a new computer for launch or if they won't even bother playing at all.

Rather than booking time off work or just looking forwarding to playing in August. Then realise it is not going to happen due to PC specs or the game is nothing like they thought. This argument always goes both ways, sure. Whatever the argument, I've always been confident a good game is at hand.

[GHQCommander]

Dragonsbane, on 22 June 2012 - 10:16 AM, said:

I loled pretty hard when after reading this, I saw the poster Legendary tag.....

So what?

Does not change my opinion does it. Does not change my request for this entire approach to be changed and strong beliefs it should be. But as I mentioned, I've been told that won't happen. I can only hope such debates effect developers approaches in future.

Hence why we have freedom of speech. So don't make out I'm wrong.

Just because I'm not a fanboi who talks about faith in a small purchase of $120, does not mean I'm wrong and it does not mean I can't purchase the Legendary pack later on.

My argument still stands if I've paid or not. Beta should be giving earlier and I will continue to do so with my own customers. That is how I work and why I was writing posts asking for it to be that way. That is how we get more for our dollar or pound or whatever currency you have in your pocket. Giving it up without asking for more on the table or expressing you expect more on the table, is not how I operate.

Edited by GHQCommander, 22 June 2012 - 10:53 AM.

[Lorien Benirus]

i honestly dont think this game is anywhere NEAR 120usd from the videos ive seen andi agree that there should AT LEAST be a demo, im not willing to be irrational enough to throw my money in the pot to something ive only just seen

...

[GHQCommander]

Telemakhos, on 22 June 2012 - 10:54 AM, said:

i honestly dont think this game is anywhere NEAR 120usd from the videos ive seen andi agree that there should AT LEAST be a demo, im not willing to be irrational enough to throw my money in the pot to something ive only just seen

...

It is if you plan to play for 2 year and your confident in that.

You would need to be a big PvP fan, which I am.

You would need to be confident you play a game over 2 year period. That is me.

If that is not you. Then I don't blame you at all and I support your call for beta access. Your in an even harder position than I was I bet. I called for beta access for the last couple of days. However I also think once the game is here I will love it and so there is no point being so stubborn as to not pay at all. This issue is just not that big.

Despite plenty legendary pack buyers coming in here talking as if this thread should not exist. Like us founders now have a right to say what is an acceptable argument and an allowed opinion on this forum.

This thread is required, it is a place for the current debate and it is a place for everyone to let of any heated opinion in one place.