73 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

I did not get to run the Warhawk, so comparing the two will be tough, but I did run about 2 dozen matches in Shamu, the Clan's 100 ton answer to the Stalker.

Impressions?
1) OMG that is a LOT of firepower.
2) OMG that is a LOT of firepower.
3) needed time to get past the first two impressions.

and then the objective view started to settle in.

Yes. It can pack a LOT of guns. I was running around with 2 UAC20s, 2 ER PPCs and a lot of support weapons, or 1 UAC20, 2 UAC5s, 2 ER PPCs, and a host of other builds.

BUT.......

Because most of the clan Weapons not called Gauss or PPC are DoT, I actually found that my TTK of opponent mechs, was generally inferior to what I could accomplish with many Inner Sphere Heavies, let alone Assaults. Because of the lack of FLD. Mind you I COULD mount Gauss, but the next issue kinda makes me hesitant:

The thing turns like the Titanic. AFTER hitting the iceberg. It has all the agility of the JumboJet suck in the hangar doors that it resembles. Horrible twist range and speed, and worse arm reflex. This thing is 100 tons of dead mech waiting to happen if unsupported.

Mind you, I agree with the lack of agility. It is needed to balance the guns, like the Stalker and Banshee before it. But if you are a PUG, or think you will be able to go off hunting on your own, this is NOT the Mech for you. Unsupported, ANY decent Light or Medium jock will eat you alive, 100+ damage "alpha" or not.

If you drop in a group, and can have others cover your flanks, then this thing has the firepower of the Deathstar, and because of that, probably has a place in your TO&E.

[Wintersdark]

As I said elsewhere, you can't really compare the Warhawk and Direwolf at all - they are very different animals, despite appearing similar on first glance.

My impression of the Direwolf, after I got past the absurdity of its damage output when equipped with 4 CUAC10's and 4 CERML's, was that it can be a fearsome mech in an organized group... But its utter trash as a PUG mech. Being so slow and ponderous, its glaring limitations leave you at the mercy of your teammates. When they are on comms/known qualities, this is fine. In a PUG match, you can find yourself alone and helpless through no fault of your own. Frequently.

I was really concerned about the Direwolf before the PTR. After using it, and fighting against it, those concerns are gone. Its a beast, no doubt, but its a beast with huge, exploitable disadvantages.

[Moogles]

Yeah, I definitely agree with the latter part of this.

The Dire Wolf seems to be like a modern day tank - it's a heavy hitter, but it needs support from other units in order to actually be effective.

I saw a plethora of different builds being ran on it Thursday, though. Most notably the 6x UAC/2, 2x LB20X (this one looked really fun), 2x UAC/20s, and some with more traditional loadouts. I didn't actually see that many rocking Gauss OR PPCs actually.

I don't have it to test, myself - this is purely through observation of teammates/enemies.

[Adridos]

It still beats the crap out of the Atlas, though... is faster both in velocity and rotation, more survivable, packs a bigger punch and is smaller to top it off.

[101011]

Adridos, on 14 June 2014 - 08:06 AM, said:

It still beats the crap out of the Atlas, though... is faster both in velocity and rotation, more survivable, packs a bigger punch and is smaller to top it off.

You are talking about the Dire Wolf, quineg? It is slower, turns slower, has a huge CT, can not roll even increased duration lasers effectively. Yes, it is smaller and has more firepower, but that does not help when I get one alone.

[Heffay]

I think 2 well-played Locust could take down a Dire Wolf. Or at least have a decent shot at it. It's *so* slow that you could get behind him and actually stay there.

Maybe we could instigate a bear baiting league! 1 Dire Wolf vs X Locust, where X will be determined through betting. "Greetings, Clanner. How much do you bid?"

[Adridos]

101011, on 14 June 2014 - 08:08 AM, said:

You are talking about the Dire Wolf, quineg? It is slower, turns slower, has a huge CT, can not roll even increased duration lasers effectively. Yes, it is smaller and has more firepower, but that does not help when I get one alone.

Oh, right, fixed engine... totally forgot about that one.

[Rampancy]

Heffay, on 14 June 2014 - 08:08 AM, said:

I think 2 well-played Locust could take down a Dire Wolf. Or at least have a decent shot at it. It's *so* slow that you could get behind him and actually stay there.

Maybe we could instigate a bear baiting league! 1 Dire Wolf vs X Locust, where X will be determined through betting. "Greetings, Clanner. How much do you bid?"

This would actually be a hell of a lot of fun. I'd throw my 3M into the pool, ha.

[Bishop Steiner]

Adridos, on 14 June 2014 - 08:18 AM, said:

Oh, right, fixed engine... totally forgot about that one.

Fixed engine, horrible arm reflex and Stalker-esque twist. I actually saw Atlases having very good fights against the DW.

[101011]

Heffay, on 14 June 2014 - 08:08 AM, said:

I think 2 well-played Locust could take down a Dire Wolf. Or at least have a decent shot at it. It's *so* slow that you could get behind him and actually stay there.

Maybe we could instigate a bear baiting league! 1 Dire Wolf vs X Locust, where X will be determined through betting. "Greetings, Clanner. How much do you bid?"

I think 1 well-played Locust could take it down, as long as it was not stupid enough to come at it from the front. Also, traditionally speaking, the Dire Wolf would bid 1 Dire Wolf, and it would be left to the attacking Locusts to determine the fewest number of Locusts they needed to kill it.

[Wintersdark]

Heffay, on 14 June 2014 - 08:08 AM, said:

I think 2 well-played Locust could take down a Dire Wolf. Or at least have a decent shot at it. It's *so* slow that you could get behind him and actually stay there.

Maybe we could instigate a bear baiting league! 1 Dire Wolf vs X Locust, where X will be determined through betting. "Greetings, Clanner. How much do you bid?"

One on one, no problem.

Even one locust, it's not an issue. If you can get behind the Direwolf, it's trivial to stay behind the Direwolf. If there are no allies protecting the DW's rear, you can just park there and core it at your leisure.

[Diablobo]

I called the Dire Wolf being a slow moving beast and told people to prepare themselves for the shock, but apparently there were already Atlas pilots used to running 300 engines.

http://mwomercs.com/...__fromsearch__1

[WarHippy]

I have to agree. The Dire Wolf has some impressive firepower, but it is a giant boat anchor. I think it could have a place in organized play, but it will probably be a waste for the individual. I agree that you can't give it too much turn rate or arm reflex, but something has to give.

[Bishop Steiner]

Diablobo, on 14 June 2014 - 08:44 AM, said:

I called the Dire Wolf being a slow moving beast and told people to prepare themselves for the shock, but apparently there were already Atlas pilots used to running 300 engines.

http://mwomercs.com/...__fromsearch__1

few people, that I am aware of ever denied that it would be. But it's good to note for potential suckers who think it to be the "ezmode" button because "guns", that it is indeed very very limited, but very effective within those limits.

[Khobai]

Quote

The thing turns like the Titanic.

Did you take the side torso that gives +10% turn speed?

Did you elite your skills? to get +20% turn speed?

Did you cut your throttle when turning to turn faster? You turn 3 times slower at full throttle.

Did you use the Daishi A right arm in conjunction with lasers to gain some lower arm actuator movement? Every little bit of agility helps.

Because my experience with the Direwolf was that it turned quite well for a 100 ton mech. It certainly turns better than an Atlas.

Quote

You are talking about the Dire Wolf, quineg? It is slower, turns slower, has a huge CT, can not roll even increased duration lasers effectively. Yes, it is smaller and has more firepower, but that does not help when I get one alone

Its movement speed is slower, but it doesnt actually turn slower than the Atlas. If you take the side torso that gives +10% turn speed the Daishi turns like it has a 330 engine. Which means it turns better than the typical Atlas which runs a 325 engine.

The huge CT is a problem. But the solution to that is to play the range game instead of trying to face tank. Clan weapons have some of the longest ranges in the game. If face tanking with the Daishi doesnt work, then dont do it. Range the enemy instead and only face tank when its absolutely necessary. Clan players need to resist the urge to charge in with the new autocannons and instead they need to get accustomed to the idea of wearing down the other team with attrition tactics, using that massively longer range to its fullest.

Edited by Khobai, 14 June 2014 - 10:46 AM.

[GrogX]

It seemed the only damage I took that didn't hit my CT was from LRM fire. Even with skills elited out it was about as nimble as a morbidly obese sloth on sedatives.

With that being said, I wasn't exactly playing smart. I was having too much fun button mashing to worry about things like positioning or tactics. Once that wears off or my team chews me out for derp'ing around too much we'll see what happens. Like most others I'm going to guess it will be brutal to drive solo but effective in a group.

[Bishop Steiner]

Khobai, on 14 June 2014 - 10:28 AM, said:

Did you take the side torso that gives +10% turn speed?

Did you elite your skills? to get +20% turn speed?

Because my experience with the Direwolf was that it turned quite well for a 100 ton mech.

Yes
Yes
Nope

[John Archer]

Heffay, on 14 June 2014 - 08:08 AM, said:

I think 2 well-played Locust could take down a Dire Wolf. Or at least have a decent shot at it. It's *so* slow that you could get behind him and actually stay there.

Maybe we could instigate a bear baiting league! 1 Dire Wolf vs X Locust, where X will be determined through betting. "Greetings, Clanner. How much do you bid?"

Heh.

Add me as a friend on the Public Server on Sunday. I would love to get in on this action. Private matches. I have Premium Time, and know how to use it.

[Khobai]

Quote

Nope

You expect a 100 ton mech to turn on a dime? Quite frankly its amazing the Daishi turns better than an Atlas. Ill take that. Because I was expecting it to turn worse than an Atlas.

[SirLANsalot]

Bishop Steiner, on 14 June 2014 - 07:54 AM, said:

I did not get to run the Warhawk, so comparing the two will be tough, but I did run about 2 dozen matches in Shamu, the Clan's 100 ton answer to the Stalker.

Impressions?
1) OMG that is a LOT of firepower.
2) OMG that is a LOT of firepower.
3) needed time to get past the first two impressions.

and then the objective view started to settle in.

Yes. It can pack a LOT of guns. I was running around with 2 UAC20s, 2 ER PPCs and a lot of support weapons, or 1 UAC20, 2 UAC5s, 2 ER PPCs, and a host of other builds.

BUT.......

Because most of the clan Weapons not called Gauss or PPC are DoT, I actually found that my TTK of opponent mechs, was generally inferior to what I could accomplish with many Inner Sphere Heavies, let alone Assaults. Because of the lack of FLD. Mind you I COULD mount Gauss, but the next issue kinda makes me hesitant:

The thing turns like the Titanic. AFTER hitting the iceberg. It has all the agility of the JumboJet suck in the hangar doors that it resembles. Horrible twist range and speed, and worse arm reflex. This thing is 100 tons of dead mech waiting to happen if unsupported.

Mind you, I agree with the lack of agility. It is needed to balance the guns, like the Stalker and Banshee before it. But if you are a PUG, or think you will be able to go off hunting on your own, this is NOT the Mech for you. Unsupported, ANY decent Light or Medium jock will eat you alive, 100+ damage "alpha" or not.

If you drop in a group, and can have others cover your flanks, then this thing has the firepower of the Deathstar, and because of that, probably has a place in your TO&E.

Kinda wrong actually.


I got mine all mastered and it starting to turn far better and handle as well.

I ran on my Gold, 2 LRM15 2 UAC10 and 6 ERML, basically an Atlas, with literally the same hard point locations too. It ran very well.

Then on my other Prime (Gold mech is a separate prime mech so I have 2) I ran 2 LBX20 (can go arms only) with 2 ERLL in those arms (one crit left) and 4 MG in the torso. It ran 2 tons light because I ran out of room and I did everything to tonn up on that thing. Despite all that...the thing was a beast, first match I saw a ECM cicada....then I didn't. Blasted his legs out from under him in one shot, next match I did the same to a poor 20 ton light mech.

The thing handles just like an Atlas dose with a 300 eng, which is what I ran mostly in my Atlas, or a 325 sometimes. When Mastered the mech is fine, and you have to use the A's arm to get a Lower Arm Actuator (the only one you get) so you can track light mechs better with the lasers.



Those who are a well skilled pilot in an assault mech (aka anyone that didn't run a 350 in there atlas, like a smart person) will feel at home in this, since when you are a 100 ton death machine you should know how to handle your mech in any situation, even when against lights.