372 replies to this topic

[FaleBowt]

Where were all these 12-mans in the last few weeks? The unit I'm in has tried for several weeks to get the 12-man ques running and we've had very few bites (resulting in us getting other units/companies within our unit to run private matches). It hardly seems coincidental that there's such a resurgence of 12-mans now that they can play against less coordinated teams.

[DjPush]

Also... It is only the first day of the new patch. Of coarse teams are going to get on and try out the new drop options. Why do people complain after a couple hours of game play? There are always going to be days where things dont go your way. Give it some time before you give it a thumbs down.

[LiGhtningFF13]

Already saw PUGS smashing 12er groups, no lie!

[Nick Makiaveli]

XxEDGExX, on 02 July 2014 - 12:54 PM, said:

lol just launched a 2 man group and got pitted against a team of 12 clan wolf although we killed some but a coordinated 12 man group is gonna win 95% of the time

Well yea 6 to 1 is rough odds...oh wait, you had a 10 man with you. If you lose 95% of the time against those odds, you are the problem. IE making it 12-10....

[FaleBowt]

Green Mamba, on 02 July 2014 - 09:43 PM, said:

Drop Based Voip would fix this.(Almost all other Games have this)..They don't even need a Mic just listen to Commands is easier than typing

I agree it would help tremendously...not to 100% equality of a 12-man group (with a dedicated leader + understanding of each other's roles/loadout)...but it'd allow for enough coordination to make a significant difference.

[Firemage]

BoomDog, on 02 July 2014 - 09:21 PM, said:

I read every post, and I gotta say that this was like Christmas in July for me! ROFL...

True poetic justice.

When people would say it's not fair their 4 man has to face larger premades, but then want to just be able to play in the solo queue... I just cracked up laughing every time.

I don't mind my 2-4 man fighting 2-6ish man groups it's when the 8-10 group is crushing my 2 man the other random unorginzed pugs.

Green Mamba, on 02 July 2014 - 09:43 PM, said:

Drop Based Voip would fix this.(Almost all other Games have this)..They don't even need a Mic just listen to Commands is easier than typing

Never been a big fan of in game voice chat myself, i like sticking to text or private mumble, even if i do understand the advantages. edit Then again i have nightmares of pug leading 25s in wow.

Edited by Firemage, 02 July 2014 - 09:49 PM.

[Ismael]

It is obvious that MWO is a multiplayer game, I wonder why people try to play it solo and not looking for a unit to play with, There will never be the perfect balance and one side will have a disadvantage. I am happy with the patch. Now there are more possibilities to drop in various constellations. We had a drop of 7 together with 2 smaller groups against a 10 man Steiner group and it was nice fight that ended 12:10

Edited by Ismael, 02 July 2014 - 09:50 PM.

[Kekrebos]

FaleBowt, on 02 July 2014 - 09:45 PM, said:

Where were all these 12-mans in the last few weeks? The unit I'm in has tried for several weeks to get the 12-man ques running and we've had very few bites (resulting in us getting other units/companies within our unit to run private matches). It hardly seems coincidental that there's such a resurgence of 12-mans now that they can play against less coordinated teams.

Its because now people know they can get easy matches of 12 vs 4,3,3,2 or 12 vs 3,3,2,2,2 or whatever. Its the same people saying "go back to COD and stop crying" "go find more friends" or "MWO has always been about group play". We heard the same crap back in closed beta when there was the same thing (except you also could be in as a solo drop). The translation is that they want to play with their 11 friends and stomp on people with little to no challenge. If they really wanted the challenge they would of been there last week playing against you in the 12 man que.

[Felbombling]

I think I've got it figured out. The smaller groups are like a cackle of Hyenas that have been feasting on gazelle for the last eighteen months. Suddenly, a pride of Lions shows up at the watering hole, and the Hyenas are all, "Whoa... the matchmaker is totally screwed up!!"

[Kekrebos]

StaggerCheck, on 02 July 2014 - 09:51 PM, said:

I think I've got it figured out. The smaller groups are like a cackle of Hyenas that have been feasting on gazelle for the last eighteen months. Suddenly, a pride of Lions shows up at the watering hole, and the Hyenas are all, "Whoa... the matchmaker is totally screwed up!!"

Except its not a pride of lions, its a bigger cackle.

It ruins the play the most for people that are playing with one friend for a couple games and doesn't want to be bothered with big team nonsense and tryharding.

[FaleBowt]

DjPush, on 02 July 2014 - 09:47 PM, said:

Also... It is only the first day of the new patch. Of coarse teams are going to get on and try out the new drop options. Why do people complain after a couple hours of game play? There are always going to be days where things dont go your way. Give it some time before you give it a thumbs down.

I can accede to your statement...for the time being. It is early in it's release...and maybe increased activity by the larger units or some tweaking by the devs will make it predominantly larger groups vs larger groups and smaller vs smaller (with large vs smalls being a relativly rare exception). If so, then I'd applaud the implementation...even if my team gets smashed from time-to-time. The major problem I have is the frequency of these large vs smalls roflstomps. Only time will tell.

[Kyle Wright]

Rallog, on 02 July 2014 - 09:54 PM, said:

Except its not a pride of lions, its a bigger cackle.

It ruins the play the most for people that are playing with one friend for a couple games and doesn't want to be bothered with big team nonsense and tryharding.

So let me get this straight. Last major patch all you 2 man's and PUGS complained that teams should stay in group queues and private lobbies. So most of us did, but now that group sizes varying in size are allocate D together It's QQ because now you are actually having to fight as though your life depends on it. Not to mention teams that do private lobbies in 12's as the original group queues dried up can now run groups of any size to gain extra practice. Tell me why should groups be punished?

[Alexandrix]

Kyle Wright, on 02 July 2014 - 10:00 PM, said:

So let me get this straight. Last major patch all you 2 man's and PUGS complained that teams should stay in group queues and private lobbies. So most of us did, but now that group sizes varying in size are allocate D together It's QQ because now you are actually having to fight as though your life depends on it. Not to mention teams that do private lobbies in 12's as the original group queues dried up can now run groups of any size to gain extra practice. Tell me why should groups be punished?

Why should I be punished for just wanting to play a few games with my wife?

Please,tell me why we,a casual,non meta humping,non tryhard 2 man....should be lumped in with your large competitive groups?

[FaleBowt]

Kyle Wright, on 02 July 2014 - 10:00 PM, said:

So let me get this straight. Last major patch all you 2 man's and PUGS complained that teams should stay in group queues and private lobbies. So most of us did, but now that group sizes varying in size are allocate D together It's QQ because now you are actually having to fight as though your life depends on it. Not to mention teams that do private lobbies in 12's as the original group queues dried up can now run groups of any size to gain extra practice. Tell me why should groups be punished?

Tell me why smaller groups should be punished by going against these 12-mans? The private lobbies dried up the regular 12-man que (and I agree that they did to some degree)?...but if that were truely the case, please explain how there are now so many more 12-mans on the non-private ques. The mid-range groups aren't the problem, as they're just plus'd up 4-mans, it's the absolute coordinating capability of the 10-12 mans that skew the scales

Edited by FaleBowt, 02 July 2014 - 10:13 PM.

[Gyrok]

Rallog, on 02 July 2014 - 09:50 PM, said:

Its because now people know they can get easy matches of 12 vs 4,3,3,2 or 12 vs 3,3,2,2,2 or whatever. Its the same people saying "go back to COD and stop crying" "go find more friends" or "MWO has always been about group play". We heard the same crap back in closed beta when there was the same thing (except you also could be in as a solo drop). The translation is that they want to play with their 11 friends and stomp on people with little to no challenge. If they really wanted the challenge they would of been there last week playing against you in the 12 man que.

Actually, playing some 12 mans this evening, ran into a few 12 mans in pub queue, ran into some mixed 3x4 and 7+5 and 6+6 and other kinds of groups, and frankly depending on who you get it can go either way...

We literally dropped our 4x3 12 man against 3x4 mans that were 3 assaults + 1 heavy EACH. We were literally out tonned by 400-500+ tons, and while we put up a good fight, we ended up getting rolled because we did not have the raw firepower to burn down 3 atlases, 4 dire wolves, 2 warhawks and 2 timber wolves and a cataphract 3D...

Sorry, I see nothing to pity for the 2-4 mans, and I run those too...in fact, we postulated earlier that if you encountered a perfect storm of 6x2 man groups, you could literally drop a 4x3 12 man against 12 atlases or dire wolves. Which is a ridiculous proposition in and of itself.

Group queue is fine...

[Kekrebos]

Kyle Wright, on 02 July 2014 - 10:00 PM, said:

So let me get this straight. Last major patch all you 2 man's and PUGS complained that teams should stay in group queues and private lobbies. So most of us did, but now that group sizes varying in size are allocate D together It's QQ because now you are actually having to fight as though your life depends on it. Not to mention teams that do private lobbies in 12's as the original group queues dried up can now run groups of any size to gain extra practice. Tell me why should groups be punished?

No one should be punished. Right now small groups are seriously punished. There are only two groups happy right now, 10+ and solo. Thats it. This implementation is horrible. I don't see how people are saying its so wonderful can be happy. Its no challenge, or practice, to slap a bunch of 2 mans around in your 12 man. If there are more than 3 groups in the enemy team, and you have a 12 man and you lose more than 2 or 3 mechs you did something wrong. How is that fun for anyone? You should be acknowledging that there is a problem and asking for a solution. Do you want other people to not have fun? Other games have pulled off a very successful matchmaker in a similar game while still providing for groups, small groups, and solo. Why can't they make it good for everyone?

[NextGame]

I wish people would just ******* grow up

Solo: you *will* run into groups of 2-4. I promise you that you will continue to be as incompetent as ever regardless of what constraints you are playing against because: Groups were never the issue! It was you all along! Congratulations.

2-4: you will drop against 12 mans (like me and my buddy did yesterday evening). Man up and deal with it. Back up the larger groups in your team and play like you are in a team.

12 mans: Some of you will get found out and wiped by teams made from bunch of smaller groups. Too bad for you. How embarrassing. Better fix0r those tactics!


Next patch can we have in game c-bill fines for people whining about their own personal inability to play the game?

[Kekrebos]

Gyrok, on 02 July 2014 - 10:10 PM, said:

Actually, playing some 12 mans this evening, ran into a few 12 mans in pub queue, ran into some mixed 3x4 and 7+5 and 6+6 and other kinds of groups, and frankly depending on who you get it can go either way...

We literally dropped our 4x3 12 man against 3x4 mans that were 3 assaults + 1 heavy EACH. We were literally out tonned by 400-500+ tons, and while we put up a good fight, we ended up getting rolled because we did not have the raw firepower to burn down 3 atlases, 4 dire wolves, 2 warhawks and 2 timber wolves and a cataphract 3D...

Sorry, I see nothing to pity for the 2-4 mans, and I run those too...in fact, we postulated earlier that if you encountered a perfect storm of 6x2 man groups, you could literally drop a 4x3 12 man against 12 atlases or dire wolves. Which is a ridiculous proposition in and of itself.

Group queue is fine...

So in translation, you only lost when you were out tonned in one match by 500 tons. And you don't see a problem there. At all. Seriously.

[Gyrok]

Rallog, on 02 July 2014 - 10:12 PM, said:

So in translation, you only lost when you were out tonned in one match by 500 tons. And you don't see a problem there. At all. Seriously.

We did not just lose...we lost 12-5!!! We did not have enough firepower...

We also ran into a SwK 7 man with a 5 man with them and lost...that one had some serious players on the other side though...Twinky Overlord and Antonius Rex and most of the really good SwK players...did not recognize a single name from the 5 man though...we had 8-9 bondsman in our 12 man drop...so we figured it would be pretty fair. They are still learning the game, and what better way to teach them than to have them learn against the pub queue.

We may be wolves, but we do not feed our recruits to the wolves by tossing them into top tier comp drops.

Edited by Gyrok, 02 July 2014 - 10:17 PM.

[Kyle Wright]

I'll agree that 2 man's should stuck in the solo queues. But at the same time without 2 man's then there is no point to 2-10 man's drops as you need 2 random to make a 12.

As far as your attempt at a tryhard barb. Maybe you should seek out a group willing to let you play a couple and learn more about the game. The reason why people like yourself complain about units/teams is cause we actually play this game as a military style sim. Using real tactics and real communications. Do you even know what the current meta is? Or are you some schmuck who things anything with a ac20 and JJ'S is meta?

I'm not sorry if this offends you, because I'm sick of giving ground to people that play maybe couple hours a week. This game is " the thinking man's shooter". People for years begged for larger groups to comeback. Well its here, and now they have to live with it. I won't feel sorry stomping people with guys from my unit cause we are equally tired of dealing with weekend warrior type pugs that make pass poor decisions, cry about everything cause they got killed when they were on their own, and just flat out window lickers.