93 replies to this topic

[BLOOD WOLF]

that depends on how you define change. of course the word change does have a definition, and in a literal sense the game has changed. How much did it change that is the question.

"the act or instance of making or becoming different."

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 11 July 2014 - 04:20 AM.

[NextGame]

BLOOD WOLF, on 11 July 2014 - 02:10 AM, said:

you do realize the world does not work on magic? so if you can magically make Cw the first feature ever, do you not realize how bad it would have been? We would not have had an actually game, instead we would have had a mess. or probably still would be waiting for something to be released while having nothing to play at all.

So what you are saying is that we would have a mess that included CW rather than the current mess that doesnt?

[BLOOD WOLF]

NextGame, on 11 July 2014 - 04:30 AM, said:

So what you are saying is that we would have a mess that included CW rather than the current mess that doesnt?

no that is not what I was trying to convey. In other words that is not what I was saying.

Is your reading comprehension sub-par?

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 11 July 2014 - 04:36 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Would have been nice.

Then people would be QQing about only having like, 4 mechs to play it with.

Because people will always find a reason to QQ.

It didn't happen, we don't possess a Delorean

or a Flux Capacitor

So what good is it

living in the past?

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 11 July 2014 - 05:33 AM.

[NextGame]

BLOOD WOLF, on 11 July 2014 - 04:33 AM, said:

no that is not what I was trying to convey. In other words that is not what I was saying.

Is your reading comprehension sub-par?

My reading comprehension is world class. Unfortunately some of the tripe I have lowered myself to read on here from certain rose tint bespectacled users is not worth making any effort to "comprehend" (read: empathise with or consider).

Edited by NextGame, 11 July 2014 - 04:42 AM.

[Karamarka]

NextGame, on 11 July 2014 - 04:40 AM, said:

My reading comprehension is world class. Unfortunately some of the tripe I have to read on here from certain rose tint bespectacled users is not worth making any effort to "comprehend" (read: empathise with or consider).

LMAO!

[BLOOD WOLF]

NextGame, on 11 July 2014 - 04:40 AM, said:

My reading comprehension is world class. Unfortunately some of the tripe I have to read on here from certain rose tint bespectacled users is not worth making any effort to "comprehend" (read: empathise with or consider).

sad, even your post I take my time to read. So i can respond with certainty that I understand what I have read.

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 11 July 2014 - 04:45 AM.

[Karl Marlow]

Maybe they should've or maybe they shouldn't have. They didn't so it doesn't really matter either way now. It's being developed now Lets deal with what actually is instead of what wasn't.

[The Basilisk]

There is a lot what PGI should have done before beeing so audaciously greedy with their Mech sales.
The normal mode of operation for creating a game would be getting funds for the project,
( QQ on since this is what pinky googles and white knighters will say to every non idealized version of sad sad facts )
either from a publisher or from some founding program wich should have been the founders sales at the beginning of MWO who are still neglected and ignored in every possible way by PGI,
then getting the engine, database and corefeatures up and running while in alpha mode.
Then doing some betatesting and then.......much later fire up the advertiment section to get some players in open beta and laying the fundament for the community.
In the meantime one could start some sales to farm the impatient ones.

What PGI did was simply renting and modifying a preconfigured cryengine, some servers and slapping some XML database coding on it, then adding some work with a 3D modeling program to get some mechs.
Thats it.
Thats the real state of the game at the moment.
They 've got a background database and modified Cryengine running some mechs and maps on it.
Oh yea I forgot UI 2.0 realy a core feature.

And what they are also doing is collecting loads of cash with promises that where broken already 3 sales before.

See just facts, no QQ here.
Just
sad
little
facts.

But anyway, maybe sometimes they have collected enough money to create an actual game that is more than a shooter demonstrator with some kind of crappy random map selector and a barely functioning matchmaker. Lets be honest even MW4 which was primary a singleplayer had more multiplayer options to create matches and even own maps.

Oh well, I still got hopes and will play from time to time.

Edited by The Basilisk, 11 July 2014 - 05:07 AM.

[BLOOD WOLF]

BLOOD WOLF, on 11 July 2014 - 02:10 AM, said:

you do realize the world does not work on magic? so if you can magically make Cw the first feature ever, do you not realize how bad it would have been? We would not have had an actually game, instead we would have had a mess. or probably still would be waiting for something to be released while having nothing to play at all.

I meant that if we could have changed the cycle of work and try to keep up. Lets say the december 17th 2013 patch included CW or the frame at least. It would have been so bad,that the community would have been in the biggest uproar we would have ever seen. Maybe so, or maybe not, but It would have not been good. It would have been lack luster or barely functionable. Then we would still be here, but the only differnce would be that we would have a CW that is not functionalbe or missing many key elements.

Was that so hard? Guess it takes you too much effort to understand what I am saying. Must really make your head hurt doesn't it. Unlike you I would never tell someone their words are not worth comprehending. I may disagree and respond in kind but i would say no such thing.

Anyway, it is like i said, take any one of the major release dates we have had so far and replace it with what you think CW is or is gonna work. I am certain that It would have been a colossal failure, and we would have had to wait as long as it took to develop Ui 2.0. I have no doubt they would have tried to work on it to no success

NextGame, on 11 July 2014 - 04:40 AM, said:

My reading comprehension is world class. Unfortunately some of the tripe I have lowered myself to read on here from certain rose tint bespectacled users is not worth making any effort to "comprehend" (read: empathise with or consider).

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 11 July 2014 - 05:12 AM.

[BLOOD WOLF]

You have to look at sales as a two way street. Just to make this clear I am not talking about the founders program. Whenever they put up a sale, it just sits their until somebody buys it. They can make a sale but they can not force people to buy anything. Unless they are taking money from my bank, but I doubt that. Even with founders, or anything being sold it is up to the person to make that final decision. So ultimately when you attack you end up hitting yourself, and everyone else who either has no problem with sales or bought into them.

An example is the Kit fox sale. If you call it a stupid sale and a greedy one at that, what do you say about the person who bought one or paid MC.

Are players stupid because they got one? or are they greedy because the wanted one early. Or they know PGi is greedy and does constant sales to make money and have no qualms in spending. there are many more angles I can approach this from and there is no clear answer. Just because there is no clear answer does not mean that you have to be unreasonable in you answer. I am curious.

Just food for thought.

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 11 July 2014 - 05:23 AM.

[Javin]

I am still looking forward to the dream of CW. It may actually arrive one day.

[Karamarka]

The Basilisk, on 11 July 2014 - 04:57 AM, said:

They 've got a background database and modified Cryengine running some mechs and maps on it.

Hehe, the mod mechwarrior Living Legends? I think had Aircraft, Tanks and Battle armor. Also it had way better maps because the LRM system was much better (line of sight required like MW4) and that was on the Cryengine 1, not Cryengine 3.

The Basilisk, on 11 July 2014 - 04:57 AM, said:

crappy random map selector and a barely functioning matchmaker. Lets be honest even MW4 which was primary a singleplayer had more multiplayer options to create matches and even own maps.

MW4: Vengeance had awesome desert maps, and also LRM's required Line of Sight which meant their wasn't stupid rock formations and "arena" styled maps we have right now.

Seriously, if you built a stadium with seats around every map (except alpine) it would actually suit the maps and not look out of place - it's like we are in a paintball arena.

Edited by Karamarka, 11 July 2014 - 05:23 AM.

[Fut]

The Basilisk, on 11 July 2014 - 04:57 AM, said:

There is a lot what PGI should have done before beeing so audaciously greedy with their Mech sales.

It's hard to fault them for cranking out the Mechs, as it is such a massive part of the game. Everybody and their grandmother has their own favourite Chassis, so it makes sense to continually pump them out - you never know, that next new Mech might bring in a hundred new customers, right?

Having said that though, the part that really bugs me (and I assume dozens of other people here) is the fact that they claimed to have been working on CW a few times now, and each time it turns out that they haven't done **** for it. That's just not right. Makes the entire company and game come off as really douchey.

I've wanted to imagine the dudes at PGI as die hard MechWarrior/Battletech fans, who are trying to make the best possible game they can, but as time marches on it's becoming clear that this isn't the case. They're just normal people who have jobs that just happen to be making a game that I enjoy and want to succeed. Really, if this was my company and my game-baby, I'd be working through the night and on weekends to add new **** to this game. Wouldn't matter if I wasn't making any OT, it'd be worth it. ****, I mean, most days at my actual job I kill at least an hour reading through these forums or watching videos about MWO (Shh... Don't tell my boss). How can somebody who's supposed to be doing things for MWO not want to do it around the clock?

Dunno, suppose I'm just trying to say that there really isn't any excuse for the complete lack of CW or CW related information/graphic sneak peeks..etc.

Edited by Fut, 11 July 2014 - 05:29 AM.

[Thorn Hallis]

Karamarka, on 11 July 2014 - 05:22 AM, said:

MW4: Vengeance had awesome desert maps, and also LRM's required Line of Sight which meant their wasn't stupid rock formations and "arena" styled maps we have right now.

Thats not entirely true. You did not need to see the target, all you need was a position that was "higher" then whatever the target was standing behind.

Fut, on 11 July 2014 - 05:25 AM, said:

Having said that though, the part that really bugs me (and I assume dozens of other people here) is the fact that they claimed to have been working on CW a few times now, and each time it turns out that they haven't done **** for it. That's just not right. Makes the entire company and game come off as really douchey.

I guess they have a different definition of the word "work". Similar to university students definition of the word "study".

Fut, on 11 July 2014 - 05:25 AM, said:

I've wanted to imagine the dudes at PGI as die hard MechWarrior/Battletech fans, who are trying to make the best possible game they can, but as time marches on it's becoming clear that this isn't the case. They're just normal people who have jobs that just happen to be making a game that I enjoy and want to succeed.

I don't know, I do think they put their hearts and souls into MWO. But their resources and abilities seem to be limited, up to the point that the game couldn't be any different then now, no matter what path they would have taken.

Edited by Thorn Hallis, 11 July 2014 - 05:40 AM.

[CaptainDeez]

I'm wondering how this game would have a clan "war" when it only has 10 unique maps...

[cleghorn6]

Ok, so for those who have no idea about software development, what we have been playing these last 2 years is the "in progress" game. For a typical AAA title, we would not even know that this existed yet. We would perhaps be starting to get the first marketing "leaks" or "exclusives" at this point in development.

From what I understand, PGI spent a couple of years trying to get someone to fund that game, which is where the MW5 trailer came from. No one bought it. No one was willing to commit the 30 or 40 million dollars it would have cost to bring that game to market, if they cut it to the bone. Keeping in mind that CoD4 cost over 200 million to develop and market. And that was (pretty much) just updating the art and doing a search replace for 3 and 4. No significant engine development.

So PGI, probably against better judgement, decided that there WAS a market for a new Battletech game and by gum they were going to do it. They got IGP to commit 5 million, made a couple more from Founders and went FTP/MMO as a pricing model.

If you want to stump up 25 million odd dollars (cheaper because you don't need to market/advertise it) to hire a development company for 3 years to make the exact game you want, in the order that you want it made, to your exact specifications, then go for it. Put a date in your calendar for July 2017 (better make it September, software is notoriously difficult to schedule accurately), invite some of your friends over, I'm sure you'll have a rocking time.

Until then, stop second guessing decisions you know nothing about and play the game in front of you. Or not. Whatever.

[BLOOD WOLF]

CaptainDeez, on 11 July 2014 - 05:43 AM, said:

I'm wondering how this game would have a clan "war" when it only has 10 unique maps...

That is actually my biggest concern for CW.

[Sable]

While i do agree with the idea that a good base is always the best choice when developing a game, i have to disagree with what the base is in his opinion. While community warfare will be a big part of MWO's longterm success and will provide an overall purpose to the fighting... The fighting itself, improving my skills, coming up with new mech designs, this is what i do every day and it's enjoyble.

Working towards a longterm goal can help keep people motivated to play. But the actual act of playing the game is where the fun is to be had. I'm glad they have chosen to provide a solid match experience while they work on their longterm goals. We have solid gameplay with relatively low bugs and glitches. I'm happy to keep doing what i'm doing until their's a galaxy map or solaris VII. Which even when that is all developed we'll still be doing the same thing we are now, fighting other mechs.

[Kilo 40]

cleghorn6, on 11 July 2014 - 05:44 AM, said:

Ok, so for those who have no idea about software development, what we have been playing these last 2 years is the "in progress" game. For a typical AAA title, we would not even know that this existed yet. We would perhaps be starting to get the first marketing "leaks" or "exclusives" at this point in development.

From what I understand, PGI spent a couple of years trying to get someone to fund that game, which is where the MW5 trailer came from. No one bought it. No one was willing to commit the 30 or 40 million dollars it would have cost to bring that game to market, if they cut it to the bone. Keeping in mind that CoD4 cost over 200 million to develop and market. And that was (pretty much) just updating the art and doing a search replace for 3 and 4. No significant engine development.

So PGI, probably against better judgement, decided that there WAS a market for a new Battletech game and by gum they were going to do it. They got IGP to commit 5 million, made a couple more from Founders and went FTP/MMO as a pricing model.

If you want to stump up 25 million odd dollars (cheaper because you don't need to market/advertise it) to hire a development company for 3 years to make the exact game you want, in the order that you want it made, to your exact specifications, then go for it. Put a date in your calendar for July 2017 (better make it September, software is notoriously difficult to schedule accurately), invite some of your friends over, I'm sure you'll have a rocking time.

Until then, stop second guessing decisions you know nothing about and play the game in front of you. Or not. Whatever.

all that combined with the fact that they now had to make a completely different game then they were used to, AND have to do it with an audience.

normally a company can try a design, test it, throw it our, reimplement it later, throw it out again etc.. all with out the public knowing about it. but not here. with games like this anything ever said by the devs is taken by the public as set in stone gospel, and any delay or change in a design is "a literal lie" to many in the community.

They've screwed up at times sure, but when you put it in perspective they've done a lot, with very little, in a tough situation.