58 replies to this topic

[mogs01gt]

Nightmare1, on 25 July 2014 - 07:04 AM, said:

Shadow Hawks are an awesome Mech! They offer a diverse amount of load-out options and are tough fighters with an excellent degree of maneuverability. You can't go wrong with them.
Agreed, except that my favorites are the 4G and 4H.
Hunchback is probably the most newb-friendly Mech out there, and remains a dependable workhorse. It's been nerfed by recent patches, but remains a classic Mech with a lot of options.
If you're having trouble learning the mechanics of the game, go with the Hunchie. If you feel that you have a good handle on MWO, then go with the Shadowhawk. Either way, you won't regret it!

Im going to refrain from starting a Hunchie discussion but IMO Hunchies are more for vet pilots anymore since 55 tonners(Clan and IS) are extremely potent.

IMO only 55 tonners are worth the cbill investment for new players when they want mediums.

[Nightmare1]

mogs01gt, on 25 July 2014 - 07:09 AM, said:

Im going to refrain from starting a Hunchie discussion but IMO Hunchies are more for vet pilots anymore since 55 tonners(Clan and IS) are extremely potent.

IMO only 55 tonners are worth the cbill investment for new players when they want mediums.

*Rolling eyes*

You're going to refrain from starting a Hunchie discussion but then go and throw chum out in the water? Bravo!

Yes, the 55 tonners are potent, but many of them are also more difficult to pilot for newbs. The Shadowhawk is pretty well balanced and makes a good starting Mech. I only suggested the Hunchie to the OP in the event that he/she is having trouble with game mechanics. The OP may not yet be ready for JJs and the extra heat management.

Overall, my recommendation stands as such:
First Choice: Shadowhawks
Second Choice: Hunchbacks

I haven't piloted the Wolverine or Griffins, so I can't say anything about their handling qualities. I just know that I don't see much of either one, and that the ones I do see appear to be disarmed quite easily.

Remember mogs01gt, this isn't a thread about the venerable Hunchback and it's pros and cons. This is simply a thread by some asking which Medium the general public would recommend. If you want to debate the Hunchie, it might be best to revisit the other sub-thread.

[EyeOne]

mogs01gt, on 25 July 2014 - 07:09 AM, said:

Im going to refrain from starting a Hunchie discussion but IMO Hunchies are more for vet pilots anymore since 55 tonners(Clan and IS) are extremely potent.

Thanks, because you and me have already worn that topic out.

Nightmare1, on 25 July 2014 - 07:16 AM, said:

*Rolling eyes*

You're going to refrain from starting a Hunchie discussion but then go and throw chum out in the water? Bravo!

Mogs loves to hate on the Huncbacks for newbies

[Jman5]

I'll echo the sentiment here that the shadowhawk is a good choice for your medium. The hardpoints are flexible and diverse enough to let you try any number of weapon systems/combos. There are jumpjets to allow you to experiment with those. It also has a high mounted weapon in the torso to let you shoot easier.

[mogs01gt]

EyeOne, on 25 July 2014 - 07:23 AM, said:

Mogs loves to hate on the Huncbacks for newbies

I do!!!


I was piloting my 2d2 last night,,,gawd what a pig compared to the Griffin!

Edited by mogs01gt, 25 July 2014 - 07:52 AM.

[EyeOne]

mogs01gt, on 25 July 2014 - 07:50 AM, said:

I do!!!


I was piloting my 2d2 last night,,,gawd what a pig compared to the Griffin!

I'm not sure I've piloted my Shadowhawks more than 10 times since the Griffins dropped.

btw, our team was terrible last night.

[mogs01gt]

EyeOne, on 25 July 2014 - 07:55 AM, said:

I'm not sure I've piloted my Shadowhawks more than 10 times since the Griffins dropped.
btw, our team was terrible last night.

That was my first drop in my 2d2 in a long time, by the time I had my weapons in the right grouping and could shoot the enemy, it was over...two teammates running into the middle of Mordor was just bad.. Then the one dude went and hid in a volcano and powered down....it was a 9-12 match..

I switched back to the Grif after that. I really hate the Shawk lack of agility.

Edited by mogs01gt, 25 July 2014 - 07:59 AM.

[Bigbacon]

no Kintaro love?

big XL engine, lots of SRMs and a LL (or 2) or a few MLs you get a 100k/hr 50-60 alpha smashing boat of destruction or a nice quintuple LRM5 mobile LRM streamer.

Edited by Bigbacon, 04 August 2014 - 07:33 AM.

[Escef]

Bigbacon, on 04 August 2014 - 07:32 AM, said:

no Kintaro love?

big XL engine, lots of SRMs and a LL (or 2) or a few MLs you get a 100k/hr 50-60 alpha smashing boat of destruction or a nice quintuple LRM5 mobile LRM streamer.

The Kintaro's lack of jets makes the SHD-2D2 or any of the Griffins look like a better choice.

[IraqiWalker]

Escef, on 04 August 2014 - 03:57 PM, said:

The Kintaro's lack of jets makes the SHD-2D2 or any of the Griffins look like a better choice.

True, in some ways, but the KTO has pretty decent hitboxes, and with hill climb, it has little trouble navigating most maps. Thus freeing up the tonnage occupied by the 3 or 4 JJs in other mechs, for more DHS, armor, or ammo (AMS is presumed to be mounted, as almost all mechs should have it.)

[Blue Drache]

No love for the 3M Cicada?

Sure ... no JJ but it carries ECM!

I kit mine out with a beefy engine and two ERLLs

Edited by Blue Drache, 04 August 2014 - 04:13 PM.

[LiGhtningFF13]

I would definately recommend the Shadow Hawk, the Griffin and the good old Hunchback! So lots of options to choose from.

[The Trumpet of Gabriel]

I would respectfully submit that while the Hunchbacks are not as competitive as the 55 tonners, the different variants allow a new player to learn almost every role available in the game. You have the AC brawlers in the G and H models, an effective lrm skirmisher in the J, a laser boat brawler/fire support mech in the P, and a srm brawler in the S.

I also love my wolverine 7K and 6R. Very mobile and can pack a punch. They may not be meta capable, but are a lot of fun. The 6k is ok I guess, but having the majority of your firepower in one arm is somewhat limiting.

I don't know if I would recommend a blackjack for a new player, but the JJ capable variants can be fun and effective.

Centurions can be fun, and are good for learning to use a shield side, but require a higher skill level to be competitive in the current state of the game.

I've found the Griffins to be somewhat challenging for my play style, but mobility is excellent as is the narrow side profile.

I don't have any experience with the Shawk so on that topic, no comment.

Edited by Sword of Morning, 22 August 2014 - 12:28 PM.

[Escef]

Sword of Morning, on 04 August 2014 - 04:45 PM, said:

I would respectfully submit that while the Hunchbacks are not as competitive as the 55 tonners, but the different variants allow a new player to learn almost every role available in the game. You have the AC brawlers in the G and H models, an effective lrm skirmisher in the J, a laser boat brawler/fire support mech in the P, and a srm brawler in the S.

...

I don't have any experience with the Shawk so on that topic, no comment.

Pretty much the only thing you can do in a Hunch that you can't do in a SHD-2H, 2D, or 2D2 is boat energy. Any one of those 3 can be an AC brawler, LRM skirmisher, or SRM brawler. Any one of those 3 replaces the HBK-4G, H, J, and S capably. The lower number of energy hardpoints for most of the SHDs is compensated by the presence of jump jets. The only Hunchie that offers a trick that you can't well replicate on a SHD is the 4P. And I'll admit, all those lasers are a nice trick (though my preferred energy boats are all BattleMasters). Another thing to keep in mind with the HBK is that the Hunch is difficult to protect, which is an issue for the 4G, H, J, and P. In fact, protecting the Hunch is more difficult than twisting up the CN9's shield arm, IMX.

I've seen people get good results from Hunchies, so I know they can perform, but they are far from the easiest mechs to learn with.

Edited by Escef, 04 August 2014 - 05:18 PM.

[The Trumpet of Gabriel]

Like I said before, I don't have any experience with the Shawk so I won't argue with you. I will say though that the Hunchies are relatively inexpensive to acquire and equip. I admit though that you have to be very careful about exposing yourself with the size of that hunch. However, the J is much improved from the earlier model. I think part of my attachment to them is just nostalgia, but hey.... to each his own

Edited by Sword of Morning, 04 August 2014 - 05:33 PM.

[IraqiWalker]

Escef, on 04 August 2014 - 05:17 PM, said:

Pretty much the only thing you can do in a Hunch that you can't do in a SHD-2H, 2D, or 2D2 is boat energy. Any one of those 3 can be an AC brawler, LRM skirmisher, or SRM brawler. Any one of those 3 replaces the HBK-4G, H, J, and S capably. The lower number of energy hardpoints for most of the SHDs is compensated by the presence of jump jets. The only Hunchie that offers a trick that you can't well replicate on a SHD is the 4P. And I'll admit, all those lasers are a nice trick (though my preferred energy boats are all BattleMasters). Another thing to keep in mind with the HBK is that the Hunch is difficult to protect, which is an issue for the 4G, H, J, and P. In fact, protecting the Hunch is more difficult than twisting up the CN9's shield arm, IMX.

I've seen people get good results from Hunchies, so I know they can perform, but they are far from the easiest mechs to learn with.

Do we really want to make this a discussion about the venerable hunchie?

I'll put my two cents on that subject in the spoiler

In short, the hunchie is a great starter mech, I personally recommend it more than the SHD, partly because it DOESN'T have Jump Jets.

Spoiler

First off, the hunchback is ground bound, it teaches the player to use terrain properly, added to that benefit, is the fact, that switching from it to a JJ capable mech is significantly easier on the pilot than the other way around.

Another great advantage for the hunchback is the fact that it has a short profile, meaning it can take great advantage of most cover locations out there. It also teaches the player how to use terrain better and fight properly in urban environments.

The uneven hitboxes for the right torso on the ones with hunches allow for extreme armor modification (2 on the rear, and the rest on the front), while also teaching the pilot how to torso twist. Something you clearly don't learn that well in a SHD since the hitboxes are so even, and not as easy to hit.

Then, there's how fantastically nimble the HBK chassis is. It can shoot directly behind it without a problem, it can torso twist like crazy, and it has a very smooth turn.

Plus, every single variant of it can teach the pilot a lot. Totaling up to every role in the game aside from poptart. The mech is extremely versatile.

That is why the HBK-4SP is my personal first recommendation since it can pack great firepower with good speed and incredible maneuverability and nimbleness. It also has all hardpoint types allowing the pilot to experiment freely. Once the pilot is proficient enough with it, they can move on to one of the fully hunched variants, and learn the skills of torso twisting.

Last, but not least, they love STD engines, which are very affordable, allowing new pilots to outfit them more easily. Instead of farming for an XL 300 that costs more than some mediums.

Most of what I mentioned up there can't be done that well with the SHD, or just can't be done at all.

[Escef]

Sword of Morning, on 04 August 2014 - 05:26 PM, said:

Like I said before, I don't have any experience with the Shawk so I won't argue with you. I will say though that the Hunchies are relatively inexpensive to acquire and equip. I admit though that you have to be very careful about exposing yourself with the size of that hunch. The J is much improved though from the earlier model. I think part of my attachment to them is just nostalgia, but hey.... to each his own

I tried the Hunchies after cutting my teeth on the CN9s. Ugh... Just ugh.

As for the SHDs, I had really low expectations for them, as in table top they are at best kinda meh. When Project Phoenix hit I was shocked at how good the SHDs were.

[IraqiWalker]

Escef, on 04 August 2014 - 05:30 PM, said:

I tried the Hunchies after cutting my teeth on the CN9s. Ugh... Just ugh.

As for the SHDs, I had really low expectations for them, as in table top they are at best kinda meh. When Project Phoenix hit I was shocked at how good the SHDs were.

in TT they had stock armor, which was really low. Like cicadas-were-the-heralds-of-doom low.

the SHD-2D had 144 armor. That's low for a light.

2D2 had 208 ... etc.

Compared to the Kintaros rocking over 300 at almost all times.

Wolverines at around 350 on average.

and TBTs on 240+ across most variants.

Keep in mind, this is using MW:O armor values. It's actually half that for TT (the SHD 2D had 72 armor total)

[mogs01gt]

Bigbacon, on 04 August 2014 - 07:32 AM, said:

no Kintaro love?
big XL engine, lots of SRMs and a LL (or 2) or a few MLs you get a 100k/hr 50-60 alpha smashing boat of destruction or a nice quintuple LRM5 mobile LRM streamer.

I think people complain because they are a walking CT.

[IraqiWalker]

mogs01gt, on 05 August 2014 - 05:22 AM, said:

I think people complain because they are a walking CT.

Which is why they are XL friendly. Unlike SHDs which have very balanced hitboxes.