81 replies to this topic

[Angel of Annihilation]

I have a feeling that I have a rant about to come on.

I run a 5 JJ Heavy Metal and the fact I could mount 5 JJs on an Assault and jump around like a Spider on Crack was one of the big reasons I purchased that mech. I think it had some outstanding 62m jump distance on it or something crazy like that.

If I log on tonight when I get home and the thing is nerfed to all hell, I am going to be pissed off like you can't imagine.

I understand penalizing for mounting 1-2 JJs because being able to jump at all with that few of JJs was always abolutely ridiculous. Also If I recall right, TT construction rules required enough JJs to be mounted to match a mechs walking MP so even an assault with a 3 hex range, had to mount a minimum of 3 JJs if it wanted to mount any at all.

However, there should be abolutely ZERO penality for mounting max JJs. On my Heavy Metal I have to devote 10 fricken tons to JJs to get good jumping capability. That is a ****-ton worth of weapons and heat sink weight I have to give up to be able to jump well. That in and of itself is penalty enough. If your going to screw with my ability to jump by penalizing the fact I am an assault, well I want my damn JJs to weigh 0.5 tons each then.

Let do an exercise. Lets assign 1 thrust to every 0.5 tons of JJ weight.

A Spider weighing 30 tons running 5 JJ at 0.5 tons each has 5 thrust. A Heavy Metal weighing 90 tons and mounting 5 JJs at 2 tons each would have a 20 thrust. If 5 thrust can get a 30 ton Spider 20m into the air, then 20 thrust, 4 times the amount, should be able to get a mech weighing 3 times as much as the Spider at least 20m into the air and probably more like 25m.

[XX Sulla XX]

Last night my TW with 4 jump jets said jump distance 21.5 I think. Today it says 16.8. Did a test and with 5 JJs its 21m now.


My Victor 9s with 4 jump jets shows 23.9 today I forgot to check it last night. So did clans or just TWs just get an extra special jump jet nerf?

Just checked and my Cat 3D with 4 jump jets is 18m. So ya seems like the TW with the largest engine of the 3 and same number of jump jets has the smallest jump distance at 16.8.



As always jumping brawlers are the red headed step children of the MWO

Edited by XX Sulla XX, 15 July 2014 - 02:06 PM.

[Karamarka]

Deathlike, on 15 July 2014 - 01:19 PM, said:

TBH, I disagree.

For instance, I run 3 JJs on the 3D, and prior to the patch, it had minimal problems getting up to the Citadel from the water (I'm talking about the D3 side). Post-patch, I need to use the unflooded platform to get the necessary lift. 4 seems to do the trick, but it's a clear nerf.

For the Victor, 4 JJs were more than enough prior to the patch. Now, it's getting "tight" to say the least to get there.

Prior to the patch, 2 JJs on a LIght (Jenner+Firestarter) were enough to clear the the platform. Now, it's "tight".

Overall, it's a nerf. Don't let the mechlab figures fool you. Contextual distance matters.

Agreed, everyone keeps telling me how the nova got buffed cause on mech lab it says 33 instead of 27.

get real, in game you are humping buildings to even get over them.... or hills

And that has FIVE YES FIVE JJ you cant even take off.

Edited by Karamarka, 15 July 2014 - 01:42 PM.

[DAYLEET]

No need to jump over building.

I always thought it was stupid to have people hit jj and never realese it and then hit the ground without exploding into a ball of fire. Maybe the good pilot will separate themselves from the noobish, Maybe it will take "skills" to use jj. im glad.

Edited by DAYLEET, 15 July 2014 - 01:45 PM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Adiuvo, on 15 July 2014 - 11:47 AM, said:

Mechs that have all of them were basically buffed.

My 733C and Heavy Metal would disagree. They feel.... so bad. All 5 jump jets on a Heavy Metal doesn't feel thrusty at all, and is capped at 33m. I actually thought the Highlanders were fine where they were because they adjusted them hard the last time they adjusted thrust values.

Viktor Drake, on 15 July 2014 - 01:38 PM, said:

I have a feeling that I have a rant about to come on.

I run a 5 JJ Heavy Metal and the fact I could mount 5 JJs on an Assault and jump around like a Spider on Crack was one of the big reasons I purchased that mech. I think it had some outstanding 62m jump distance on it or something crazy like that.

If I log on tonight when I get home and the thing is nerfed to all hell, I am going to be pissed off like you can't imagine.

I understand penalizing for mounting 1-2 JJs because being able to jump at all with that few of JJs was always abolutely ridiculous. Also If I recall right, TT construction rules required enough JJs to be mounted to match a mechs walking MP so even an assault with a 3 hex range, had to mount a minimum of 3 JJs if it wanted to mount any at all.

However, there should be abolutely ZERO penality for mounting max JJs. On my Heavy Metal I have to devote 10 fricken tons to JJs to get good jumping capability. That is a ****-ton worth of weapons and heat sink weight I have to give up to be able to jump well. That in and of itself is penalty enough. If your going to screw with my ability to jump by penalizing the fact I am an assault, well I want my damn JJs to weigh 0.5 tons each then.

Let do an exercise. Lets assign 1 thrust to every 0.5 tons of JJ weight.

A Spider weighing 30 tons running 5 JJ at 0.5 tons each has 5 thrust. A Heavy Metal weighing 90 tons and mounting 5 JJs at 2 tons each would have a 20 thrust. If 5 thrust can get a 30 ton Spider 20m into the air, then 20 thrust, 4 times the amount, should be able to get a mech weighing 3 times as much as the Spider at least 20m into the air and probably more like 25m.

Oh.. its nerfed to hell and back, and then back to hell again. 33m max hops, with thrust that feels barely better then 2 JJs did prior to the patch. Its turrible.

[Bront]

Wait, so new JJs won't let you jump over things anymore? What's the point?

[willismaximus]

Just tried my Summoner, first match since patch. I can't believe how bad it is now. With 5 JJ, that I can never remove, I feel like I can barely get off the ground. The one saving grace for this Mech was its mobility, and now it's utterly trashed. If they wanted to make JJ power linear, fine . . . but use the max ratings as a baseline. I can barely clear another mech in height right now with 5 JJ, and that's using 100% of my fuel . . .

[Sean von Steinike]

Will one JJ still let you do quick turns? I haven't gotten on to try it yet.

[XX Sulla XX]

Ya even with 5 jump jets on my Timber Wolf I can just barely get over another mech. Seems like it needs to be adjusted to be between where it is now and where it was before and it would be just right.

[Felio]

The SDR-5V with 12 JJ may actually have more thrust now. I was clearing the walls in HPG Manifold more easily than before.

It also seems like there is more forward momentum.

This was on the Testing Grounds.

[pwnface]

1 JJ will still do quick turns but that is about it. If you can see over an obstacle 1JJ might allow you to actually shoot over it. If you can't see over it, sorry ur going to be hitting a wall all day.

[FupDup]

Jack Of Shadow, on 15 July 2014 - 03:59 PM, said:

I would estimate my 1 JJ catapult rose up an impressive 5-6 meters vertical...

You could jump over 3-4 entire humans standing on top of each other!

[Jack Of Shadow]

Bront, on 15 July 2014 - 02:18 PM, said:

Wait, so new JJs won't let you jump over things anymore? What's the point?

JJ are now ONLY good for pop tarting.

[Deathlike]

Just for datamining, JHunch (JMan5) dug up the #s:
http://www.reddit.co...numbers/ciydxkf

[Voranis]

I was afraid this might be the case. Summoner/Nova are going to take this hard as they are stuck with all that tonnage locked into JJ's they cannot modify.

[Kitane]

Max jump from what I remember:

40m Wolverines and Griffins
17m most Shadowhawks, that's the lowest I've seen.
~21m Timber Wolf
35m Victor
28m Highlander
28m Blackjack

[Zolaz]

How many JJs do you need in a Heavy in order to clear one level of elevation?

[Deathlike]

Zolaz, on 15 July 2014 - 05:21 PM, said:

How many JJs do you need in a Heavy in order to clear one level of elevation?

Define "one level".

I use the water to Citadel in River City as reference, so for the most part... 3 is bare min. 4 is more or less "enough". This is with a 3D.

[80sGlamRockSensation David Bowie]

Deathlike, on 15 July 2014 - 05:53 PM, said:

Define "one level".

I use the water to Citadel in River City as reference, so for the most part... 3 is bare min. 4 is more or less "enough". This is with a 3D.

Yep, the 3D requires max JJ (4) to even get any noticeable lift.

I don't even want to know what nothingness is given by 8-10tons worth of JJ's by the Highlander.

[Koniks]

Karamarka, on 15 July 2014 - 01:41 PM, said:

Agreed, everyone keeps telling me how the nova got buffed cause on mech lab it says 33 instead of 27.

get real, in game you are humping buildings to even get over them.... or hills

The net-effect of the changes was a nerf for mediums. They drastically cut initial thrust (Boost_Instant changed from 337.86 -> 120; 65% reduction) and slightly increased total lift (Boost_z changed from 39.3 -> 45; 14.5% increase).

Edited by Mizeur, 16 July 2014 - 02:10 AM.